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What are the essentials of the genuine Christian faith?

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  • What are the essentials of the genuine Christian faith?

    This is at issue.
    Originally posted by One Bad Pig View Post
    Originally posted by 37818 View Post
    Only where tradition is contrary or different from the plain teaching of holy scripture. And then only in matters of interpretation which are not essentials to the genuine Christian faith.
    We disagree both on the "plain teaching" and what are the essentials.
    Last edited by 37818; 03-28-2015, 06:50 PM.
    . . . the Gospel of Christ, for it is [the] power of God to salvation to every [one] believing, . . . -- Romans 1:16.

    . . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3, 4.

    Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1.

  • #2
    :gasp: Dare we attempt to improve on Mere Christianity?:swoon:
    The greater number of laws . . . , the more thieves . . . there will be. ---- Lao-Tzu

    [T]he truth Im after and the truth never harmed anyone. What harms us is to persist in self-deceit and ignorance - Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

    Comment


    • #3
      I'm missing the context of the OP so at the risk of being totally off base, I'll respond...

      What I view as the essentials are:
      • God exists as a Trinity
      • He is Creator and Sustainer of all that is seen and unseen.
      • Jesus Christ was incarnate as fully God and fully man.
      • Jesus Christ paid for my sins by His sacrifice on the cross (aka Substitutionary Atonement)
      • On the third day, He was bodily Resurrected from grave. He later ascended to Heaven and is seated at the right hand of God.
      • The Bible is God's revelation to man. It is inerrant in the original manuscripts. It is His only written revelation and needs no addition.


      I think that's all I would consider essential.
      "For I desire mercy, not sacrifice, and acknowledgment of God rather than burnt offerings." Hosea 6:6

      "Theology can be an intellectual entertainment." Metropolitan Anthony Bloom

      Comment


      • #4
        I would add to TM's list as follows.
        • God exists as a Trinity
        • He is Creator and Sustainer of all that is seen and unseen.
        • Jesus Christ was incarnate as fully God and fully man.
        • Jesus Christ paid for my sins by His sacrifice on the cross (aka Substitutionary Atonement)
        • On the third day, He was bodily Resurrected from grave. He later ascended to Heaven and is seated at the right hand of God.
        • The Return of Christ to judge and rule over all men.
        • The resurrection of all dead Christians and the transforming of our bodies to a glorified state.
        • The Final Judgement.
        • The Bible is God's revelation to man. It is authorative in all it teaches. It is His only written revelation and needs no addition.


        Anyone who denies the return of Christ, the future resurrection of the saints or that there will be a final judgement are IMO outside the fold of Christian orthodoxy.


        The last point I'm a bit hesitant about. I'm not sure what TM means by "needs no addition", so I can't affirm or deny it until he expounds on it.

        ETA: Made a little amendation to the list.
        Last edited by JonathanL; 03-29-2015, 08:36 PM.
        ~Formerly known as Chrawnus~

        Comment


        • #5
          I don't view inerrancy as an essential worth breaking fellowship over given how confusing the word can be. I prefer to say that the Bible is authoritative in what it teaches.
          "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
            I don't view inerrancy as an essential worth breaking fellowship over given how confusing the word can be. I prefer to say that the Bible is authoritative in what it teaches.
            That's probably a more apt description. I'm amending the list I stole from TM to reflect that.


            I do hold to the inerrancy of the original manuscripts however, I just don't think it's an essential doctrine.
            ~Formerly known as Chrawnus~

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Chrawnus View Post
              The last point I'm a bit hesitant about. I'm not sure what TM means by "needs no addition", so I can't affirm or deny it until he expounds on it.
              Probably referring to us Charismatics who believe that (along with the other gifts) that the gift of prophecy is still active today.

              I won't drag this off into a debate on that topic, but to note that 99% of us Charismatics do not consider the prophetic gift as being the equivalent to adding to Scripture. (you have the whackos, but they are whackos, so ignore them)
              "If you can ever make any major religion look absolutely ludicrous, chances are you haven't understood it"
              -Ravi Zacharias, The New Age: A foreign bird with a local walk

              Be watchful, stand firm in the faith, act like men, be strong.
              1 Corinthians 16:13

              "...he [Doherty] is no historian and he is not even conversant with the historical discussions of the very matters he wants to pontificate on."
              -Ben Witherington III

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Thoughtful Monk View Post
                I'm missing the context of the OP so at the risk of being totally off base, I'll respond...

