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Pope Francis the Rev False Prophet?

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  • Pope Francis the Rev False Prophet?

    I'm not one for jumping the gun with trying to identify bible personalities with folks in real-time and I used to hear this many years ago and pretty much shrugged it off as nonsense. But from his acceptance of gay marriage, climate change and aliens, to his call for a "new ecological and economic order," if there was ever a candidate for the false prophet that paves the way for the Beast of Rev, this guy takes the cake.
    "I was the CIA director. We lied, we cheated, we stole, it was like... we had entire training courses. It reminds you of the glory of the American experiment." - Mike Pompeo, Secretary of State (source).

  • #2


    Can you substantiate any of your accusations?
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    • #3
      Haha, I have been watching youtube videos claiming that in September he's going to reveal the presence of extra-terrestrials and claim they're the new saviors of humanity. Seems like every pope is the anti-christ, has there ever been a time when these guys were like "nah, this Pope's fine."
      "Some people feel guilty about their anxieties and regard them as a defect of faith but they are afflictions, not sins. Like all afflictions, they are, if we can so take them, our share in the passion of Christ." - That Guy Everyone Quotes

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      • #4
        Originally posted by seanD View Post
        I'm not one for jumping the gun with trying to identify bible personalities with folks in real-time and I used to hear this many years ago and pretty much shrugged it off as nonsense. But from his acceptance of gay marriage, climate change and aliens, to his call for a "new ecological and economic order," if there was ever a candidate for the false prophet that paves the way for the Beast of Rev, this guy takes the cake.
        Nah, this Pope's fine.

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        • #5
          Nah, this fine's pope.
          ~Formerly known as Chrawnus~

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          • #6
            lol Chrawnus..a little too eager (or a little too dyslexic?)..and a little too slow.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by seanD View Post
              I'm not one for jumping the gun with trying to identify bible personalities with folks in real-time and I used to hear this many years ago and pretty much shrugged it off as nonsense. But from his acceptance of gay marriage, climate change and aliens, to his call for a "new ecological and economic order," if there was ever a candidate for the false prophet that paves the way for the Beast of Rev, this guy takes the cake.
              Examination of what Pope Francis actually said will exonerate him.

              Pope Francis has never accepted gay marriage. As archbishop of Buenos Aires, he referred to same-sex marriage as an "anthropological regression," and the oft-quoted phrase, "who am I to judge," refers not to same sex marriage but to the possibility of gay seminarians or postulants to religious orders.

              Aliens: in response to a pure hypothetical about, if aliens existed, whether we should evangelize them, Pope Francis made the obvious answer, and the same answer that, to the best of my knowledge, most every credible theologian who has dedicated time and energy to the topic has reached.

              Climate change/ call for a new ecological and economic order: in calling for radical economic reform, Pope Francis is echoing every single pope for the last 120+ years: Popes have been publicly calling for more humane economic practices and structures since Pope Leo XIII issued Rerum Novarum in 1891. Papal critiques of capitalism, socialism, and the materialism that capitalism and communism hold in common have been quite consistent, and materialistic consumerism that cares little for ecological sustainability still drives our economy today.
              Don't call it a comeback. It's a riposte.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Spartacus View Post
                Examination of what Pope Francis actually said will exonerate him.

                Pope Francis has never accepted gay marriage. As archbishop of Buenos Aires, he referred to same-sex marriage as an "anthropological regression," and the oft-quoted phrase, "who am I to judge," refers not to same sex marriage but to the possibility of gay seminarians or postulants to religious orders.

                Aliens: in response to a pure hypothetical about, if aliens existed, whether we should evangelize them, Pope Francis made the obvious answer, and the same answer that, to the best of my knowledge, most every credible theologian who has dedicated time and energy to the topic has reached.

                Climate change/ call for a new ecological and economic order: in calling for radical economic reform, Pope Francis is echoing every single pope for the last 120+ years: Popes have been publicly calling for more humane economic practices and structures since Pope Leo XIII issued Rerum Novarum in 1891. Papal critiques of capitalism, socialism, and the materialism that capitalism and communism hold in common have been quite consistent, and materialistic consumerism that cares little for ecological sustainability still drives our economy today.
                I don't recall any other popes "echoing" the subjects this pope is focusing on and especially in the same manner. Can you give me some examples? Can you also give me examples of famous theologians espousing similar views about aliens? Thanks.

