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Interpretation the Trinity is polytheistic

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  • Originally posted by thormas View Post

    Well, Hurtado is one of the experts on this subject so I respect your right to disagree but do you have scholars who refute Hurtado in any convincing way?

    Hurtado actually looks at the wording in Paul and traces it back to the earliest Christian worship and his chronology on Paul is matched by others. It is there in his blog (and in his books).
    Ex-spurts in Theology most often engage with circular reasoning to justify what they believe.
    Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
    Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
    But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

    go with the flow the river knows . . .

    Frank

    I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post

      Ex-spurts in Theology most often engage with circular reasoning to justify what they believe.
      Actually it's spelled experts so one difference is that they can spell:+}

      Your comment is actually both disappointing and prejudicial. Have you even read Hurtado? If so, where, exactly, is he at fault? If not, then you generalize scholars and pre-judge this individual.

      Again, disappointing ........especially since you have not offered anyone to refute Hurtado.

      Comment


      • [QUOTE=shunyadragon;n1196762][QUOTE=Christian3;n1196609]
        Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post

        Not be definition, and does not compute with Jesus Christ seated on the right hand of God.
        Perhaps, these two links will help you understand what seated at the right hand of God means.

        https://www.compellingtruth.org/right-hand-of-God.html

        https://www.gotquestions.org/right-hand-God.html

        Comment


        • [QUOTE=Christian3;n1196778][QUOTE=shunyadragon;n1196762]
          Originally posted by Christian3 View Post

          Perhaps, these two links will help you understand what seated at the right hand of God means.

          https://www.compellingtruth.org/right-hand-of-God.html

          https://www.gotquestions.org/right-hand-God.html
          Your links only express the opinions of various individuals. No one has been "up there" to ascertain the situation for themselves!
          "It ain't necessarily so
          The things that you're liable
          To read in the Bible
          It ain't necessarily so
          ."

          Sportin' Life
          Porgy & Bess, DuBose Heyward, George & Ira Gershwin

          Comment


          • [QUOTE=Christian3;n1196778][QUOTE=shunyadragon;n1196762]
            Originally posted by Christian3 View Post

            Perhaps, these two links will help you understand what seated at the right hand of God means.

            https://www.compellingtruth.org/right-hand-of-God.html

            https://www.gotquestions.org/right-hand-God.html
            Seated at the right hand of God means seated at the right hand of God.
            Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
            Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
            But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

            go with the flow the river knows . . .

            Frank

            I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

            Comment


            • [QUOTE=shunyadragon;n1196927][QUOTE=Christian3;n1196778]
              Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post

              Seated at the right hand of God means seated at the right hand of God.
              Just what is your issue with this subject?

              Comment


              • [QUOTE=Christian3;n1196930][QUOTE=shunyadragon;n1196927]
                Originally posted by Christian3 View Post

                Just what is your issue with this subject?
                Three separate persons as One God is an anthropomorphic polytheistic concept. Jesus Christ is depicted as a distinct separate Deity. Actually very similar to Hindu beliefs that the different Gods are aspects of the one Brahman.
                Last edited by shunyadragon; 10-17-2020, 08:01 AM.
                Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
                Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
                But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

                go with the flow the river knows . . .

                Frank

                I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

                Comment


                • [QUOTE=shunyadragon;n1196941][QUOTE=Christian3;n1196930]
                  Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post

                  Three separate persons as One God is an anthropomorphic polytheistic concept. Jesus Christ is depicted as a distinct separate Deity. Actually very similar to Hindu beliefs that the different Gods are aspects of the one Brahman.
                  I think you might be confusing Jesus as a man and the second person of the Trinity becoming flesh.

                  Jesus is one person with two natures.



                  Comment


                  • [QUOTE=shunyadragon;n1196927][QUOTE=Christian3;n1196778]
                    Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post

                    Seated at the right hand of God means seated at the right hand of God.
                    Ah...........now it's clear :+}

                    Comment


                    • [QUOTE=Christian3;n1196949][QUOTE=shunyadragon;n1196941]
                      Originally posted by Christian3 View Post

                      I think you might be confusing Jesus as a man and the second person of the Trinity becoming flesh.

