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This is the forum to discuss the spectrum of views within Christianity on God's foreknowledge and election such as Calvinism, Arminianism, Molinism, Open Theism, Process Theism, Restrictivism, and Inclusivism, Christian Universalism and what these all are about anyway. Who is saved and when is/was their salvation certain? How does God exercise His sovereignty and how powerful is He? Is God timeless and immutable? Does a triune God help better understand God's love for mankind?

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Repentance is the Gift Of God !

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  • footwasher
    replied
    Originally posted by brightfame52 View Post

    Invalid comment.
    Israel was given the opportunity to repent but it refused:

    Matt 11.21"Woe to you, Chorazin! Woe to you, Bethsaida! For if the miracles that were performed in you had been performed in Tyre and Sidon, they would have repented in ashes.

    Matt 23.37“Jerusalem, Jerusalem, who kills the prophets and stones those who have been sent to her! How often I wanted to gather your children together, the way a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, and you were unwilling.

    Leave a comment:


  • brightfame52
    replied
    Originally posted by footwasher View Post

    Nowhere it says people were reprogrammed to turn to God.
    Invalid comment.

    Leave a comment:


  • footwasher
    replied
    Originally posted by lee_merrill View Post

    God is the one who puts us in Christ, it is because of him that we trust Jesus:

    Source: John Piper

    “From God are you in Christ Jesus” (1 Corinthians 1:30). We did not graft ourselves into Christ. It is a gift of God. God put the key of faith in our heart. All boasting in self fades. Boasting in Christ pervades.

    © Copyright Original Source



    Blessings,
    Lee
    Good response. You see God being responsible for putting us in Christ.

    However, this is where a comparative study is useful.

    In a parallel situation, we can view the sequence like this:

    God was responsible for bringing Caleb into the Promised Land.

    Or:

    Caleb remembered God's great works, and it resulted in him believing God would fight the Amalekites for him, and in turn brought him into the Promised Land. Loyalty made him remember, changed him, made him have a different spirit, made him born again, made him see the goodness of the Land rather than the danger.

    And:

    Israel forgot God's great works, and it resulted in their not believing God would fight the Amalekites for them, and in turn prevented them from entering into the Promised Land. Disloyalty made them afraid, forget , prevented a change of spirit, prevented being born again, prevented being able to see the goodness of the Land, and made them focus only on the danger.

    Hebrews 3.19And so we see that they were not able to enter because of unbelief (Also Heb 4.6).

    Conclusion
    Belief (by the person) was responsible for bringing a person into Christ. If you don't have enough faith, you should ask for terms of peace.
    Last edited by footwasher; 02-17-2021, 05:44 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • lee_merrill
    replied
    Originally posted by footwasher
    Nowhere it says people were reprogrammed to turn to God.
    God is the one who puts us in Christ, it is because of him that we trust Jesus:

    Source: John Piper

    “From God are you in Christ Jesus” (1 Corinthians 1:30). We did not graft ourselves into Christ. It is a gift of God. God put the key of faith in our heart. All boasting in self fades. Boasting in Christ pervades.

    © Copyright Original Source



    Blessings,
    Lee

    Leave a comment:


  • footwasher
    replied
    Originally posted by brightfame52 View Post
    Repentance accompanies redemption by the blood of Christ. Isa 51:11 16

    11 Therefore the redeemed of the Lord shall return, and come with singing unto Zion; and everlasting joy shall be upon their head: they shall obtain gladness and joy; and sorrow and mourning shall flee away.

    Now even though this may have a historical fulfillment with children of israel, it also has an analogous fulfillment for Spiritual Israel, the Church/Body of Christ whom He redeemed by His Precious Blood 1 Pet 1:18-19

    18 Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers;

    19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot:

    Now notice the promise of the redeemed in Vs 11 they shall return. The word return here is shuwb and means:

    to return, turn back

    to turn back (to God), repent

    And the same is said of the redeemed in 1 Pet 2:25

    25 For ye were as sheep going astray; but are now returned unto the Shepherd and Bishop of your souls.

    The word returned epistrephō:
    1. to turn to
      1. to the worship of the true God
    2. to cause to return, to bring back
    Also the verb returned is in the passive voice which means:

    Represents the subject as being the recipient of the action. e.g., in the sentence, "we were comforted" the subject "we" receives the action

    So they were being returned by the redemption in Christ Jesus, which is their repentance towards God.

