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  • #31
    Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post

    Yes. A mother goddess figure was hardly unknown in Egypt;








    Not overly dissimilar are they?
    Any image of a mother and child is going to have similarities with others of the same subject manner. That does not make one dependent upon the other but rather because there are just so many ways they can be depicted in a respectful manner.

    I'm always still in trouble again

    "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
    "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
    "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

    Comment


    • #32
      Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post

      Yes. A mother goddess figure was hardly unknown in Egypt;

      Mary is not a goddess. No Christian denomination calls her a goddess.








      Not overly dissimilar are they?
      Bahahaahahh!!! 2 women with kids on their laps. Just like all mothers do. Crystal clear borrowing...
      That's what
      - She

      Without a clear-cut definition of sin, morality becomes a mere argument over the best way to train animals
      - Manya the Holy Szin (The Quintara Marathon)

      I may not be as old as dirt, but me and dirt are starting to have an awful lot in common
      - Stephen R. Donaldson

      Comment


      • #33
        Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
        Any image of a mother and child is going to have similarities with others of the same subject manner. That does not make one dependent upon the other but rather because there are just so many ways they can be depicted in a respectful manner.
        Nowhere did I write that one is "dependent upon the other". Once again you have problems with reading for comprehension.

        However, mother goddesses have a long history and particularly in Egypt. Hence the cult of the virgin was popular there.
        "It ain't necessarily so
        The things that you're liable
        To read in the Bible
        It ain't necessarily so
        ."

        Sportin' Life
        Porgy & Bess, DuBose Heyward, George & Ira Gershwin

        Comment


        • #34
          Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post

          Nowhere did I write that one is "dependent upon the other". Once again you have problems with reading for comprehension.

          However, mother goddesses have a long history and particularly in Egypt. Hence the cult of the virgin was popular there.
          Mary has never been revered as a divine being.
          That's what
          - She

          Without a clear-cut definition of sin, morality becomes a mere argument over the best way to train animals
          - Manya the Holy Szin (The Quintara Marathon)

          I may not be as old as dirt, but me and dirt are starting to have an awful lot in common
          - Stephen R. Donaldson

          Comment


          • #35
            Originally posted by Bill the Cat View Post


            Mary is not a goddess.
            People pray to her, ask her to intercede for them, and she has numerous cultic centres.

            She is believed to be a woman born without sin by some Christians and had a supposed virgin pregnancy.

            Furthermore the iconography is not overly dissimilar to that of earlier mother goddesses.

            For the ordinary [and mostly illiterate] Christians over the centuries where was the line drawn between veneration and worship?

            "It ain't necessarily so
            The things that you're liable
            To read in the Bible
            It ain't necessarily so
            ."

            Sportin' Life
            Porgy & Bess, DuBose Heyward, George & Ira Gershwin

            Comment


            • #36
              Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post
              Nowhere did I write that one is "dependent upon the other". Once again you have problems with reading for comprehension.
              The world does not revolve around you, Your Royal Hineyness.... somebody can make a comment without it being based on something that you "did not write".
              The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post

                The world does not revolve around you, Your Royal Hineyness.... somebody can make a comment without it being based on something that you "did not write".
                She needs to be more humble. Like me.

                Who has more humility in the bit of toenail I clipped off this morning than the whole lot of you have combined.


                I wonder if H_A will regard this as serious

                I'm always still in trouble again

                "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
                "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

                Comment


                • #38
                  Originally posted by eider View Post
                  Every time...........!! As soon as I have written this post I will (yet again) look up 'eschatology' ..I just cannot hold on to its definition.


                  I went to a Public school (in the UK expensive private schools) where all our services were 'High Church' and where every Sunday we recited that exact Creed.
                  I seem to remember that it was very close to the Catholic creed and this may have meant that Catholic families might send their boys there as well. Possibly.


                  I have met and heard of other kinds of Unitarian Christians as well as JWs. Mormons used to door knock here 40 years ago, young men sent to the UK for 2 year experiences, they always looked immaculate and I don't doubt that door-knocking English streets added a lot of depth to their characters. But their beliefs I found to be most strange.



                  Question:- Lots of members are really clear that they are not Christians and obey your rules here, but do you ever/often get new members who cheat, and pretend to be Christians but are later shown not to be?
                  Yes. Most of the time they are not "cheating" they genuinely believe themselves to be Christian, but they don't agree with our statement of faith, and we explain that we are not trying to judge them, it is mostly because we have specific areas that are off limits to non-orthodox Christians so we require them to change their faith tag to something other than "Christian" for that reason. They can use "unorthodox" "unorthodox Christian" or even their denomination such as "LDS" "Jehovah's Witness" or whatever.

