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What would it take for the atheist to believe in God?

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  • #16
    Originally posted by Sparko View Post

    John 3:16 For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. 17 For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him. 18 Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because they have not believed in the name of God’s one and only Son. 19 This is the verdict: Light has come into the world, but people loved darkness instead of light because their deeds were evil. 20 Everyone who does evil hates the light, and will not come into the light for fear that their deeds will be exposed. 21 But whoever lives by the truth comes into the light, so that it may be seen plainly that what they have done has been done in the sight of God.
    That is your opinion premised on your religion and your religious beliefs. Followers of other religions would offer their opinions premised on their religious beliefs.

    However, that still leaves unanswered the question "which direction is the right direction?"
    "It ain't necessarily so
    The things that you're liable
    To read in the Bible
    It ain't necessarily so
    ."

    Sportin' Life
    Porgy & Bess, DuBose Heyward, George & Ira Gershwin

    Comment


    • #17
      Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post

      That is your opinion premised on your religion and your religious beliefs. Followers of other religions would offer their opinions premised on their religious beliefs.

      However, that still leaves unanswered the question "which direction is the right direction?"
      I came really close to predicting that the response would be "that is your opinion"...

      The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

      Comment


      • #18
        Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post

        I came really close to predicting that the response would be "that is your opinion"...
        Well of course it is an opinion. That is glaringly obvious.

        And many religious believers would make a case for why their particular religion and their specific belief was the "right direction".

        However, none of that actually answers the question as to what actually is the "right direction"?
        "It ain't necessarily so
        The things that you're liable
        To read in the Bible
        It ain't necessarily so
        ."

        Sportin' Life
        Porgy & Bess, DuBose Heyward, George & Ira Gershwin

        Comment


        • #19
          Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post

          Well of course it is an opinion. That is glaringly obvious.
          Yet you feel the need to constantly state that.

          And many religious believers would make a case for why their particular religion and their specific belief was the "right direction".

          However, none of that actually answers the question as to what actually is the "right direction"?
          When you ask a question, you always seem to have a predefined answer in mind that will not line up with whatever answer somebody gives you.



          The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

          Comment


          • #20
            Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post
            And which direction is the right direction?
            The "right direction" would be an acceptance of Christ as Savior, and a choice to live for him.

            Yeah, that's my opinion, but it's pretty much what the New Testament is all about.

            The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post

              Yet you feel the need to constantly state that.
              Some people seem to forget that fact.



              Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
              When you ask a question, you always seem to have a predefined answer in mind that will not line up with whatever answer somebody gives you.
              On this issue there is only subjective opinion.




              Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post

              The "right direction" would be an acceptance of Christ as Savior, and a choice to live for him.

              Yeah, that's my opinion, but it's pretty much what the New Testament is all about.
              Precisely. That is your belief. Adherents to other religions [particularly the Abrahamic faiths] would make a similar comment as to the validity of their beliefs. So called "revealed religious texts" also play a major part in adherents believing that they and they alone follow the true god.

              The fact of the matter is that there is no "right direction" regarding religious beliefs. It is all subjective.

              Hence the diversity found in polytheistic cultures of the past.
              "It ain't necessarily so
              The things that you're liable
              To read in the Bible
              It ain't necessarily so
              ."

              Sportin' Life
              Porgy & Bess, DuBose Heyward, George & Ira Gershwin

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post
                Precisely. That is your belief.
                Yes

                The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post

                  Yes
                  And as such remains subjective. It also fails to address the question as to which is the "right direction" for religious belief.
                  "It ain't necessarily so
                  The things that you're liable
                  To read in the Bible
                  It ain't necessarily so
                  ."

                  Sportin' Life
                  Porgy & Bess, DuBose Heyward, George & Ira Gershwin

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post
                    And as such remains subjective. It also fails to address the question as to which is the "right direction" for religious belief.
                    Cool.

                    The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by seer View Post
                      Here is a recent and clever atheist meme...

                      "I don't know what it would take to convince me that God exists. But if God does exist, then He would know what it takes to convince me of His existence (and He should also be capable of accomplishing this task)."

                      Any thoughts?
                      Speaking for no other atheist on the planet but myself, and to borrow from St. Christopher (Hithchens); assertions require evidence, extraordinary assertions require extraordinary evidence. And some of the claims made by christians about their preferred deity, are pretty extraordinary. So, what would it take? A miracle, a true to god, real life, defies all known laws of science, miracle. Carried out live, under laboratory controlled conditions and all broadcast, worldwide, on prime time TV

                      And not just "curing" some dumb schmuck of his backache, which might pass muster for average sucker who visits Lourdes hoping for an improvement in their general well being. Something more profound. How about, the full regeneration of an amputated limb. Surely not beyond the wit and capabilities of a deity as defined by christians.

                      There, sorry to be all reductionist, but that's what it will take. At least it would, for me, be a positive first step in the right direction.
                      When inventing a god, it is imperative to claim that it's; invisible, inaudible and imperceptible in every way. Otherwise - when it appears to no one, is silent and does nothing - intelligent people are liable to become sceptical.
                      - Anonymous

                      When asked why Omniscient and Omnipotent God, chose to burn alive the children of two Middle Eastern cities, came the reply;
                      “His hands were tied.” - DaveTheApologist

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by Sparko View Post
                        Ask former atheists, that is exactly what happened to them.
                        Since there don't seem to be any reliable statistics, I suspect that atheism > christianty and christianity > atheism "conversions" (if you want to call it that) are much like defections during the Cold War. A lot of traffic heading towards sunset. Very few in comparrison heading towards sunrise.

                        God doesn't work on our schedules or bow to our demands.
                        Looked at emprically, your god doesn't really seem to do much working or bowing at all.

                        And it takes an actual willingness and an open mind in order for that mind to be changed.
                        Paraphrasing Walter Kotschnig; "It's essential to be open minded. Just not to the point where your brain falls out."
                        When inventing a god, it is imperative to claim that it's; invisible, inaudible and imperceptible in every way. Otherwise - when it appears to no one, is silent and does nothing - intelligent people are liable to become sceptical.
                        - Anonymous

                        When asked why Omniscient and Omnipotent God, chose to burn alive the children of two Middle Eastern cities, came the reply;
                        “His hands were tied.” - DaveTheApologist

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          There is a very very long long long way from believing in God, to confessing the correct doctrines necessary to keep your butt out of hell.

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by Machinist View Post
                            There is a very very long long long way from believing in God, to confessing the correct doctrines necessary to keep your butt out of hell.
                            I don't believe a person needs to "confess the correct doctrines" to be saved.
                            The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post

                              That is your opinion premised on your religion and your religious beliefs. Followers of other religions would offer their opinions premised on their religious beliefs.

                              However, that still leaves unanswered the question "which direction is the right direction?"
                              The right direction is "into the light" and that light is Jesus.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post

                                Well of course it is an opinion. That is glaringly obvious.

                                And many religious believers would make a case for why their particular religion and their specific belief was the "right direction".

                                However, none of that actually answers the question as to what actually is the "right direction"?
                                You asked, you got an answer. Of course that answer would be an "opinion"

                                Comment

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