Saved Atheist

[Truthseeker]

What is the boat a metaphor for? I guess it's the thing that saves us . . . from WHAT!?

[firstfloor]

No we are not in the same boat, you are just making that up. The Christian actually believes that he is saved from sin and death - that they are realities. What is the atheist saved from?

There is only ONE reality. We are both in it. What is unseen for you is unseen for me. The ONLY difference is the words you and I are using now to talk about it.

[shunyadragon]

Is that your own poetry (above) Frank?

Yes

[firstfloor]

What is the boat a metaphor for? I guess it's the thing that saves us . . . from WHAT!?

In the same boat means in the same situation or having the same problems. My thesis is that whatever ‘saved’ means, atheists, or anyone else are as saved as Christians.

[seer]

There is only ONE reality. We are both in it. What is unseen for you is unseen for me. The ONLY difference is the words you and I are using now to talk about it.

Again that just doesn't follow. God either exists or not - He is either part of this one reality or He is not (whether He is seen or unseen is immaterial). So this is not merely about semantics it is about reality and what reality actually consists of. The atheist does not believe in sin and judgement so there would be nothing to be saved from.

[Carrikature]

Tadalkjasd asfe fakj gasdoiasdf ajf fj jasdjls. FF, asdfaia akd fjasdee fj alem?

[whag]

Atheists are saved by... what?

I think he's using the term metaphorically. He might be saying that Christians (and all religious believers) are metaphorically saved by forming views that make them happy and keep their existential worries at bay, while skeptics are "saved" by accepting epistemology and forming views with the data already available to us.

It's not very coherently expressed.

[Sparko]

Tadalkjasd asfe fakj gasdoiasdf ajf fj jasdjls. FF, asdfaia akd fjasdee fj alem?

yer momma.

[whag]

No we are not in the same boat, you are just making that up. The Christian actually believes that he is saved from sin and death - that they are realities. What is the atheist saved from?

But death isn't the problem you're saying it is. It has always existed. I put my 12 year old cat to sleep once, and felt very deep emotions as we looked into each other's eyes as she slipped out of existence. That it effects creatures in this way doesn't mean that it's unnatural. Maybe some skeptics feel a certain liberty in processing death that way instead of calling it a side effect of ancient evil.

[firstfloor]

Again that just doesn't follow. God either exists or not - He is either part of this one reality or He is not (whether He is seen or unseen is immaterial). So this is not merely about semantics it is about reality and what reality actually consists of. The atheist does not believe in sin and judgement so there would be nothing to be saved from.

That is exactly upside-down. It is the fact that God is unseen that makes his existence questionable. It is likewise for sin and salvation. You could not simply look at a crowd of people and pick out those who are ‘saved’. If you talk to some of them and you hear the special language you might judge that they are saved. The thing that you observe about them is that they know the special language.

Now, it is probably true that the language you use affects how you perceive reality but it does not change reality. What you do is equate perception with reality but this in not reliable when the things you are thinking about are unseen. Therefore, regardless of what each of us thinks is the case about God, sin and salvation, my reality is identical to your reality and therefore if you are ‘saved’ so am I. It makes no difference what I am ‘saved’ from.

[whag]

Tadalkjasd asfe fakj gasdoiasdf ajf fj jasdjls. FF, asdfaia akd fjasdee fj alem?

This needs umlauts.

[robrecht]

Our ship earth has more voyagers in the quest for salvation then Christians and Atheists. There are Buddhists, Jews, Hindus, Agnostics, Taoists, Muslims, and an assortment of others all concerned with salvation, including an assortments of pragmatists. The question from my perspective is what are we saved from?

From the Baha'i perspective the main concern is the salvation of humanity in the unity and harmony of our spiritual nature. Unselfish sincerity and compassion for our fellow passengers on the ship 'Earth.' are more likely the touchstone of salvation then being concerned with salvation of ones own soul.

Compassion

Compassion is the earth,
it is always beneath you regardless of flavor.
It receives all in death,
without judgment or favor.

Love is the moon,
a beautiful reflection in the lake.
entwines the favored son,
but fades dancing away in the wake.

Compassion is the sun.
The sun gives warmth and life to all,
even the dark shadows in the morn
receive light in the eve whether short or tall.

Love is the moon
sometime a smile, sometimes not
dancing in the shadows
sometimes there, sometimes not

Compassion fills the air.
to some a soft breeze.
others a deadly roar and a prayer
Not one nor the other to please.

Love is the moon
Playing hide and seek
Sometimes a wink
for those who vainly seek.

Compassion is the sea,
Ascending to the heavens unseen,
returning again to give life.
or a grave to some in the sea

Love is the rose.
Beautiful to behold,
When no longer a rose,
the thorns take hold.

God is not a chess player
with the white pieces.
God is the sea . . .
and we are the fishes.

Frank A Doonan

Very nice, Frank. Reminds me of Jesus saying that God causes the rain to fall (a good thing) on the good and bad alike.

[robrecht]

Tadalkjasd asfe fakj gasdoiasdf ajf fj jasdjls. FF, asdfaia akd fjasdee fj alem?

Speaking in tongues again?

[Cow Poke]

What is the boat a metaphor for? I guess it's the thing that saves us . . . from WHAT!?

Fellowship. "Two fellows in a ship".

[Cow Poke]

This needs umlauts.

add red and green peppers, cheese and onion, and it's a Western umlaut!