                  We have also had some trolls who were here as something else, cause enough trouble to get banned and then come back with sock puppet accounts, sometimes claiming to be Christian thinking it will help them slip by. We ban them when we find out.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post
                    People pray to her, ask her to intercede for them, and she has numerous cultic centres.

                    She is believed to be a woman born without sin by some Christians and had a supposed virgin pregnancy.

                    Furthermore the iconography is not overly dissimilar to that of earlier mother goddesses.

                    For the ordinary [and mostly illiterate] Christians over the centuries where was the line drawn between veneration and worship?
                    Catholics do not believe Mary to be a goddess and they would consider what they do as mere veneration. Of course, they are disagreeable to being called idolaters despite the fact they do put her on equal footing as Jesus as a co-mediatrix and co-redemptrix. The Immaculate Conception of Mary is not the same as the Virgin Birth of Jesus. You may be trying to smuggle the Gospel of James in as if it was accepted even in the RCC canon, not that such smuggling would be extraordinary behaviour from you. Protestant of course protest such nonsense.
                    P1) If , then I win.

                    P2)

                    C) I win.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post
                      People pray to her, ask her to intercede for them, and she has numerous cultic centres.
                      People pray to the saints. Scripture says they can hear them in heaven. Not my cup o tea, but it's at least not anti-biblical AFAICT.

                      She is believed to be a woman born without sin by some Christians and had a supposed virgin pregnancy.
                      None of those are exclusively divine qualities, and those things were later inventions.

                      Furthermore the iconography is not overly dissimilar to that of earlier mother goddesses.
                      So what? It also isn't overly dissimilar to peasant iconography from Egypt.

                      For the ordinary [and mostly illiterate] Christians over the centuries where was the line drawn between veneration and worship?
                      Deification. That is the line. Veneration does not confer godhood.
                      That's what
                      - She

                      Without a clear-cut definition of sin, morality becomes a mere argument over the best way to train animals
                      - Manya the Holy Szin (The Quintara Marathon)

                      I may not be as old as dirt, but me and dirt are starting to have an awful lot in common
                      - Stephen R. Donaldson

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                        She needs to be more humble. Like me.

                        Who has more humility in the bit of toenail I clipped off this morning than the whole lot of you have combined.


                        Now that you have divested yourself of your humility ... .................................................. .................................................. ........................................

                        I wonder if H_A will regard this as serious

                        Depends on what she considers will give her better mileage.
                        1Cor 15:34 εκνηψατε δικαιως και μη αμαρτανετε αγνωσιαν γαρ θεου τινες εχουσιν προς εντροπην υμιν λεγω
                        Come to your senses as you ought and stop sinning; for I say to your shame, there are some who know not God.
                        .
                        If Palm Sunday really was a Sunday, Christ was crucified on a Thursday (which could be adduced from the gospels anyway).

                        "The synoptic gospels claim that Jesus was crucified on the 15th day of Nisan and buried on the 14th day of Nisan:" Majority Consensus

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by tabibito View Post


                          Now that you have divested yourself of your humility ... .................................................. .................................................. ........................................




                          Depends on what she considers will give her better mileage.
                          I has more than enough humbleness to spare.

                          I'm always still in trouble again

                          "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                          "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
                          "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            humble.jpg
                            When I Survey....

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Originally posted by Bill the Cat View Post

                              People pray to the saints.
                              But what is the difference?

                              Within many Christian sects both the virgin and saints are prayed to for intercession [often to icons], candles are lit, and often specific prayers to St X or the virgin are used.

                              In past centuries did those [often illiterate Christians] really differentiate between veneration and worship?



                              "It ain't necessarily so
                              The things that you're liable
                              To read in the Bible
                              It ain't necessarily so
                              ."

                              Sportin' Life
                              Porgy & Bess, DuBose Heyward, George & Ira Gershwin

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by Bill the Cat View Post

                                The earliest mentions of what we call "Maryology" came about in the 3rd Century. She was highly respected in a few earlier writings, but the main stuff was a later insertion.
                                Earlier. Mary was sufficiently highly respected by the mid-second century that Celsus includes her as an object of his attack. And given that the impetus for such respect was thoroughly Jewish in origin, it's not unreasonable to think that it was there all along: during the united kingdom of Israel and subsequently in the kingdom of Judah, the mother of the king was his closest advisor, sitting at his right hand. As the mother of Jesus, Mary fills that role. She is called "more honorable than the cherubim" because the cherubim are throne guardians, and the king's closest advisor ranks above throne guardians.
                                Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. St. John Chrysostom

                                Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
                                sigpic
                                I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

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