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Suicide

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  • #16
    Having lost a sister-in-law to cancer, and having lost a sister-in-law to suicide, I tend to view depression as being as much of a disease as cancer is.
    I don't think God judges those who lost the battle against depression any more harshly than those who lose the battle against cancer.

    I do view someone who is depressed and commit suicide differently to someone who opts for euthanasia, especially if the motive for it is not wanting to deal with a disability.

    I don't consider someone who commits suicide, be it because they were depressed or have chosen euthanasia as being particularly brave as some do.
    I consider those who fight tooth and nail against their depression as being as brave as any cancer patient fighting against cancer, even if they lose that battle.



    And my thoughts and prayers with your family John.
    "If you can ever make any major religion look absolutely ludicrous, chances are you haven't understood it"
    -Ravi Zacharias, The New Age: A foreign bird with a local walk

    Be watchful, stand firm in the faith, act like men, be strong.
    1 Corinthians 16:13

    "...he [Doherty] is no historian and he is not even conversant with the historical discussions of the very matters he wants to pontificate on."
    -Ben Witherington III

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    • #17
      Originally posted by John Reece View Post
      Continued from the post above...

      Some time after Jerry was discharged from the hospital and was staying in the home of my 90+year old parents, I got a telephone call from my older sister who lives in Pennsylvania who said to me something like, "John, you won't believe what Jerry is doing." Betty had driven down from Pennsylvania to our parents home in northern Virginia for a visit and was astonished to find that Jerry had shut down his business as a building inspector to become a 24/7 caretaker for our parents. She said he had gone to an appliance store and asked for "the best carpet cleaner available" with which to clean the carpets that our incontinent father messed on multiple times a day. After every such event, Jerry would put Dad in the shower, clean him up, then clean the carpeting and bedding, and put Dad back to bed. Dad could not feed himself, so Jerry had built a special chair like a child's high chair, with a combination cloth cover that could be tied around Dad's neck as a bib that extended to a tray that lay on the dinner table.

      After hearing that from Betty, I called Jerry and said, "Betty told me what you are doing." Jerry's only response was, "I'm sure Betty must have been exaggerating". During subsequent conversation Jerry told me that with regard to his comment that I quoted at the end of the paragraph I quoted above, that he had come to believe that the reason his life was spared when he nearly died was to take care of our parents until they both died. So he committed his life 100% to that task and persevered all the way to the fulfillment of it.

      I think he must have become depressed when both parents were gone and he was alone with no wife or children or anyone else to live with, because (according to my older sister who continued to visit him and to keep me updated re his status) he moved to Winchester VA to build a new house and did not send me his new phone number. All I had was his email address, and he never responded to my messages to him.

      When my brother Paul called me re Jerry's suicide, he said that Jerry had been experiencing symptoms of early stage Alzheimer's disease, and that a female friend who was dear to him had recently died.

      My impression is that Jerry's suicide was the consequence of depression following the loss of both parents and his dear friend, and of his "I can fix anything by myself" mindset. There was no one else in his life that he could take care of, and he could not accept a destiny of needing someone else to take care of him. From his perspective, it was the only rational thing to do.
      God is merciful. Lord have mercy and let Jerry and his whole family receive your mercy.
      I am become death...

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      • #18
        Originally posted by Thoughtful Monk View Post
        God help me, this is a hard topic to respond to. I wish no one ever had to deal with the consequences of suicide.

        I know historically, that suicide has been viewed as a one-way, direct ticket to Hell. Unfortunately, I still see this view on occasion. The despair, and I admit I have been closer to it than is comfortable, that one must have to commit suicide is hard to deal with. And unfortunately, it tends to cut one off from society. One really feels like they don't belong - maybe not even human anymore.

        At this point, I fall on God's mercy. He knows all and will make a righteous decision about the person. This is our consolation, God is merciful. For me, 1st John 3:20 speaks to this: "If our hearts condemn us, we know that God is greater than our hearts, and he knows everything."

        May God minister to everyone in this situation.
        Thank you, Thoughtful Monk.

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        • #19
          Praying for you, John, and for your family, and for your brother too.

          If we die with unconfessed sin, is this held against us? I believe when we turn to the Lord, future sins are forgiven, as well as past and present ones. Forgiveness involves confessing our sins, note that 1 John 1:9 does not say "if we confess each sin". I can't remember each sin I have committed, especially sins hidden from me. So sins plural, and God is faithful and just to forgive us our sins (plural again, including future sins), and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

          So I believe and hope your brother Jerry, in turning to Christ, confessed his sins in confessing that he was a sinner, and then we may know that God set out to cleanse him from all unrighteousness.

          Blessing and grace and peace,
          Lee
          "What I pray of you is, to keep your eye upon Him, for that is everything. Do you say, 'How am I to keep my eye on Him?' I reply, keep your eye off everything else, and you will soon see Him. All depends on the eye of faith being kept on Him. How simple it is!" (J.B. Stoney)

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          • #20
            Originally posted by lee_merrill View Post
            If we die with unconfessed sin, is this held against us? I believe when we turn to the Lord, future sins are forgiven, as well as past and present ones. Forgiveness involves confessing our sins, note that 1 John 1:9 does not say "if we confess each sin". I can't remember each sin I have committed, especially sins hidden from me. So sins plural, and God is faithful and just to forgive us our sins (plural again, including future sins), and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
            This isn't the place to discuss this, but I very much disagree with your reasoning here. Pretty much everyone dies with unconfessed sin.
            Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom

            Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
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            I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

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            • #21
              Originally posted by One Bad Pig View Post
              Pretty much everyone dies with unconfessed sin.
              Well, I agree, thus the point being that suicide need not prohibit people from entering God's presence.

              Blessings,
              Lee
              "What I pray of you is, to keep your eye upon Him, for that is everything. Do you say, 'How am I to keep my eye on Him?' I reply, keep your eye off everything else, and you will soon see Him. All depends on the eye of faith being kept on Him. How simple it is!" (J.B. Stoney)

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by lee_merrill View Post
                Praying for you, John, and for your family, and for your brother too.

                If we die with unconfessed sin, is this held against us? I believe when we turn to the Lord, future sins are forgiven, as well as past and present ones. Forgiveness involves confessing our sins, note that 1 John 1:9 does not say "if we confess each sin". I can't remember each sin I have committed, especially sins hidden from me. So sins plural, and God is faithful and just to forgive us our sins (plural again, including future sins), and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

                So I believe and hope your brother Jerry, in turning to Christ, confessed his sins in confessing that he was a sinner, and then we may know that God set out to cleanse him from all unrighteousness.

                Blessing and grace and peace,
                Lee
                Thanks, Lee.

                I am late responding because I have been without any online access for days due to malfunction of local telephone and DSL service.

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                • #23
                  Dad,
                  Something about Cat Stevens always reminded me of Jerry. I see similarities in their mannerisms and their outlook on life. Jerry always gave everyone such big hugs and he was one of the most sincere people I have ever known. This song reminded me of Jerry. He lived a good life and he did so much to try and bring joy to the lives of others.
                  Dianah
                  From: Diana
                  Sent: Tuesday, June 25, 2019 7:47:05 AM
                  To:
                  Subject: Yusuf Cat Stevens, How Can I Tell You, Festival de Viña 2015 HD 1080p

                  https://nam04.safelinks.protection.o...amp;reserved=0

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                  Last edited by Sparko; 06-28-2019, 08:38 AM.

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