Originally posted by seer
View Post
Announcement
Collapse
Apologetics 301 Guidelines
If you think this is the area where you tell everyone you are sorry for eating their lunch out of the fridge, it probably isn't the place for you
This forum is open discussion between atheists and all theists to defend and debate their views on religion or non-religion. Please respect that this is a Christian-owned forum and refrain from gratuitous blasphemy. VERY wide leeway is given in range of expression and allowable behavior as compared to other areas of the forum, and moderation is not overly involved unless necessary. Please keep this in mind. Atheists who wish to interact with theists in a way that does not seek to undermine theistic faith may participate in the World Religions Department. Non-debate question and answers and mild and less confrontational discussions can take place in General Theistics.
Forum Rules: Here
This forum is open discussion between atheists and all theists to defend and debate their views on religion or non-religion. Please respect that this is a Christian-owned forum and refrain from gratuitous blasphemy. VERY wide leeway is given in range of expression and allowable behavior as compared to other areas of the forum, and moderation is not overly involved unless necessary. Please keep this in mind. Atheists who wish to interact with theists in a way that does not seek to undermine theistic faith may participate in the World Religions Department. Non-debate question and answers and mild and less confrontational discussions can take place in General Theistics.
Forum Rules: Here
See more
See less
Atheism, Slavery, And The Moral High Ground...
Collapse
X
-
“He felt that his whole life was a kind of dream and he sometimes wondered whose it was and whether they were enjoying it.” - Douglas Adams.
-
Originally posted by seer View PostChristians did not start it in the West
At the point that 1454 Papal decree was made, there was little to no slavery in Europe. That was the origin of the modern slave trade, and during the colonial era these Papal decrees were repeatedly cited as formal authorization for Christians to own and trade slaves.
So, yes, Christians did start slavery in the modern era. And they were really clear that they were doing it as Christians. They were seeking out the infidel and enslaving them. It was not simply that they happened to do slavery and also happened to be Christians, they saw a clear link between the two. These were conquests being done officially in the name of extending Christendom and bringing the heathens under the yoke of Christianity. Reducing the heathens to slavery was explicitly allowed and endorsed by multiple Popes, whilst enslaving fellow Christians was explicitly forbidden.
In sum, modern slavery, in Africa & the Americas, was very much started by Christians - literally by Papal decrees."I hate him passionately", he's "a demonic force" - Tucker Carlson, in private, on Donald Trump
"Every line of serious work that I have written since 1936 has been written, directly or indirectly, against totalitarianism and for democratic socialism" - George Orwell
"[Capitalism] as it exists today is, in my opinion, the real source of evils. I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy" - Albert Einstein
Comment
-
Originally posted by seer View PostNo magic? How did biological meat come to form moral concepts like the golden rule? Especially since the process is deaf, dumb and blind to moral concepts.
Smarter beings can find ways of surviving situations where less intelligent ones wouldn't survive. So evolution can favor intelligence.
Intelligent beings can use that intelligence to ponder abstract concepts."I hate him passionately", he's "a demonic force" - Tucker Carlson, in private, on Donald Trump
"Every line of serious work that I have written since 1936 has been written, directly or indirectly, against totalitarianism and for democratic socialism" - George Orwell
"[Capitalism] as it exists today is, in my opinion, the real source of evils. I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy" - Albert Einstein
Comment
-
Originally posted by Starlight View PostI think you've scraped past the bottom of the barrel here seer.
Smarter beings can find ways of surviving situations where less intelligent ones wouldn't survive. So evolution can favor intelligence.
Intelligent beings can use that intelligence to ponder abstract concepts.Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s
Comment
-
Originally posted by Tassman View Post
For social species such as us morality evolves via ‘natural selection’. Populations that cooperated had a survival advantage, e.g., wolves that hunt together are more likely to eat. Chimps groom each other to maintain social cohesion and etc. The human animal, being more intelligent has expanded these basic social instincts into more complex moral systems such as the Golden Rule to enable greater social harmony.Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s
Comment
-
Originally posted by Starlight View PostMaybe stop pretending I ran Russia? I could pretend you ran Nazi Germany if you want to go that insane route.
Originally posted by Starlight View PostThe USSR's twisted form of communism was regarded at the time as serious heresy by left wing groups who kicked the communists out of their membership, and prominent democratic socialist writer George Orwell wrote the most famous works attacking them.
Originally posted by Starlight View PostIf you want to be taken seriously, at all, write posts comparing modern left wing views to Scandinavian countries rather than communist ones.
First, the Scandinavian countries are an admixture of capitalism and socialism. Second, the hard left does not have complete control there. That is why we have to turn to places where "you" have seized total power -- full on "people's Paradises." and that is why we need to look at places like the old Soviet Union and their gulags, the Chicoms and their slave labor camps for the Uighurs, Cuba, and North Korea.
