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What constitutes a Christian denomination?

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  • What constitutes a Christian denomination?

    The vision of 30,000+ Christian sects in the US alone, all pointing at all the others and saying they aren't Christian enough, is illuminating. There is only one Truth, but over 30,000 disputing parties each have it, while all the others do not.

  • #2
    Originally posted by phank View Post
    The vision of 30,000+ Christian sects in the US alone, all pointing at all the others and saying they aren't Christian enough, is illuminating.
    IF that were true.

    There is only one Truth, but over 30,000 disputing parties each have it, while all the others do not.
    There's a whole bunch of us that focus on the essentials, and don't worry about the non-essentials.
    "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

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    • #3
      Originally posted by phank View Post
      The vision of 30,000+ Christian sects in the US alone, all pointing at all the others and saying they aren't Christian enough, is illuminating. There is only one Truth, but over 30,000 disputing parties each have it, while all the others do not.

      no, just no...
      "It's evolution; every time you invent something fool-proof, the world invents a better fool."
      -Unknown

      "Preach the gospel, and if necessary use words." - Most likely St.Francis


      I find that evolution is the best proof of God.
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      • #4
        Originally posted by phank View Post
        The vision of 30,000+ Christian sects in the US alone, all pointing at all the others and saying they aren't Christian enough, is illuminating. There is only one Truth, but over 30,000 disputing parties each have it, while all the others do not.
        Yeah, no. This is such a grossly misleading statement that I can't help but point it out, even though several people already commented on it.
        ~Formerly known as Chrawnus~

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        • #5
          Originally posted by phank View Post
          The vision of 30,000+ Christian sects in the US alone, all pointing at all the others and saying they aren't Christian enough, is illuminating. There is only one Truth, but over 30,000 disputing parties each have it, while all the others do not.
          To say that number is grossly inflated is an understatement. It is based on a radically open definition of what "denomination" is. For instance under the definition used to arrive at that number if there two independent Baptist churches on each side of the street, each one of them is considered a different denomination. In fact every independent Baptist church is deemed to be a different denomination by the definition used to arrive at this figure. In fact, IIRC, even within Catholicism, there are a number of "denominations."

          Further, every single Bible society or church club is considered to be a different denomination than the church or churches that it is affiliated with.

          If you want to understand just how ridiculous this figure is try to name just twenty Christian denominations from memory alone. If there were tens of thousands of them you shouldn't have any difficulty rattling off a hundred so a mere twenty ought to be a real breeze.

          I'm always still in trouble again

          "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
          "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

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          • #6
            Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
            If you want to understand just how ridiculous this figure is try to name just twenty Christian denominations from memory alone. If there were tens of thousands of them you shouldn't have any difficulty rattling off a hundred so a mere twenty ought to be a real breeze.
            I can rarely resist a challenge.

            Greek Orthodox
            Church of England, Anglican
            Church of Scotland
            Baptist
            Southern Baptist
            Methodist
            Roman Catholic
            7th Day Adventists
            Church of Jesus Christ of the latter day saints
            Unitarians
            Tai-ping (starting to scrape the barrel here)
            Westboro baptist
            Russian Orthodox
            Lutheran
            Christian Scientists
            Jehovah's witnesses
            Albigensians
            Dominicans
            Franciscans
            Trappists
            Knights Templar
            Order of St Stephen
            Dutch Protestant
            Church of Christ Computer Programmer
            Marcionites
            Revivalists
            Order of St Titus
            Mennonites
            Branch Davidians


            That's 29, but several of them are historical, and two are fictional. Still, I think I managed 20 from memory.

            It was hard.

            However, finding a few hundred shouldn't be a problem. Opening Brewer's at "Monk" immediately reminded me of the Benedictine order, as well as the Carthusians and Cistercians, and linked to the Augustinians and Carmelites, which led to the Catholic and Apostolic Church. Wikipedia lists dozens and dozens of them. It wouldn't surprise me if there actually were many thousands altogether.

            Roy
            Jorge: Functional Complex Information is INFORMATION that is complex and functional.

            mikewhitney: What if the speed of light changed when light is passing through water? ... I have 3 semesters of college Physics.

            Mountain Man: First of all, the Bible is a fixed document.
            Mountain Man: … this is how liberals argue these days, with labels instead of ideas.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Roy View Post
              I can rarely resist a challenge.

              Greek Orthodox
              Church of England, Anglican
              Church of Scotland
              Baptist
              Southern Baptist
              Methodist
              Roman Catholic
              7th Day Adventists
              Church of Jesus Christ of the latter day saints
              Unitarians
              Tai-ping (starting to scrape the barrel here)
              Westboro baptist
              Russian Orthodox
              Lutheran
              Christian Scientists
              Jehovah's witnesses
              Albigensians
              Dominicans
              Franciscans
              Trappists
              Knights Templar
              Order of St Stephen
              Dutch Protestant
              Church of Christ Computer Programmer
              Marcionites
              Revivalists
              Order of St Titus
              Mennonites
              Branch Davidians


              That's 29, but several of them are historical, and two are fictional. Still, I think I managed 20 from memory.

              It was hard.

              However, finding a few hundred shouldn't be a problem. Opening Brewer's at "Monk" immediately reminded me of the Benedictine order, as well as the Carthusians and Cistercians, and linked to the Augustinians and Carmelites, which led to the Catholic and Apostolic Church. Wikipedia lists dozens and dozens of them. It wouldn't surprise me if there actually were many thousands altogether.