                Though you downplay it as nothing out of the ordinary, it seems both the liberals/progressives and conservatives don't think the same. I've never seen so much criticism leveled at him (on a political level at least) from conservatives. I DEFINITELY have never seen liberals swoon over a pope like this before.
                "I was the CIA director. We lied, we cheated, we stole, it was like... we had entire training courses. It reminds you of the glory of the American experiment." - Mike Pompeo, Secretary of State (source).

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by hamster View Post
                  Haha, I have been watching youtube videos claiming that in September he's going to reveal the presence of extra-terrestrials and claim they're the new saviors of humanity. Seems like every pope is the anti-christ, has there ever been a time when these guys were like "nah, this Pope's fine."
                  I know, right? I remember reading books by dispensationalists decades ago claiming pope would be the antichrist (or Beast of Rev to be specific). I always shirked it off as unlikely. I thought the False Prophet was possible, but never gave it much thought. Seems a bit tantalizing to me lately, especially with this pope and how he is wooing the left.
                  "I was the CIA director. We lied, we cheated, we stole, it was like... we had entire training courses. It reminds you of the glory of the American experiment." - Mike Pompeo, Secretary of State (source).

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by seanD View Post
                    I don't recall any other popes "echoing" the subjects this pope is focusing on and especially in the same manner. Can you give me some examples?
                    Can you give me specific examples of the statements by Pope Francis that you find so troubling? You've vaguely alluded to sound bytes, but not actually referenced any concrete instances. If you want to accuse someone of heresy, it'd be a good preliminary step to produce 1. the statement which you claim is heretical and 2. the principle of orthodoxy which it contradicts

                    Can you also give me examples of famous theologians espousing similar views about aliens? Thanks.
                    It's not a question many theologians have pondered, but when it comes down to it, I really don't know what alternative position one might advocate. If God has created other beings with free will and intellect and the desire for union with Him and membership in His Church, why wouldn't we baptize them if they asked? Find me another credible theological position that responds to the aliens hypothetical and we can talk

                    Though you downplay it as nothing out of the ordinary, it seems both the liberals/progressives and conservatives don't think the same. I've never seen so much criticism leveled at him (on a political level at least) from conservatives. I DEFINITELY have never seen liberals swoon over a pope like this before.
                    If you were around some 50 years ago while John XXIII was around or while Vatican II was going on, you'd know that this isn't the first time that the left has been fainting over a pope who they think is finally going to bring the church up to date. The thing is, they didn't understand John XXIII then and don't understand Francis now: they've projected onto him what they want to see without actually paying attention to what he actually believes or says, and the Right is buying into those distortions. If the Left likes him, the Right is duty-bound to deride him, but neither side is actually listening to the man.
                    Don't call it a comeback. It's a riposte.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Spartacus View Post
                      Can you give me specific examples of the statements by Pope Francis that you find so troubling? You've vaguely alluded to sound bytes, but not actually referenced any concrete instances. If you want to accuse someone of heresy, it'd be a good preliminary step to produce 1. the statement which you claim is heretical and 2. the principle of orthodoxy which it contradicts



                      It's not a question many theologians have pondered, but when it comes down to it, I really don't know what alternative position one might advocate. If God has created other beings with free will and intellect and the desire for union with Him and membership in His Church, why wouldn't we baptize them if they asked? Find me another credible theological position that responds to the aliens hypothetical and we can talk



                      If you were around some 50 years ago while John XXIII was around or while Vatican II was going on, you'd know that this isn't the first time that the left has been fainting over a pope who they think is finally going to bring the church up to date. The thing is, they didn't understand John XXIII then and don't understand Francis now: they've projected onto him what they want to see without actually paying attention to what he actually believes or says, and the Right is buying into those distortions. If the Left likes him, the Right is duty-bound to deride him, but neither side is actually listening to the man.
                      New ecological and economic order pricked my interest being that New World Order conspiracy theorists have always claimed that the final catalyst for this will be a radical global economic restructuring (and as of late, they claim climate change will also be part of this catalyst). I just thought it was an interesting and coincidental parallel with his statement, particularly since he used both subjects in the same context. Heretical is a little extreme. I wouldn't go that far, especially considering I don't really take the subject of the thread that serious... yet. And I most definitely have no interest getting into any long and mundane discussions about anything gay. The subject from a political view bores me to tears.

                      The Catholic church always seemed to be at the forefront of demonic belief, even when the protestant church grew lax in that belief. I don't think it would be out of the question to assume demonic activity or a demonic deception if mankind ever encountered intelligent beings claiming to be from another world, especially considering that it is so far removed from any sort of doctrine we can support from the bible. It just seems that he would at least acknowledge the possibility of deception from a theological standpoint somewhere in that hypothetical discussion.

