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Discrepancy between Leviticus 23:6 and Matthew 26:17?

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  • #16
    Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post

    At the time the Jews reckoned the day to begin at dusk when the first stars were visible. All four gospels recount a final dinner being shared but it should be noted the Synoptics writers’ depiction of this meal is vastly different from that provided by the writer of John. In John's narrative we have Jesus making long speeches and inserting a “new” commandment to love one another [which as Geza Vermes notes was not actually new at all]. However, the writer gives no precise date for this meal beyond it taking place before the feast of Passover. It has been noted that the subsequent narrative of John’s gospel suggests that this event occurred at the start of 14 Nisan the day before the Jews celebrated the Passover, thereby implying that this last meal was not a Passover meal. By contrast, the occasion, as presented by the Synoptic writers, is quite definitely a Passover dinner. See Mark 14.12-14; Matt 26.17-19, Luke 22.15. Hence, after sunset, at the start of 15 Nisan the Synoptics have Jesus and his disciples celebrating what is now known as the Seder meal.

    Looks like a block of text copy/pasted without attribution.
    "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

    Comment


    • #17
      Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post

      Looks like a block of text copy/pasted without attribution.
      Are you disputing the text of "holy writ" ?

      I also replied to another contributor where I provided links to two Jewish sites concerning when 15 Nisan commences and that the Jewish day runs from sunset to sunset.
      "Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful" Attrib. Seneca 4 BCE - 65 CE

      Comment


      • #18
        Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post

        Are you disputing the text of "holy writ" ?

        I also replied to another contributor where I provided links to two Jewish sites concerning when 15 Nisan commences and that the Jewish day runs from sunset to sunset.
        How can somebody as supposedly intelligent as you be so incredibly DENSE?
        "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

        Comment


        • #19
          Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post

          How can somebody as supposedly intelligent as you be so incredibly DENSE?
          I have responded to your remark. My "block of text" as you deem it was primarily concerned with what the four canonical gospel writers tell us. Did I need to add further attributions to the one I gave re the three Synoptic writers?
          "Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful" Attrib. Seneca 4 BCE - 65 CE

          Comment


          • #20
            Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post

            I have responded to your remark. My "block of text" as you deem it was primarily concerned with what the four canonical gospel writers tell us. Did I need to add further attributions to the one I gave re the three Synoptic writers?
            A credible poster would.
            "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post

              A credible poster would.
              John 13.1 clearly states that the meal took place before Passover. The "new" commandment Jesus gives his disciples at John 13.34 is not new and can be found in Leviticus 19.18. Geza Vermes deals with the authentic gospels of Jesus in his book that bears that title.
              "Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful" Attrib. Seneca 4 BCE - 65 CE

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              • #22
                FAO Cow Poke

                An additional comment to my above reply.

                I would have thought that anyone with the vaguest knowledge of Judaism knows that the Jewish day starts at sunset - to wit, Sabbath and other festivals. These begin in the evening and end at the start of the following night; although some rabbinical thought challenges the belief that this has always been the case and there have been disputes over the interpretation of Genesis 1.5.

                You can search online for any Jewish site for information regarding this.
                "Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful" Attrib. Seneca 4 BCE - 65 CE

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post
                  FAO Cow Poke

                  An additional comment to my above reply.
                  You're THAT steamed?

                  I would have thought that anyone with the vaguest knowledge of Judaism knows that the Jewish day starts at sunset - to wit, Sabbath and other festivals.
                  Absolutely - I teach that regularly. And I've even been in Jerusalem a number of times to observe this for myself. You outta see the women scurrying around just before sundown the day before the Sabbath!

                  These begin in the evening and end at the start of the following night; although some rabbinical thought challenges the belief that this has always been the case and there have been disputes over the interpretation of Genesis 1.5.
                  Yes, and some even believe that any part of a Jewish day can be counted as "a day".

                  You can search online for any Jewish site for information regarding this.
                  Wow, I really hacked you off, eh? Just for observing that you posted a block of text without attribution?

                  Perhaps you can add one more "additional comment" to THIS reply.

