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Christianity is Awesome

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  • Christianity is Awesome

    One thing that is beginning to annoy me a little bit is the tendency of many to wave off 1,500 years of awesomeness in the name of Jesus Christ as if it were a trifle, a flash in the pan, or a something merely common. Church history is full of charity, advances in education, healthcare, and other social work. Often, much of these were done to people whose belief system could hardly be any more different that the benefactor. It is a stunning, joyful history of the presence of heaven on earth.

    I've seen the apologists attack this issue by pointing to "indoctrination" of children in Christian schools. This argument is one of many that just doesn't gain any traction, after all, it is just another case of Christian love. Should the Christian really be shocked that the educators try to bring uo their charges in the way of the LORD? Let's be serious.

    Another ridiculous argument usually involves laying out before the skeptic some long winded explanation about how the various sects of Christianity fought in word or deed, thus negating any positive meaning of the faith. The problem is that every single branch of Christianity has awesomeness in its past, and often while working together. This approach is a train wreck.

    The awesomeness continues to our current day. From the hospice movement started by the Catholics to the Jubilee movement which mobilized an international coalition of churches, to the awesome work of the individual pastor, who engages in some of the most trying form of work 24 hours a day, 7 days a week - the history is ongoing and it is a shining and awesome vision of love.

    So here is the burr for me.

    When a Christian comes to TWEB and talks about secular tyranny and concerns regarding the 'Liberal left' and how liberals are bigots who are anxious to use power to stamp out Christianity's beneficial influence that Christian isn't some off the wall dingbat who is making stuff up. The dude just got up this morning and read the paper.

    The Christians are concerned of the anti-Christian liberals for perfectly justifiable reasons. We need to recognize that the concern is grounded in REALITY and that many of these people have experienced abuse first hand.

    It is absurd that we expect abused people who are fully aware of liberal history to come in here and be perfectly polite.

    It is a miracle any of us talk to them at all.

  • #2
    Compare and contrast the following:

    Acknowledging the sins of the church so we can free ourselves to talk about the awesomeness of Jesus Christ.
    Acknowledging the good of the church so we can free ourselves to talk about the evils of liberal politics.

    Perhaps it is just a matter of what one wants to spend one's time talking about?
    Actually YOU put Trump in the White House. He wouldn't have gotten 1% of the vote if it wasn't for the widespread spiritual and cultural devastation caused by progressive policies. There's no "this country" left with your immigration policies, your "allies" are worthless and even more suicidal than you are and democracy is a sick joke that I hope nobody ever thinks about repeating when the current order collapses. - Darth_Executor striking a conciliatory note in Civics 101

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    • #3
      Originally posted by Paprika View Post

      When a Christian comes to TWEB and talks about secular tyranny and concerns regarding the 'Liberal left' and how liberals are bigots who are anxious to use power to stamp out Christianity's beneficial influence that Christian isn't some off the wall dingbat who is making stuff up. The dude just got up this morning and read the paper.
      There exists no power that can stamp out Jesus, I got up and read that in the Bible this morning, I'm not making that up.

      Running around frantically screaming that the sky is falling is a distraction from the great commission, and a surefire way to miss the joy and security found in Christ.
      The last Christian left at tweb

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Trout View Post
        Running around frantically screaming that the sky is falling is a distraction from the great commission, and a surefire way to miss the joy and security found in Christ.
        There is nothing about frantic screaming. Are you suggesting that no note should be taken about the persecution of Christians?

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        • #5
          Originally posted by MehGerbil View Post
          Compare and contrast the following:

          Acknowledging the sins of the church so we can free ourselves to talk about the awesomeness of Jesus Christ.
          Acknowledging the good of the church so we can free ourselves to talk about the evils of liberal politics.
          Personally, I prefer acknowledging the good of the church to show the awesomeness of Jesus Christ.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Paprika View Post
            Are you suggesting that no note should be taken about the persecution of Christians?
            Let me outline an idea, without attaching it to any specifics and ask you if it makes sense. (I'm by no means an expert in living for Christ, I'm a work in progress)

            Reading Paul's experience on the Damascus road, it seems he had a run in with Jesus and was asked the following question: Why are you persecuting Me?

            Sometimes I think that lost in the discussion is the fact that Jesus is our rock and our fortress and the Christian walk is one replete with persecution. And persecution should be considered joy. How we react to persecution reflects who we serve.

            Would you agree?
            The last Christian left at tweb

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            • #7
              And persecution should be considered joy. How we react to persecution reflects who we serve.

              Would you agree?
              Agreed. My turn to ask a question. Do you think that maximising persecution received is therefore good?

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Paprika View Post
                Agreed. My turn to ask a question. Do you think that maximising persecution received is therefore good?
                Again without specifics . . .

                I tend to think that persecution is a necessary by-product of a life with Christ. Persecution is a symptom of regeneration.

                Too much focus on any certain symptom may distract from the core issue.
                The last Christian left at tweb

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                • #9
                  Sure, persecution is necessary. Does that mean that the more persecution, the better?

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Paprika View Post
                    Sure, persecution is necessary. Does that mean that the more persecution, the better?
                    I don't personally think persecution should be the focus, in many cases it's the distraction. Persecution shouldn't be tracked on a scoreboard or a spreadsheet.

                    I'm always perplexed with stories like the stoning of Stephen. Jesus spent so much time with him, yet Stephen was murdered so early in his ministry. If I were Jesus I would have protected Stephen because of my investment in him, I can't afford to lose him so early in the game.

                    Yet God being a God of contrast knew that was the best course of action.

                    The story of Stephen isn't the story of the evils of secular government enfleshed with the authority to kill Christians at will, it's a marvelous snapshot of God's perfect plan.
                    The last Christian left at tweb

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                    • #11
                      I don't believe for one single moment God will necessarily act to preserve the "best" situation. I believe that He has a plan, yes, but He also gives sufficient space for the actions of humans, whether good or ill, to have consequences.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Paprika View Post
                        I don't believe for one single moment God will necessarily act to preserve the "best" situation. I believe that He has a plan, yes, but He also gives sufficient space for the actions of humans, whether good or ill, to have consequences.
                        Seems to me He didn't give Paul much choice on the Damascus road. But that's an entirely different discussion.

                        My point is: I'm pretty sure God is in control and things are right where He wants them. How you marry that to your ecclesiology is up to you.
                        The last Christian left at tweb

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Trout View Post
                          I'm pretty sure God is in control and things are right where He wants them.
                          No, I'm sure there are many things that He would be happier if they were in a different state.

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                          • #14
                            Just because God does personally interfere sometimes (which He clearly does regardless of your worldview) does not mean He personally interferes every time. The parable of the sower, the warnings not to fall for Satan's temptations, etc. Trout's Clockwork Christianity where Trout's god is like a bored kid who has his plastic toy soldiers battle each other (with trout's god making all the movements and shooting noises with his mouth) and then melts the ones he doesn't like is pretty absurd.
                            "As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths." Isaiah 3:12

                            There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Paprika View Post
                              No, I'm sure there are many things that He would be happier if they were in a different state.
                              Things will be different. In His time. He's got this. Jesus has won, is winning and will win.
                              The last Christian left at tweb

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