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"All men will hate you because of me" - something any cult leader could say?

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  • #16
    Originally posted by Gondwanaland View Post

    Yes. JWs, Mormons, hell, even Muhammed all do this. So do other smaller cults/religions.
    The others are copycats. It started with Christ, and his followers were persecuted - ask the Roman lions.

    Heck, idiot Joseph Smith wrote his "tablets" in King James' English because he thought that was how the Christian God spoke. And if a cult leaders wanted to mislead people from coming to Christ, what better way than to ape their history.

    Comment


    • #17
      Originally posted by Ronson View Post

      The others are copycats. It started with Christ, and his followers were persecuted - ask the Roman lions.

      Heck, idiot Joseph Smith wrote his "tablets" in King James' English because he thought that was how the Christian God spoke. And if a cult leaders wanted to mislead people from coming to Christ, what better way than to ape their history.
      My dude, if you think predicting your followers of your small new cult/religion will be persecuted is some amazing prophecy (especially when you're already being persecuted while going around with them and preaching......), I really don't know what to say to you, other than I thought you were at least somewhat rational and am discovering that I was sadly mistaken.

      Literally the lowest possible hanging fruit, and y'all are acting like he predicted the precise date of 9/11 two millenia ago.

      Comment


      • #18
        Yes Christ did say his people would be persecuted. At the same time in regards to the faulty comparison of Islam, Mormonism, and JW's persecution is not the test of truth. There are Biblical Doctrines that Christianity must affirm as well as truth claims. Thus simple persecution is not the standard and to make that comparison is like comparing an apple with an orange.It's a fallacy of equivocating.

        Comment


        • #19
          Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
          Conversation from another thread:

          In each of the four gospels, Jesus is recorded as saying that Christians will be hated.
          No he didn't.
          Jesus never mentioned Christians, he mentioned those who followed his and the Baptist's quests. They were Jewish peasants, mostly.
          Just read what he is reported to have really said, preferably in G-Mark. That means 'Gospel of Mark', MM.

          You accuse others of incomprehension, and then you show so much within yourself.

          Comment


          • #20
            Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post

            Do you have anything specific to support this assertion?
            I'm waiting for you to show specific verses in all gospels to assert your assertion, MM.
            And I'm not going to get any, methinks....
            ...waiting......

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by Gondwanaland View Post

              I'm not here to hold your hand, nor to educate you, H_A.
              Have you gotten your threads confused?

              Anyway, you made a specific claim, and all I've done is ask you to support it. If you are unable or unwilling to do that then this conversation is over as far as I'm concerned. It's no big deal to me.
              Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
              But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
              Than a fool in the eyes of God


              From "Fools Gold" by Petra

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by eider View Post
                Jesus never mentioned Christians...

                This is the sort of overly literal pedantry that gets people laughed out of threads.
                Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
                But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
                Than a fool in the eyes of God


                From "Fools Gold" by Petra

                Comment


                • #23
                  Yes we know Jesus' followers were Jews but they later became called Christians ie Followers of Christ (Acts 11:19-30; 1st Peter 4:16). Also in Greek it just means a person who follows Christ https://biblehub.com/strongs/1_peter/4-16.htm So in reality your just playing a semantic game and being nitpicky.
                  Last edited by ReformedApologist; 07-06-2021, 06:11 AM.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Gondwanaland View Post

                    My dude, if you think predicting your followers of your small new cult/religion will be persecuted is some amazing prophecy (especially when you're already being persecuted while going around with them and preaching......),
                    You're shifting. I didn't say it was "amazing prophecy." I said cult leaders are copying elements of Christianity, probably in the hope of making themselves seem legitimate.

                    I really don't know what to say to you, other than I thought you were at least somewhat rational and am discovering that I was sadly mistaken.
                    There's nothing irrational about my statement.

