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  • #31
    Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post
    No it isn't.
    Yes it is.
    Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
    But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
    Than a fool in the eyes of God


    From "Fools Gold" by Petra

    Comment


    • #32
      Originally posted by seer View Post

      You floated this nonsense before. You don't think there were those around who were fluid in both languages? Translators? It is not possible for anyone in Pilate's circle (like his wife) who were sympathetic to the early Christians who could have shared the exchange?
      The most obvious source for the details about Jesus' conversation with Pilate is Jesus is himself.
      Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
      But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
      Than a fool in the eyes of God


      From "Fools Gold" by Petra

      Comment


      • #33
        Originally posted by seer View Post

        You floated this nonsense before. You don't think there were those around who were fluid in both languages?
        Not Jewish peasants from a Galilean village.

        Originally posted by seer View Post
        Translators?
        There would certainly have had to be a translator yet not one gospel account mentions that individual.

        Originally posted by seer View Post
        It is not possible for anyone in Pilate's circle (like his wife) who were sympathetic to the early Christians who could have shared the exchange?
        We do not even know if Pilate was married. And more to the point, why would his wife be with him?
        "It ain't necessarily so
        The things that you're liable
        To read in the Bible
        It ain't necessarily so
        ."

        Sportin' Life
        Porgy & Bess, DuBose Heyward, George & Ira Gershwin

        Comment


        • #34
          Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post

          Not Jewish peasants from a Galilean village.

          There would certainly have had to be a translator yet not one gospel account mentions that individual.
          So what? The absence of evidence is not evidence of absence...


          We do not even know if Pilate was married. And more to the point, why would his wife be with him?
          Well that is what the Gospel of Matthew tells us. Do you have any other source to back up your claims?

          Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

          Comment


          • #35
            Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post

            The most obvious source for the details about Jesus' conversation with Pilate is Jesus is himself.
            Really? Are you contending there was some kind of resurrection information exchange?

            Then if so, why does Jesus give different accounts?

            Mark:
            • Jesus before Pilate.
            • Pilate: Are you the king of the Jews?
            • Jesus: You say so.
            • Accused by Chief Priests.
            • No answer by Jesus
            • Pilate astonished.

            Matthew as Mark, except that Pilate was “greatly” astonished.

            Luke:
            • Chief Priests charge Jesus.
            • Pilate: I find no crime in him.
            • Chief Priests: Trouble maker from Galilee to Jerusalem.

            John:
            • Before Pilate early on the eve of Passover (not after Passover as in the Synoptics).
            • Pilate: What is the charge?
            • Pilate: You judge him.
            • Jews: We cannot execute.
            • Pilate: Are you king of the Jews?
            • Jesus: A kingdom not of the world
            "It ain't necessarily so
            The things that you're liable
            To read in the Bible
            It ain't necessarily so
            ."

            Sportin' Life
            Porgy & Bess, DuBose Heyward, George & Ira Gershwin

            Comment


            • #36
              Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post


              Really? Are you contending there was some kind of resurrection information exchange?

              Then if so, why does Jesus give different accounts?

              Mark:
              • Jesus before Pilate.
              • Pilate: Are you the king of the Jews?
              • Jesus: You say so.
              • Accused by Chief Priests.
              • No answer by Jesus
              • Pilate astonished.

              Matthew as Mark, except that Pilate was “greatly” astonished.

              Luke:
              • Chief Priests charge Jesus.
              • Pilate: I find no crime in him.
              • Chief Priests: Trouble maker from Galilee to Jerusalem.

              John:
              • Before Pilate early on the eve of Passover (not after Passover as in the Synoptics).
              • Pilate: What is the charge?
              • Pilate: You judge him.
              • Jews: We cannot execute.
              • Pilate: Are you king of the Jews?
              • Jesus: A kingdom not of the world
              As for your supposed "contradictions", they are trivial to resolve and any number of essays and books have done so, which I will leave to the sincere seeker to find on his own since they are numerous and readily available through a simple internet search query. I will, however, note that what is commonly regarded as supposed "contradictions" in the Bible are generally down to differences in writing conventions where ancient writers did not write with the same precision as is often demanded today, and so they used what we might consider unconventional methods such as reordering events thematically rather than chronologically, compressing multiple events into a single narrative, paraphrasing, approximating, and so on. As the Chicago Statement on Biblical Inerrancy says, "When total precision of a particular kind was not expected nor aimed at, it is no error not to have achieved it. "
              Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
              But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
              Than a fool in the eyes of God


              From "Fools Gold" by Petra

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post

                As for your supposed "contradictions", they are trivial to resolve and any number of essays and books have done so, which I will leave to the sincere seeker to find on his own since they are numerous and readily available through a simple internet search query. I will, however, note that what is commonly regarded as supposed "contradictions" in the Bible are generally down to differences in writing conventions where ancient writers did not write with the same precision as is often demanded today, and so they used what we might consider unconventional methods such as reordering events thematically rather than chronologically, compressing multiple events into a single narrative, paraphrasing, approximating, and so on. As the Chicago Statement on Biblical Inerrancy says, "When total precision of a particular kind was not expected nor aimed at, it is no error not to have achieved it. "
                Just admit it MM you cannot explain these contradictions. Don't worry. Your secret is safe with me!
                Last edited by Hypatia_Alexandria; 05-11-2021, 12:38 PM.
                "It ain't necessarily so
                The things that you're liable
                To read in the Bible
                It ain't necessarily so
                ."