    So all whom Christ died for and redeemed by His Blood, shall be given repentance and returned back to God.
    Nowhere it says people were reprogrammed to turn to God.

    Leave a comment:


  • brightfame52
    replied
    Repentance accompanies redemption by the blood of Christ. Isa 51:11 16

    11 Therefore the redeemed of the Lord shall return, and come with singing unto Zion; and everlasting joy shall be upon their head: they shall obtain gladness and joy; and sorrow and mourning shall flee away.

    Now even though this may have a historical fulfillment with children of israel, it also has an analogous fulfillment for Spiritual Israel, the Church/Body of Christ whom He redeemed by His Precious Blood 1 Pet 1:18-19

    18 Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers;

    19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot:

    Now notice the promise of the redeemed in Vs 11 they shall return. The word return here is shuwb and means:

    to return, turn back

    to turn back (to God), repent

    And the same is said of the redeemed in 1 Pet 2:25

    25 For ye were as sheep going astray; but are now returned unto the Shepherd and Bishop of your souls.

    The word returned epistrephō:
    1. to turn to
      1. to the worship of the true God
    2. to cause to return, to bring back
    Also the verb returned is in the passive voice which means:

    Represents the subject as being the recipient of the action. e.g., in the sentence, "we were comforted" the subject "we" receives the action

    So they were being returned by the redemption in Christ Jesus, which is their repentance towards God.

    So all whom Christ died for and redeemed by His Blood, shall be given repentance and returned back to God.

    Leave a comment:


  • footwasher
    replied
    Originally posted by brightfame52 View Post
    Again Christ gives repentance as the risen Saviour Acts 5:30-31

    30 The God of our fathers raised up Jesus, whom ye slew and hanged on a tree. 31 Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.

    Two Gifts of the risen Saviour, that come from/out of Him are Repentance and Forgiveness of sins.

    Now Jesus Himself commands that these things be preached in His Name, because they flow from Him Lk 24:46-4711

    Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day: 47 and that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.

    Neither repentance nor forgiveness of sins have their source in man, but in Christ and His finished work !
    If Christ reprograms men to repent, why is repentance preached/demanded?

    Leave a comment:


  • brightfame52
    replied
    Again Christ gives repentance as the risen Saviour Acts 5:30-31

    30 The God of our fathers raised up Jesus, whom ye slew and hanged on a tree. 31 Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.

    Two Gifts of the risen Saviour, that come from/out of Him are Repentance and Forgiveness of sins.

    Now Jesus Himself commands that these things be preached in His Name, because they flow from Him Lk 24:46-4711

    Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day: 47 and that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.

    Neither repentance nor forgiveness of sins have their source in man, but in Christ and His finished work !

    Leave a comment:


  • footwasher
    replied
    Originally posted by brightfame52 View Post
    The unregenerate, who are in the flesh still, have no right to or no command to repent. All while in the flesh as natural men are bound to the Law, to do the whole Law as it was with Adam. So any command for men to repent as say in Acts 17:30 7

    30 And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:

    Its to the regenerate, who through the work of Christ and the Holy Spirit have been freed to be married to another. Rom 7:1-3

    Know ye not, brethren, (for I speak to them that know the law,) how that the law hath dominion over a man as long as he liveth?

    2 For the woman which hath an husband is bound by the law to her husband so long as he liveth; but if the husband be dead, she is loosed from the law of her husband.

    3 So then if, while her husband liveth, she be married to another man, she shall be called an adulteress: but if her husband be dead, she is free from that law; so that she is no adulteress, though she be married to another man.

    Now its only through the death of Christ for an individual are they free from the dominion of the law, however its a secret as who it is Christ died until born again by the Spirit. So even the unregenerate elect for whom Christ died, are bound to do the law. Until they are regenerate, the command to repent isnt for the unregenerate elect. All natural men are bound to and under the dominion of the Law.
    Boy! Your English is pretty bad. You should stick to copying and pasting from some good commentaries.