                What I view as the essentials are:
                • God exists as a Trinity
                • He is Creator and Sustainer of all that is seen and unseen.
                • Jesus Christ was incarnate as fully God and fully man.
                • Jesus Christ paid for my sins by His sacrifice on the cross (aka Substitutionary Atonement)
                • On the third day, He was bodily Resurrected from grave. He later ascended to Heaven and is seated at the right hand of God.
                • The Bible is God's revelation to man. It is inerrant in the original manuscripts. It is His only written revelation and needs no addition.


                I think that's all I would consider essential.
                37818 thinks that Jesus had two natures before his incarnation, and believes that Jesus was not begotten of the Father, but is unoriginate. I believe that a correct Christology is essential, and his is manifestly not.
                Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. St. John Chrysostom

                Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
                sigpic
                I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by One Bad Pig View Post
                  37818 thinks that Jesus had two natures before his incarnation, and believes that Jesus was not begotten of the Father, but is unoriginate. I believe that a correct Christology is essential, and his is manifestly not.
                  First, please explain how either of those two interpretations contradicts any essential of the Christian faith.
                  Secondly, these are two issues, not simply one.


                  The Son of God as God is coeternal with God the Father.
                  ". . . understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me. I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour." -- Isaiah 43:10, 11.
                  God is not begotten.

                  All appearances of the LORD was always by way of the Son of God (John 1:18 NKJV; Luke 10:22). The invisible in nature is reveled by the one who also has a visible nature.

                  The Father, Son and Holy Spirit are the one LORD God (Mark 12:29).
                  . . . the Gospel of Christ, for it is [the] power of God to salvation to every [one] believing, . . . -- Romans 1:16.

                  . . . that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: . . . -- 1 Corinthians 15:3, 4.

                  Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: . . . -- 1 John 5:1.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Truthseeker View Post
                    :gasp: Dare we attempt to improve on Mere Christianity?:swoon:
                    As I recall it makes no mention of the Resurrection. That's hardly mere Christianity.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by chrawnus View Post
                      i would add to tm's list as follows.
                      Apostle's creed
                      tl;dr, ftfy.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Paprika View Post
                        tl;dr, ftfy.
                        ~Formerly known as Chrawnus~

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Chrawnus View Post
                          I would add to TM's list as follows.
                          • God exists as a Trinity
                          • He is Creator and Sustainer of all that is seen and unseen.
                          • Jesus Christ was incarnate as fully God and fully man.
                          • Jesus Christ paid for my sins by His sacrifice on the cross (aka Substitutionary Atonement)
                          • On the third day, He was bodily Resurrected from grave. He later ascended to Heaven and is seated at the right hand of God.
                          • The Return of Christ to judge and rule over all men.
                          • The resurrection of all dead Christians and the transforming of our bodies to a glorified state.
                          • The Final Judgement.
                          • The Bible is God's revelation to man. It is authorative in all it teaches. It is His only written revelation and needs no addition.


                          Anyone who denies the return of Christ, the future resurrection of the saints or that there will be a final judgement are IMO outside the fold of Christian orthodoxy.


                          The last point I'm a bit hesitant about. I'm not sure what TM means by "needs no addition", so I can't affirm or deny it until he expounds on it.

                          ETA: Made a little amendation to the list.
                          I like your additions. I'm not sure I would add much more. At some point, non-essentials start creeping in and try to be an essential.

                          "Needs no addition" = I'm trying to prevent something like the Book of Mormon being elevated to the same level as Scripture.
                          "For I desire mercy, not sacrifice, and acknowledgment of God rather than burnt offerings." Hosea 6:6

                          "Theology can be an intellectual entertainment." Metropolitan Anthony Bloom

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Thoughtful Monk View Post
                            "Needs no addition" = I'm trying to prevent something like the Book of Mormon being elevated to the same level as Scripture.
                            So basically that the canon is closed? I agree with that (though I'm not interested in debating anybody over it right now).
                            "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Thoughtful Monk View Post
                              "Needs no addition" = I'm trying to prevent something like the Book of Mormon being elevated to the same level as Scripture.
                              Why should that be necessary? The ancient Christians had no end of false 'gospels' but as far as I can tell there was no creedal statement on what the Scriptures include or exclude.

                              Comment

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