I'm always still in trouble again
"You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
"Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
"Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman
Comment
-
Originally posted by seer View PostReally, every other species survives just fine without any reference to moral concepts. Monkeys don't sit around musing about the usefulness of the golden rule. So again, how does biological meat magically come up with conceptual truths?
Well most of us. Reading this board sometimes I do wonder."I hate him passionately", he's "a demonic force" - Tucker Carlson, in private, on Donald Trump
"Every line of serious work that I have written since 1936 has been written, directly or indirectly, against totalitarianism and for democratic socialism" - George Orwell
"[Capitalism] as it exists today is, in my opinion, the real source of evils. I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy" - Albert Einstein
Comment
-
Originally posted by Tassman View PostNonsense. You are referring to totalitarianism which is not acceptable to anyone in the West that I’m aware of. And “my ilk” tend to prefer their socialism under the moderate, secular non-forced labor model as found in Australia, NZ and the Scandinavian countries etc.– ALL of which rank higher on the UN Human Development Index and the Happiness Index than the largely Christian USA, which has the highest incarceration rates and greatest social inequity of virtually every other Western country.
You love to focus on how bad things were hundreds and thousands of years ago, but then insist on totally ignoring what y'all are doing right now. Today.
Nobody can change the past. What is done is done. But we can change what is happening now. And now we have the far left enslaving people wherever they gain complete and total power.
The hard left needs to join us in the 21st cent and support emancipation. To start demanding that the slaves be freed.
I'm always still in trouble again
"You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
"Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
"Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman
Comment
-
Originally posted by rogue06 View PostFirst, the Scandinavian countries are an admixture of capitalism and socialism.
Somehow you can't seem to understand that and insist on identifying my politics with the USSR, which is hilarious. There's literally no connection."I hate him passionately", he's "a demonic force" - Tucker Carlson, in private, on Donald Trump
"Every line of serious work that I have written since 1936 has been written, directly or indirectly, against totalitarianism and for democratic socialism" - George Orwell
"[Capitalism] as it exists today is, in my opinion, the real source of evils. I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy" - Albert Einstein
Comment
-
Originally posted by Starlight View PostHumans are smarter than monkeys.
Well most of us. Reading this board sometimes I do wonder.Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s
Comment
-
Originally posted by Starlight View PostIndeed. As I have repeatedly said, it appears an admixture of socialism and capitalism is optimal, and I hence view myself as a centrist on the international scale, sitting half way between the extremes.
Somehow you can't seem to understand that and insist on identifying my politics with the USSR, which is hilarious. There's literally no connection.
And again, I'm talking about what happens when the far left seizes complete and total control. Like in Russia, China, North Korea, Cuba... For very good reason you want to shift the spotlight off of that.
I'm always still in trouble again
"You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
"Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
"Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman
Comment
-
Originally posted by rogue06 View PostAnyone who seriously and repeatedly argues that the communist tyrant Joseph Stalin was "really" a right-winger is likely even to the left of the communists.
And again, I'm talking about what happens when the far left seizes complete and total control. Like in Russia, China, North Korea, Cuba... For very good reason you want to shift the spotlight off of that.
Comment
-
Originally posted by Sparko View Post
Maybe if the socialists don't want to be associated with communism/socialism, they should come up with a new term. Freestuffism, maybe.
ba638863-429c-4853-9a14-6372da0f5551.jpg
Someone once said that a Socialist is just a patient Communist or a Communist without a gun in their hand.
I'm always still in trouble again
"You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
"Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
"Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman
Comment
-
-
Originally posted by seer View Post
Between humans and apes there is not only a difference in quality there is a difference in kind. Like I said to Star, monkeys don't sit around discussing conceptual moral ideals. They are dead to such concepts. As are all other species, but we magically do.
“He felt that his whole life was a kind of dream and he sometimes wondered whose it was and whether they were enjoying it.” - Douglas Adams.
Comment
Related Threads
Collapse
Topics | Statistics | Last Post | ||
---|---|---|---|---|
Started by whag, Yesterday, 03:01 PM
|
39 responses
158 views
0 likes
|
Last Post
by whag
Today, 03:32 PM
|
||
Started by whag, 03-17-2024, 04:55 PM
|
21 responses
129 views
0 likes
|
Last Post 03-21-2024, 12:15 PM | ||
Started by whag, 03-14-2024, 06:04 PM
|
80 responses
426 views
0 likes
|
Last Post
by tabibito
Today, 12:33 PM
|
||
Started by whag, 03-13-2024, 12:06 PM
|
45 responses
303 views
1 like
|
Last Post 03-17-2024, 07:19 AM |
Comment