    Leave a comment:


  • brightfame52
    replied

    The unregenerate, who are in the flesh still, have no right to or no command to repent. All while in the flesh as natural men are bound to the Law, to do the whole Law as it was with Adam. So any command for men to repent as say in Acts 17:30 7

    30 And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:

    Its to the regenerate, who through the work of Christ and the Holy Spirit have been freed to be married to another. Rom 7:1-3

    Know ye not, brethren, (for I speak to them that know the law,) how that the law hath dominion over a man as long as he liveth?

    2 For the woman which hath an husband is bound by the law to her husband so long as he liveth; but if the husband be dead, she is loosed from the law of her husband.

    3 So then if, while her husband liveth, she be married to another man, she shall be called an adulteress: but if her husband be dead, she is free from that law; so that she is no adulteress, though she be married to another man.

    Now its only through the death of Christ for an individual are they free from the dominion of the law, however its a secret as who it is Christ died until born again by the Spirit. So even the unregenerate elect for whom Christ died, are bound to do the law. Until they are regenerate, the command to repent isnt for the unregenerate elect. All natural men are bound to and under the dominion of the Law.

    Leave a comment:


  • footwasher
    replied
    Originally posted by brightfame52 View Post

    What were the points I made that were wrong and you so called destroyed ?
    I have shown that God giving repentance to people does not mean He reprograms them. It means He gives people an OPPORTUNITY/CHANCE/PRIVILEGE to repent.

    Suppose your Master wants to punish you for disobedience. He can do it, because He is your Master. But, if He desires, He can forgive you. This is called giving you an opportunity to repent. The Bible says God gave Israel repentance. But the fact that Israel DID NOT repent means He did not reprogram Israel. He only gave her an OPPORTUNITY to repent.

    How hard is this to understand? Maybe you have to improve your English before you try to teach from the Bible.

    And use a modern Bible while you are about it;

    International Standard Version
    God has exalted to his right hand this very man as our Leader and Savior in order to extend repentance and forgiveness of sins to Israel.
    Last edited by footwasher; 02-14-2021, 12:34 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • brightfame52
    replied
    Originally posted by footwasher View Post

    In post#4 I showed why your points are wrong. It means I understood the point and destroyed it. If you want, you can return the compliment and show what is wrong with my reply.
    What were the points I made that were wrong and you so called destroyed ?

    Leave a comment:


  • footwasher
    replied
    Originally posted by brightfame52 View Post

    You still seem to be evading the points made. BTW the posts originate from me.
    In post#4 I showed why your points are wrong. It means I understood the point and destroyed it. If you want, you can return the compliment and show what is wrong with my reply.

    Leave a comment:


  • brightfame52
    replied
    Originally posted by footwasher View Post

    It seems you are just copying and pasting from some commentary without understanding what they are saying. Don't be a parrot, Brightfame52, receive the Holy Spirit and He will lead you into all truth. The Kingdom of God has come amongst men, and strong men are forcing their way in. You need the strength creating ministry of the Holy Spirit to help you get in the Kingdom. After that, drink the rain you receive through hearing and believing and bear fruit, produce vegetation, so that you get a new, courageous spirit, like Caleb. Don't be like cowardly Israel, who because of unbelief were not allowed to enter Rest.

    These things were written to help you avoid their mistakes.
    You still seem to be evading the points made. BTW the posts originate from me.

    Leave a comment:


  • brightfame52
    replied
    Originally posted by footwasher View Post

    1 Pet 1:3

    Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead.

    Sure, God gave us a real hope by raising Christ from the dead. It means His blood was effective. Through the blood of Christ the New Man in Christ, the Body of Christ was created. However, we still have to enter that New Man in Christ.

    In other words, there remains a rest to be entered for believers. So today if you hear His voice, make all effort to enter that Rest. Do not be like those in the wilderness who because of unbelief, failed to enter that Rest.

    Brightfame52, it requires courage like Abraham and Caleb, to have a different spirit, to enter that Rest. You need the Holy Spirit, which is like rain from Heaven, to get that courage. So please be like the believers in Acts 19, and obey Paul, obey John the Baptist, and hear and believe Jesus's words, so that you can receive the courage creating ministry of the Holy Spirit. Don't delay anymore because of ignorance.
    Do you understand the post points ?

    Leave a comment:

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