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Problematic Apologetics

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  • #31
    Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
    So, for the last hour, I was in my conference room with the father of a mother of a family that has been visiting our church, and thinking about joining our church.

    Lemme back up... a woman, who is a veterinarian oncologist, has been visiting our church with her husband and 4 boys.
    She has told her dad, a local cattleman, about our church and me, in particular.

    He stopped by to "check me out" (he had called first and made an appointment) and wanted to know what I taught on Revelation.

    I told him, very generically, about the conversation I started here, and that I think we sometimes get way too carried away on things we really can't know.

    He seemed much relieved, and told me that the church he is currently attending (bigger church than ours) was borderline about to split, because there's an internal battle over various views of eschatology, because their pastor (I know him well) was really pushing a particular view of Revelation, and spending just about every Sunday Morning and Wednesday night message on it.

    He echoed my thoughts that people he highly respects as pastors and teachers can't seem to disagree on "future" things, and he is frustrated with the "pushy" viewpoints.

    (His pastor is a friend of mine pretty much fresh out of Seminary with his ThD, and loves to show how much he knows - He's still my friend, but I try to avoid "deep" discussions, and try to keep it light.)

    Which brings up another point -- some Churches won't even consider a pastor unless he has a Doctor's degree, not even knowing what kind of pastor he would be.
    Many years ago, I had a pastor who was really focused on spiritual gifts, especially speaking in tongues, almost fixated on it to the point that it started to drive people away from the church.
    Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
    But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
    Than a fool in the eyes of God


    From "Fools Gold" by Petra

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    • #32
      Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post

      Many years ago, I had a pastor who was really focused on spiritual gifts, especially speaking in tongues, almost fixated on it to the point that it started to drive people away from the church.
      That can certainly happen - and nobody ever said Satan was stupid. He takes the biggest issue for Unity in the Church - the Holy Spirit - and uses that to divide churches.
      The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

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      • #33
        Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
        I see apologetics as largely being the shield of our faith. Something designed to defend Christianity from outside attacks that could sway believers if all they ever heard was those attacks.

        Oh, and if you want Nick's P.O.V., I suggest a summoning: Apologiaphoenix
        Good point! Knowing there are highly intelligent Christians both past and present very capable of defending the Christian faith has always been like a faith booster for me. Eg When Richards Dawkins wrote (The God Delusion) not even 3 months later I think, Francis Collins wrote, The Dawkins Delusion as a rebuttal. Something for arrogant and smart unbelievers to put in their pipes and smoke.

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        • #34
          Originally posted by 3 Resurrections View Post
          No offense taken, Cow Poke. I can understand why you might sense a red flag going up. The username of 3 Resurrections is only my way of identifying what I think is the only bridge that could unite all the various eschatological positions. As I said above, I think each one of the camps is partly seeing the truth of SOMETHING of the big picture. Sort of like the "Blind men and the Elephant" poem. Each of them were partly in the right, and all were in the wrong in some way. A THIRD resurrection in our future is the only way that all of these varying positions could be reconciled with each other. And it's very, very simple to prove this from scripture without twisting anything whatever.

          I hope I don't come across as some kind of crusader on here. In actuality, my main reason for being here is fellowship, and a continued part of my ongoing "therapy" against the past influences of sitting in a cult church with my husband for 16 years. HORRID aftermath effects of that spiritually abusive atmosphere - especially for the women and girls in the church. The "pastor" fell into sin in the typical fashion for many pastors, but still ended up being put back in his leadership position. During those years, I wanted to die, and I feared and hated domineering, oppressive men who had played a part in making my life a living hell. That was 20 years in the past when our family finally got out of that church, by God's mercy. Over the years, God has gently washed the bitterness from my mind and heart, and the ground feels level at the foot of the cross by now. But to keep from ever lapsing back into that poisonous mentality against my fellow Christian brothers, I make myself venture into the public arena and engage with you guys on purpose. Although I'm naturally an introvert, and I can totally identify with a lot of Nick's reticent perspectives on people and relationships. I relish reading the different types of viewpoints coming from each of you, and I wish there were a lot more women participating in the discussions as well - to help keep it balanced, you know.
          Beautifully written..."God has gently washed the bitterness from my mind and heart".

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          • #35
            It is very unfortunate when Christians take a dogmatic approach to end time events. Whether it be the pre-tribulation rapture or the preterist view. (Both I see as being the extremes).

            I tend to focus on their loving walking the walk, in the service of the Lord, but tend to not pay too much attention to their talk due to their, imo, extreme position on the end times.

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