                    Literally the lowest possible hanging fruit, and y'all are acting like he predicted the precise date of 9/11 two millenia ago.
                    You're the one that seems to be inflating this. Christianity isn't based on the prediction of persecution.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Ronson View Post

                      You're shifting. I didn't say it was "amazing prophecy." I said cult leaders are copying elements of Christianity, probably in the hope of making themselves seem legitimate.
                      In reality, it's just basic bloody common sense and a common tactic used by religion and cults to reinforce their hold over their followers. Anyone with a barely functioning brain could 'predict' that their new religion/cult will have pushback and 'persecution' from other people who aren't part of it.
                      There's nothing irrational about my statement.



                      You're the one that seems to be inflating this. Christianity isn't based on the prediction of persecution.
                      Your boy MM seems to think otherwise.
                      Last edited by Gondwanaland; 07-06-2021, 07:34 AM.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post

                        Have you gotten your threads confused?
                        No, H_A.

                        Anyway, you made a specific claim, and all I've done is ask you to support it. If you are unable or unwilling to do that then this conversation is over as far as I'm concerned. It's no big deal to me.
                        And I did so, and you shrugged it off and ignored it because it clashes with your beliefs.

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by Gondwanaland View Post
                          In reality, it's just basic bloody common sense and a common tactic used by religion and cults to reinforce their hold over their followers. Anyone with a barely functioning brain could 'predict' that their new religion/cult will have pushback and 'persecution' from other people who aren't part of it.


                          Your boy MM seems to think otherwise.
                          Where did I ever claim that "Christianity [is] based on the prediction of persecution"? Of course it's not. It's based on the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ. I merely pointed out that Jesus told his followers to expect to be hated because of him, and that this was not in response to anything his followers were currently facing. You pounced on that stating that the prediction of persecution is common for religious leaders throughout history, but so far, you have not provided anything beyond your say-so to support your assertion.

                          I wonder, is there any record of a religious leader prior to Jesus making a similar prediction?
                          Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
                          But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
                          Than a fool in the eyes of God


                          From "Fools Gold" by Petra

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by Gondwanaland View Post
                            No, H_A.

                            And I did so, and you shrugged it off and ignored it because it clashes with your beliefs.
                            You've not provided anything other than your mere say-so, which you self-servingly call "common sense", and I'm sorry, but regardless of how highly you may think of yourself, that's simply not good enough. If this really is as common as you seem to think, then surely you can provide some historical sources or direct quotes from religious leaders making a prediction of persecution prior to it happening, but, no, you petulantly shifted the burden of proof and demanded that I do your homework for you. Ironically, this is a common tactic of Hypatia_Alexandria, so perhaps you should refer to yourself by that name.
                            Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
                            But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
                            Than a fool in the eyes of God


                            From "Fools Gold" by Petra

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by Gondwanaland View Post
                              In reality, it's just basic bloody common sense and a common tactic used by religion and cults to reinforce their hold over their followers. Anyone with a barely functioning brain could 'predict' that their new religion/cult will have pushback and 'persecution' from other people who aren't part of it.


                              Your boy MM seems to think otherwise.
                              Hello this is the genuine Hypatia writing.

                              You also need to remind MM [and no he and I are not homoosion] that these various gospel texts which put these words into the mouth of Jesus were written decades later and after the First Jewish War.
                              "It ain't necessarily so
                              The things that you're liable
                              To read in the Bible
                              It ain't necessarily so
                              ."

                              Sportin' Life
                              Porgy & Bess, DuBose Heyward, George & Ira Gershwin

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post

                                Where did I ever claim that "Christianity [is] based on the prediction of persecution"? Of course it's not. It's based on the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ. I merely pointed out that Jesus told his followers to expect to be hated because of him, and that this was not in response to anything his followers were currently facing. You pounced on that stating that the prediction of persecution is common for religious leaders throughout history, but so far, you have not provided anything beyond your say-so to support your assertion.

                                I wonder, is there any record of a religious leader prior to Jesus making a similar prediction?
                                I "pounced", did I? What are you the 2020 MSM?

                                Except I did. You simply ignored it because you want Jesus to be special. Even though it's literally the lowest hanging fruit possible.

                                Comment

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