              Roy


              Many of those are cult groups. Which shows your understanding of religion to be quite lacking. Try again...
              "The man from the yacht thought he was the first to find England; I thought I was the first to find Europe. I did try to found a heresy of my own; and when I had put the last touches to it, I discovered that it was orthodoxy."
              GK Chesterton; Orthodoxy

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              • #8
                Originally posted by lilpixieofterror View Post


                Many of those are cult groups. Which shows your understanding of religion to be quite lacking. Try again...
                Whether or not they are "cult groups," they're still denominations of Christianity.

                I'm more curious as to why he listed the Dominicans, Franciscans, Trappists, and other Roman Catholic religious orders as if they were denominations separate from Roman Catholicism.
                "[Mathematics] is the revealer of every genuine truth, for it knows every hidden secret, and bears the key to every subtlety of letters; whoever, then, has the effrontery to pursue physics while neglecting mathematics should know from the start he will never make his entry through the portals of wisdom."
                --Thomas Bradwardine, De Continuo (c. 1325)

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by lilpixieofterror View Post


                  Many of those are cult groups. Which shows your understanding of religion to be quite lacking. Try again...
                  TBF, I think the point was that there's nowhere NEAR the 30,000 that was claimed.
                  "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Boxing Pythagoras View Post
                    Whether or not they are "cult groups," they're still denominations of Christianity.
                    Ummm, only because they try to pretend they are. Christian Science is about as Christian as you are (have you ever read their theology?), the Mormons have an entire book and a prophet that makes 'new' revelations, WBC's theology is well... unique (to say the least), and the Jehovah's Witnesses also have written their own book and have their own 'unique theology'. If somebody is going to name off 'Christian Groups' (IE groups because many on the list are also not denominations, but groups), they might want to first define who they are calling 'Christian' and what they are defining as a 'denomination' because The Knight's Templar are about as much of a 'denomination' as the Masons are.

                    I'm more curious as to why he listed the Dominicans, Franciscans, Trappists, and other Roman Catholic religious orders as if they were denominations separate from Roman Catholicism.
                    Only people who don't understand the difference between orders and denominations, would say things like that.
                    "The man from the yacht thought he was the first to find England; I thought I was the first to find Europe. I did try to found a heresy of my own; and when I had put the last touches to it, I discovered that it was orthodoxy."
                    GK Chesterton; Orthodoxy

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                      TBF, I think the point was that there's nowhere NEAR the 30,000 that was claimed.
                      And to even reach close to that amount, you have to so loosely define 'denomination', that you have to count cult groups, groups that self identify as Christian (but don't identify as a denomination), fringe nutters, etc. People who make such claims about 'thousands of denominations' need to actually first define what a 'denomination' is and understand what makes a separate denomination (sometimes the only difference is focus or cultural group and no real difference between these groups actually exist).
                      "The man from the yacht thought he was the first to find England; I thought I was the first to find Europe. I did try to found a heresy of my own; and when I had put the last touches to it, I discovered that it was orthodoxy."
                      GK Chesterton; Orthodoxy

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Boxing Pythagoras View Post
                        Whether or not they are "cult groups," they're still denominations of Christianity.
                        I would hardly call Mormons, Unitarians or Jehovah's witnesses Christian denominations. And I have a hard time believing any orthodox denomination would accept them as such either.
                        ~Formerly known as Chrawnus~

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by lilpixieofterror View Post
                          Many of those are cult groups. Which shows your understanding of religion to be quite lacking. Try again...
                          Really? Which ones are cults? I'll grant you the Branch Davidians and Westboro Baptists are cults, but that's only two, not many. Even if you include the Albigensians and Jehovah's witnesses, it's still not many.

                          So which ones are cults? Or is it your own knowledge of religion that is lacking? I'd be extremely surprised if you even recognised all the names, let alone knew anything about them.

                          Not that it really matters whether they're cults or not, they're still Christian denominations - and one person's cult is another person's religion.

                          Roy
                          Jorge: Functional Complex Information is INFORMATION that is complex and functional.

                          mikewhitney: What if the speed of light changed when light is passing through water? ... I have 3 semesters of college Physics.

                          Mountain Man: First of all, the Bible is a fixed document.
                          Mountain Man: … this is how liberals argue these days, with labels instead of ideas.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Boxing Pythagoras View Post
                            I'm more curious as to why he listed the Dominicans, Franciscans, Trappists, and other Roman Catholic religious orders as if they were denominations separate from Roman Catholicism.
                            Mainly because although they are subsets of the Catholic church there are differences in their beliefs and teachings. For example, Franciscans follow the teachings of Francis of Assisi, but mainstream Catholics may not.

                            Roy
                            Jorge: Functional Complex Information is INFORMATION that is complex and functional.

                            mikewhitney: What if the speed of light changed when light is passing through water? ... I have 3 semesters of college Physics.

                            Mountain Man: First of all, the Bible is a fixed document.
                            Mountain Man: … this is how liberals argue these days, with labels instead of ideas.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Chrawnus View Post
                              I would hardly call Mormons, Unitarians or Jehovah's witnesses Christian denominations. And I have a hard time believing any orthodox denomination would accept them as such either.
                              They accept the NT as scripture, follow the teachings of Jesus and believe he was the son of God. How are they not Christian?

                              Roy
                              Jorge: Functional Complex Information is INFORMATION that is complex and functional.

                              mikewhitney: What if the speed of light changed when light is passing through water? ... I have 3 semesters of college Physics.

                              Mountain Man: First of all, the Bible is a fixed document.
                              Mountain Man: … this is how liberals argue these days, with labels instead of ideas.

                              Comment

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