                      Jesus is one person with two natures.


                      A distinct and separate person and God.
                      Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
                      Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
                      But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

                      go with the flow the river knows . . .

                      Frank

                      I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

                      Comment


                      • [QUOTE=shunyadragon;n1196941][QUOTE=Christian3;n1196930]
                        Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post

                        Three separate persons as One God is an anthropomorphic polytheistic concept. Jesus Christ is depicted as a distinct separate Deity. Actually very similar to Hindu beliefs that the different Gods are aspects of the one Brahman.
                        We may legitimately trip over the understanding of the word 'persons' however Christianity accepts that the idea of 3 in 1 (so to speak) is evident in the Jewish scriptures and the earliest Christian community began a "dyadic (God and Lord Jesus) devotional pattern and the triadic shape of discourse (Father, Jesus as Lord and Spirit) about God" is attested in the NT texts." So we have some expanding understanding of God, it seems, in both practice and scripture.

                        I do accept that if one goes too far with the concept of persons (modern understanding) than the Christian belief is distorted and it falls over into polytheism. I also understand that one can look at Christianity and simply believe they got it wrong: Jesus is not God but was exalted by God and made Lord.

                        Tough choices.



                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by thormas View Post

                          We may legitimately trip over the understanding of the word 'persons' however Christianity accepts that the idea of 3 in 1 (so to speak) is evident in the Jewish scriptures and the earliest Christian community began a "dyadic (God and Lord Jesus) devotional pattern and the triadic shape of discourse (Father, Jesus as Lord and Spirit) about God" is attested in the NT texts." So we have some expanding understanding of God, it seems, in both practice and scripture.

                          I do accept that if one goes too far with the concept of persons (modern understanding) than the Christian belief is distorted and it falls over into polytheism. I also understand that one can look at Christianity and simply believe they got it wrong: Jesus is not God but was exalted by God and made Lord.

                          Tough choices.


                          I believe in the bold, and it harmonizes well with the Tanakh view of the Messiah.
                          Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
                          Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
                          But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

                          go with the flow the river knows . . .

                          Frank

                          I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post

                            I believe in the bold, and it harmonizes well with the Tanakh view of the Messiah.
                            You lost me: the bold??

                            Comment


                            • [QUOTE=shunyadragon;n1196941][QUOTE=Christian3;n1196930]
                              Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post

                              Three separate persons as One God is an anthropomorphic polytheistic concept. Jesus Christ is depicted as a distinct separate Deity. Actually very similar to Hindu beliefs that the different Gods are aspects of the one Brahman.
                              Jesus is not depicted as a distinct separate Deity.

                              The Word of God (son by relationship) is the second person of the Trinity; the Holy Spirit is the Spirit of the One God. Only one God, not three separate Gods.

                              Keep in mind that Jesus AS A MAN did not exist before His birth about 2 thousand years ago. It is the Word of God who is eternal who has always existed.

                              Last edited by Christian3; 10-17-2020, 10:14 AM.

                              Comment


                              • [QUOTE=Christian3;n1197011][QUOTE=shunyadragon;n1196941]
                                Originally posted by Christian3 View Post

                                Jesus is not depicted as a distinct separate Deity.

                                The Word of God (son by relationship) is the second person of the Trinity; the Holy Spirit is the Spirit of the One God. Only one God, not three separate Gods.

                                Keep in mind that Jesus AS A MAN did not exist before His birth about 2 thousand years ago. It is the Word of God who is eternal who has always existed.
                                Despite the firmness of your assertion, I disagree. Based on specific citation of scripture Jesus is depicted as a distinct separate Deity.

                                Yours is one view, but not the only one in traditional Christianity, and the different conflicting views are claimed to be based on scripture including the belief that Jesus Christ is eternal with Creation, and Creation took place by his hand..
                                Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
                                Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
                                But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

                                go with the flow the river knows . . .

                                Frank

                                I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

                                Comment

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