                  (you're so cute)
                  "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post

                    You're THAT steamed?



                    Absolutely - I teach that regularly. And I've even been in Jerusalem a number of times to observe this for myself. You outta see the women scurrying around just before sundown the day before the Sabbath!



                    Yes, and some even believe that any part of a Jewish day can be counted as "a day".



                    Wow, I really hacked you off, eh? Just for observing that you posted a block of text without attribution?

                    Perhaps you can add one more "additional comment" to THIS reply.

                    (you're so cute)
                    You have a very inflated opinion of your own self-importance. Do you really think I give you that much thought?

                    Note the two time stamps on those replies. After I had posted the initial reply to you I replied to someone else on another board, I then decided to add those comments to the reply I had made to you. However, the "window" for editing a reply had closed and so I had post them separately.

                    There was no more to it than that.

                    "Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful" Attrib. Seneca 4 BCE - 65 CE

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post
                      You have a very inflated opinion of your own self-importance.
                      You've taken up mind reading now, have ya?

                      Do you really think I give you that much thought?
                      Now that you mention it, you see rather obsessed with me.


                      Note the two time stamps on those replies. After I had posted the initial reply to you I replied to someone else on another board, I then decided to add those comments to the reply I had made to you. However, the "window" for editing a reply had closed and so I had post them separately.

                      There was no more to it than that.


                      You are so cute!



                      "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post

                        You've taken up mind reading now, have ya?
                        You seemed to think that I was " THAT steamed" and that you had "really hacked" me "off". You clearly have a very inflated opinion about how your consider your comments affect me. That is a manifestation of your self importance.

                        All I had done was extend to you the courtesy of making a more detailed reply to your comments. .

                        Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post

                        Now that you mention it, you see rather obsessed with me.
                        Good grief! Is replying to someone evidence of obsession? If so every contributor to these boards must be obsessed with all the correspondents to whom they are replying.


                        Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                        You are so cute!

                        You strike me as decidedly odd.
                        "Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful" Attrib. Seneca 4 BCE - 65 CE

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post
                          You seemed to think that I was " THAT steamed" and that you had "really hacked" me "off". You clearly have a very inflated opinion about how your consider your comments affect me. That is a manifestation of your self importance.
                          Calm yourself Missy, you're getting all worked up.

                          All I had done was extend to you the courtesy of making a more detailed reply to your comments. .

                          Good grief! Is replying to someone evidence of obsession? If so every contributor to these boards must be obsessed with all the correspondents to whom they are replying.

                          You strike me as decidedly odd.
                          I am, indeed, decidedly odd. And you appear to be totally preoccupied with me.

                          But, seriously, take a deep breath. Everything will be OK.
                          "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by Christian3 View Post

                            Adam Clarke Commentary


                            Now the first day of the feast of unleavened bread - As the feast of unleavened bread did not begin till the day after the passover, the fifteenth day of the month, Leviticus 23:5, Leviticus 23:6; Numbers 28:16, Numbers 28:17, this could not have been, properly, the first day of that feast; but as the Jews began to eat unleavened bread on the fourteenth, Exodus 12:18, this day was often termed the first of unleavened bread.
                            So then there actually is a discrepancy.

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by rstrats View Post

                              Leviticus 23:6 says : “And on the fifteenth day of the same month is the feast of unleavened bread...”

                              However, Matthew 26:17 says: “Now on the first day of the feast of unleavened bread the disciples came to Jesus, saying unto him, Where wilt thou that we prepare for thee to eat the passover?”

                              Any thoughts on the seeming discrepancy?
                              How about G-John's version? That might fit with Lev 23:6 a bit better?

                              Or, alternatively, the disciples simply have got it wrong themselves because that was never a Passover meal but a last meal.
                              Passover Meals were eaten in the Temple refectories immediately after the sacrificial ceremony. Yes? No?

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by rstrats View Post

                                So then there actually is a discrepancy.
                                Between the four canonical gospels, yes.
                                "Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful" Attrib. Seneca 4 BCE - 65 CE

                                Comment

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