                Sportin' Life
                Porgy & Bess, DuBose Heyward, George & Ira Gershwin

                Comment


                • #38
                  Originally posted by seer View Post

                  So what? The absence of evidence is not evidence of absence...
                  Well by that logic there was a conjurer and balloons at the last supper.


                  Originally posted by seer View Post

                  Well that is what the Gospel of Matthew tells us. Do you have any other source to back up your claims?
                  No other gospel does. What sources? We know very little about Pontius Pilate as a historical figure. However, I ask again, why do you imagine his wife [as Matthew tells us] would have been with him?

                  "It ain't necessarily so
                  The things that you're liable
                  To read in the Bible
                  It ain't necessarily so
                  ."

                  Sportin' Life
                  Porgy & Bess, DuBose Heyward, George & Ira Gershwin

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post

                    Just admit it MM you cannot explain these contradictions. Don't worry. Your secret is safe with me!
                    As for your supposed "contradictions", they are trivial to resolve and any number of essays and books have done so, which I will leave to the sincere seeker to find on his own since they are numerous and readily available through a simple internet search query. I will, however, note that what is commonly regarded as supposed "contradictions" in the Bible are generally down to differences in writing conventions where ancient writers did not write with the same precision as is often demanded today, and so they used what we might consider unconventional methods such as reordering events thematically rather than chronologically, compressing multiple events into a single narrative, paraphrasing, approximating, and so on. As the Chicago Statement on Biblical Inerrancy says, "When total precision of a particular kind was not expected nor aimed at, it is no error not to have achieved it. "
                    Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
                    But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
                    Than a fool in the eyes of God


                    From "Fools Gold" by Petra

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post

                      As for your supposed "contradictions", they are trivial to resolve and any number of essays and books have done so, which I will leave to the sincere seeker to find on his own since they are numerous and readily available through a simple internet search query. I will, however, note that what is commonly regarded as supposed "contradictions" in the Bible are generally down to differences in writing conventions where ancient writers did not write with the same precision as is often demanded today, and so they used what we might consider unconventional methods such as reordering events thematically rather than chronologically, compressing multiple events into a single narrative, paraphrasing, approximating, and so on. As the Chicago Statement on Biblical Inerrancy says, "When total precision of a particular kind was not expected nor aimed at, it is no error not to have achieved it. "
                      I think your stylus has got stuck.
                      "It ain't necessarily so
                      The things that you're liable
                      To read in the Bible
                      It ain't necessarily so
                      ."

                      Sportin' Life
                      Porgy & Bess, DuBose Heyward, George & Ira Gershwin

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post
                        Well by that logic there was a conjurer and balloons at the last supper.
                        The point is you have no logical argument otherwise. Translators certainly would have been around.


                        No other gospel does. What sources? We know very little about Pontius Pilate as a historical figure. However, I ask again, why do you imagine his wife [as Matthew tells us] would have been with him?
                        Again, you have no logical basis to counter what is in Matthew.

                        Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

                        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post

                          I think your stylus has got stuck.
                          I think you don't have a response to the fact that your supposed "contradictions" are much ado about nothing.
                          Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
                          But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
                          Than a fool in the eyes of God


                          From "Fools Gold" by Petra

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Originally posted by seer View Post

                            The point is you have no logical argument otherwise. Translators certainly would have been around.
                            I have not disputed that point. Learn to read what I have written.

                            However, you are employing the fallacy "The absence of evidence is not evidence of absence..." Which leaves it equally possible [because the evidence is absent] that they had a conjurer and balloons at the last supper


                            Originally posted by seer View Post

                            Again, you have no logical basis to counter what is in Matthew.
                            Perhaps she flew in later with Alitalia. After all the absence of evidence of planes is not evidence of the absence of planes.
                            Last edited by Hypatia_Alexandria; 05-11-2021, 01:05 PM.
                            "It ain't necessarily so
                            The things that you're liable
                            To read in the Bible
                            It ain't necessarily so
                            ."

                            Sportin' Life
                            Porgy & Bess, DuBose Heyward, George & Ira Gershwin

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post

                              I think you don't have a response to the fact that your supposed "contradictions" are much ado about nothing.
                              I have responded to it. You just choose to ignore my replies because you cannot explain the inherent contradictions within the various gospel texts.
                              "It ain't necessarily so
                              The things that you're liable
                              To read in the Bible
                              It ain't necessarily so
                              ."

                              Sportin' Life
                              Porgy & Bess, DuBose Heyward, George & Ira Gershwin

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post

                                I have responded to it. You just choose to ignore my replies because you cannot explain the inherent contradictions within the various gospel texts.
                                If I say, "On Thursday night, I went to Bob's house," and then later say, "On Thursday night, I went out with my wife," and then still later say, "On Thursday night, I watched 2001: A Space Odyssey," are those necessarily contradictions, or are they merely different details about the exact same event? Or suppose I relate a conversation I had with my friend Gary. I say, "Gary asked me if I knew how to knit. I said no." He relates it as, "We spent hours talking about the films of Stanley Kubrick, and then the topic of knitting somehow came up. I asked Mountain Man if he knew how to knit, and he just laughed at me." Again, necessarily contradictory, or merely different details about the exact same event?
                                Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
                                But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
                                Than a fool in the eyes of God


                                From "Fools Gold" by Petra

                                Comment

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