                      As far as what you said in the last part of your post... fair enough.
                      "I was the CIA director. We lied, we cheated, we stole, it was like... we had entire training courses. It reminds you of the glory of the American experiment." - Mike Pompeo, Secretary of State (source).

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by seanD View Post
                        New ecological and economic order pricked my interest being that New World Order conspiracy theorists have always claimed that the final catalyst for this will be a radical global economic restructuring (and as of late, they claim climate change will also be part of this catalyst). I just thought it was an interesting and coincidental parallel with his statement, particularly since he used both subjects in the same context. Heretical is a little extreme. I wouldn't go that far, especially considering I don't really take the subject of the thread that serious... yet. And I most definitely have no interest getting into any long and mundane discussions about anything gay. The subject from a political view bores me to tears.
                        Our current economic order is pretty messed up on a number of levels. Anyone with any ideological or moral commitments worth mentioning should probably be open to some sort of restructuring or reform. The truly interesting questions relate to the substance of the proposition, not the simple fact of it. Saying that the antichrist will advocate for some sort of reform or restructuring is a bit like saying that the antichrist will have a nose, or ears, or will use verbal communication.

                        The Catholic church always seemed to be at the forefront of demonic belief, even when the protestant church grew lax in that belief. I don't think it would be out of the question to assume demonic activity or a demonic deception if mankind ever encountered intelligent beings claiming to be from another world, especially considering that it is so far removed from any sort of doctrine we can support from the bible. It just seems that he would at least acknowledge the possibility of deception from a theological standpoint somewhere in that hypothetical discussion.
                        Has any devil ever consented to being baptized? Before one is baptized, one must profess that one rejects Satan, and all his works, and all his empty promises. If nothing else, holy water tends to be used in exorcisms as well as baptisms, so I don't see what exactly the demons would gain by subjecting themselves to sacraments they have abhorred for the last 2000 years.
                        Don't call it a comeback. It's a riposte.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Spartacus View Post
                          Our current economic order is pretty messed up on a number of levels. Anyone with any ideological or moral commitments worth mentioning should probably be open to some sort of restructuring or reform. The truly interesting questions relate to the substance of the proposition, not the simple fact of it. Saying that the antichrist will advocate for some sort of reform or restructuring is a bit like saying that the antichrist will have a nose, or ears, or will use verbal communication.



                          Has any devil ever consented to being baptized? Before one is baptized, one must profess that one rejects Satan, and all his works, and all his empty promises. If nothing else, holy water tends to be used in exorcisms as well as baptisms, so I don't see what exactly the demons would gain by subjecting themselves to sacraments they have abhorred for the last 2000 years.
                          If you think the economic order is messed up now, you ain't seen nothing yet. I also never said "antichrist."
                          "I was the CIA director. We lied, we cheated, we stole, it was like... we had entire training courses. It reminds you of the glory of the American experiment." - Mike Pompeo, Secretary of State (source).

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by seanD View Post
                            I'm not one for jumping the gun with trying to identify bible personalities with folks in real-time and I used to hear this many years ago and pretty much shrugged it off as nonsense. But from his acceptance of gay marriage, climate change and aliens, to his call for a "new ecological and economic order," if there was ever a candidate for the false prophet that paves the way for the Beast of Rev, this guy takes the cake.
                            Umm
                            You know you missed something. Pope Francis had said at one point "Above all Christians must listen to Jesus." Also he does not accept gay marriage, nor does he accept abortion. Pope Benedict and Pope Francis have rightly pointed out that if aliens existed it would be a Christian's duty to evangelize to them. Pope Francis does accept Church law in that gays must be loved welcomed and should be celibate to be sinless. Nice way to read the media. BTW I am Confirmed Catholic not attending mass. I don't agree with the pope on everything but he's not exactly an infallible human. If he wants to believe in aliens or accept the possibility, he can!! It does NOT mean that every Catholic must. As far as clergy, I'm less apt to agree, however, the church at large may have something else in mind and certainly there has been a good celibate clergy whose had issues with sexuality men or women.

                            Pope's ok, your just looking to hard for the antichrist.
                            A happy family is but an earlier heaven.
                            George Bernard Shaw

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by seanD View Post
                              If you think the economic order is messed up now, you ain't seen nothing yet. I also never said "antichrist."
                              So I take it you have no more fuel in the tank with respect to Pope Francis being the fulfillment of anything in Revelation?

                              I've never really taken much interest in apocalyptic prophecies, but I know enough about them to know that they've never once been right, so I don't feel too bad about not knowing the difference between the false prophet and the antichrist
                              Don't call it a comeback. It's a riposte.

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