Apologetics 301 Guidelines

If you think this is the area where you tell everyone you are sorry for eating their lunch out of the fridge, it probably isn't the place for you

This forum is open discussion between atheists and all theists to defend and debate their views on religion or non-religion. Please respect that this is a Christian-owned forum and refrain from gratuitous blasphemy. VERY wide leeway is given in range of expression and allowable behavior as compared to other areas of the forum, and moderation is not overly involved unless necessary. Please keep this in mind. Atheists who wish to interact with theists in a way that does not seek to undermine theistic faith may participate in the World Religions Department. Non-debate question and answers and mild and less confrontational discussions can take place in General Theistics.

Forum Rules: Here
See more
See less

That coin.... which they passed to Jesus!

  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #31
    Originally posted by eider View Post
    Ah! I'm very ancient but quite untitled, I'm afraid!
    Mormons have Elders? I always think of JW Elders since one has visited me for nearly thirty years. Tea, biscuits and heated discussions, for thirty years.
    Mormon "elders" are teenage kids. How in the world Joseph Smith came up with the notion to call teenagers "elders" is beyond me, and is clearly anti-biblical.

    "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”


    • #32
      Originally posted by 3 Resurrections View Post
      Whether eider is correct or not that the denarius was also a Tyrian shekel...he is certainly right that this Tyrian shekel coin was an insult to the Jewish people - and even more so to the God of Israel as well. The "KP" inscription on it I have read is an abbreviation for "Kratos Romaion", meaning "power of the Romans". Because it was only permitted to be minted in Jerusalem by the authorization of the Romans. Only a sovereign nation could have minted their own coinage, but in this one singular case, Rome made an exception for the subjugated Jewish nation. In 19 BC, the Jewish priesthood asked permission from Rome to start minting a replacement for the Tyrian shekel of that time, because the silver content had recently been debased. They wanted a "purer" coin to be used in their Temple. Rome conceded to their request, as long as they continued to mint the Tyrian shekels with the same pagan images and abominable inscription "Tyre the holy and city of refuge". The high priests allowed NO BUYING OR SELLING of sacrificial items in the Temple or payment of the annual Temple tax without exchanging foreign currency for the required Tyrian shekel or half shekel. (Sound familiar, anyone?) Of course, the exchange fee for this required coinage was IMMENSELY profitable for the high priesthood. Witness Christ's rage in the Temple against the money-changers and their shameless profiteering from this requirement. "Den of thieves", indeed.

      To understand just how abominable this Tyrian shekel was to the God of Israel, one should do a study of the god Baal / Melqart Herakles / Hercules; the demi-god who was depicted on the front of this Tyrian shekel. Baal and his companion goddess Tannit were notorious in the ancient world for child sacrifice. There are some dozen or so tophets scattered around the Mediterranean today with thousands upon thousands of small urns containing cremated infant remains sacrificed to this blood-thirsty pair. Tyre was a city steeped in this "worship". To have the Tyrian shekel inscription read "Tyre the HOLY and city of refuge"...this was a total affont to God who abhorred the practice of passing one's children through the fire as a sacrifice.

      Minting the Tyrian shekel in Jerusalem also directly disobeyed an ancient law that Moses gave to the people about taking unto themselves the silver or gold of an idol. They were to "detest" and to "utterly abhor" those graven images of pagan gods, because it was an abomination unto God, and "a cursed thing". Achan found out just how serious God was about this "cursed thing" when he and all his were stoned and burned for his secreting the silver coins, the gold, and the garment in his tent. God meant what he said in Deuteronomy 7:25-26. So, when the high priesthood not only PERMITTED this abominable Tyrian shekel coinage to be used in Temple worship and for the annual temple tax, but also were actually REQUIRING this particular coin and no other alternative to be used, this was a supreme affront to God.

      Significantly, this "drachma" coin (another name for the Tyrian shekel) was also habitually worn by women on the FOREHEAD of their headdress to denote their marital status. (Again, sound familiar, anyone?) This explains why the woman who lost one of her ten drachma coins was distressed in Luke 15:8. It would have been the equivalent of a woman today losing her wedding ring in the house.

      I claim that this Tyrian shekel and half shekel with its required use forced on the Jewish people by their own high priesthood since 19 BC was the fulfilment of the "mark of the Beast" in Revelation 13. It was imposed on those in the earth - the land of Israel - by the lying, two-horned Land Beast (the Pharisees and Sadducees power structure in Israel). This compelled homage of their own people to the image of the gods of Rome - the Sea Beast of those days - depicted on those coins.
      Thank you for such an interesting post, and the info offered.

      Your suggestion that the KP struck on to the reverse of the shekel could mean "Kratos Romaion" is most interesting. Could well be, but I've always read that the KP was/is a shortening of the title Caesar in Greek, from that language, thus:- ''Καίσαρας''. Actually, both might be correct.

      The most insulting head of Baal on the obverse, with the graven image and KP struck on the reverse, we have complete agreement about that, and the Coin exchange at the Temple called Anna's Bazaar during that High Priest's office and onwards after his retirement is all well documented. The exchange rates were crippling.

      Also, the Priesthood would condemn any lamb brought to the Temple privately for any reason, so that a Temple Lamb had to be purchased anyway.

      You mentioned the Mint founded near Jerusalem in 19BC. Yes, and it's location must have been a well kept secret because I don't think that historians have ever discovered its location. A Jerusalem mint shekel can be distinguished from a 39-19bc Tyre mint shekel by its strike. Although weight and silver purity were exactly the same, the Jerusalem mint took much less care with the striking and so those coins are off struck whereas the earlier coins show an exact strike. Well that's what I have read in a paper by an Australian Numismatic Society member.

      Thatnk you again for your valuable contribution.


      • #33
        Originally posted by NorrinRadd View Post

        I wonder if he joined on the "eides" of March 2016.

        The little dachshund in my avatar pic....... 'Eider'..!
        For some reason, long forgot, all our little hounds have been named after diving ducks. And strangely they all love swimming in the sea..... most unusual.


        • #34
          Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post

          Mormon "elders" are teenage kids. How in the world Joseph Smith came up with the notion to call teenagers "elders" is beyond me, and is clearly anti-biblical.
          There is a large CoJC&LDS church in Canterbury, Kent.
          During the 80's smart young CoJC&LDS men would evangelise by door knocking around here. They stayed together in a house in Canterbury and traveled out to surrounding villages and towns.
          I couldn't believe in their faith but always offered hospitality. I must say I was always impressed by their immaculate appearance and best manners. They probably got plenty of abuse and two year's of evangelising would have built their characters immensely.


          Related Threads


          Topics Statistics Last Post
          Started by seer, 06-20-2021, 06:57 AM
          21 responses
          Last Post Sparko
          by Sparko
          Started by Hypatia_Alexandria, 06-14-2021, 08:20 AM
          9 responses
          Last Post Hypatia_Alexandria  
          Started by lee_merrill, 06-03-2021, 11:57 AM
          1 response
          Last Post Christian3  
          Started by Machinist, 05-26-2021, 10:52 AM
          97 responses
          Last Post Stoic
          by Stoic
          Started by seer, 05-12-2021, 05:35 AM
          580 responses
          Last Post Tassman
          by Tassman