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Is The Concept Of Human Dignity...

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  • Is The Concept Of Human Dignity...

    ...merely a social construction, or is there a transcendent link that is not dependent on wavering social norms?
    Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

  • #2
    At present there is no evidence that human dignity anything more than a natural part of the nature of being human.
    Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
    Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
    But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

    go with the flow the river knows . . .

    Frank

    I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

    Comment


    • #3
      Considering we have all sorts of racism and biases, there is no such thing as human dignity beyond what your social group gives you.
      "For I desire mercy, not sacrifice, and acknowledgment of God rather than burnt offerings." Hosea 6:6

      "Theology can be an intellectual entertainment." Metropolitan Anthony Bloom

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post
        At present there is no evidence that human dignity anything more than a natural part of the nature of being human.
        Why is it a natural part of being human? That makes no sense.
        Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by seer View Post

          Why is it a natural part of being human? That makes no sense.
          Survival of the species depends on morality, human dignity cooperation, guilt, and cohesive social units.
          Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
          Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
          But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

          go with the flow the river knows . . .

          Frank

          I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post

            Survival of the species depends on morality, human dignity cooperation, guilt, and cohesive social units.
            So human human dignity is no more than a social construct..

            The Baháʼí Writings make clear that human rights are not merely a political or social concept that is contingent on recognition by governments. Rather, the Baháʼí perspective is that human rights exist with or without governments; indeed, they are a divine endowment flowing from the creation of all human beings with the potential to reflect the attributes of God. All human beings have for this reason an equal spiritual dignity.

            Bahá’u’lláh’s teaching of a divinely ordained equal human dignity is expressed in this Hidden Word: “O Children of Men! Know ye not why We created you all from the same dust? That no one should exalt himself over the other. Ponder at all times in your hearts how ye were created.”26 Governments accordingly have a moral obligation to respect this divine endowment, an obligation that would exist even in the absence of treaties or customary legal norms obligating them to do so. Bahá’u’lláh impressed upon rulers this sacred duty: “For is it not your clear duty to restrain the tyranny of the oppressor, and to deal equitably with your subjects, that your high sense of justice may be fully demonstrated to all mankind? God hath committed into your hands the reins of the government of the people, that ye may rule with justice over them, safeguard the rights of the down-trodden, and punish the wrong-doers.”27 These are divinely-ordained responsibilities that no government can legitimately shirk.
            Last edited by seer; 02-16-2021, 10:49 AM.
            Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by seer View Post
              ...merely a social construction, or is there a transcendent link that is not dependent on wavering social norms?
              Given the various ways in which the phrase may be employed, define what you understand by "Human dignity" in this specific context.
              "Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful" Attrib. Seneca 4 BCE - 65 CE

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by seer View Post
                ...merely a social construction, or is there a transcendent link that is not dependent on wavering social norms?
                I'd go with "a social construction", but I'm sure you could have guessed that.

                Some norms don't seem to "waver" as much as others.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Stoic View Post

                  I'd go with "a social construction", but I'm sure you could have guessed that.

                  Some norms don't seem to "waver" as much as others.
                  I don't know, given our human history I think it may waver a lot.
                  Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

                  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post

                    Given the various ways in which the phrase may be employed, define what you understand by "Human dignity" in this specific context.
                    Here is one definition:

                    At its most basic, the concept of human dignity is the belief that all people hold a special value that's tied solely to their humanity. It has nothing to do with their class, race, gender, religion, abilities, or any other factor other than them being human.
                    Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

                    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by seer View Post

                      Here is one definition:
                      Is that the definition you are using? Or have you cited simply as an example?
                      "Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful" Attrib. Seneca 4 BCE - 65 CE

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post

                        Is that the definition you are using? Or have you cited simply as an example?
                        It is one I agree with.
                        Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

                        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by seer View Post
                          I don't know, given our human history I think it may waver a lot.
                          What is the point of a "transcendent link that is not dependent on wavering social norms" if people and societies disagree about it?

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Stoic View Post

                            What is the point of a "transcendent link that is not dependent on wavering social norms" if people and societies disagree about it?
                            It would mean that humans had worth despite what a particular society thought. The Rwandan genocide was immoral because creatures of transcendent value were murdered. When the Hutu reduced the Tutsi to beings without value (to be raped and murder at will) they were rationally and morally wrong. If the Tutsi really were beings without transcendent value then that valueless view, that opinion of the Hutu, was perfectly rational and morally justifiable.
                            Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

                            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              I suspect it would be utterly impossible to find a culture that did not value humanity in some way, shape or form.

                              Failing to do so would be pretty quickly counterproductive to survival. And would be evolutionarily selected against pretty hard.

                              Plus, you know, the fact that we are all human and tend to value ourselves pretty highly, tends to mean we all value humans.

                              So I would tend to say it would be a universal. Although some ways of defining it would be cultural.

                              Comment

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