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Eschatology 201 Guidelines

This area of the forum is primarily for Christian theists to discuss orthodox views of Eschatology. Other theist participation is welcome within that framework, but only within orthodoxy. Posts from nontheists that do not promote atheism or seek to undermine the faith of others will be permitted at the Moderator's discretion - such posters should contact the area moderators before posting.


Without turning this forum into a 'hill of foreskins' (Joshua 5:3), I believe we can still have fun with this 'sensitive' topic.

However, don't be misled, dispensationalism has only partly to do with circumcision issues. So, let's not forget about Innocence, Conscience, Promises, Kingdoms and so on.

End time -isms within orthodox Christianity also discussed here. Clearly unorthodox doctrines, such as those advocating "pantelism/full preterism/Neo-Hymenaeanism" or the denial of any essential of the historic Christian faith are not permitted in this section but can be discussed in Comparative Religions 101 without restriction. Any such threads, as well as any that within the moderator's discretions fall outside mainstream evangelical belief, will be moved to the appropriate area.

Millennialism- post-, pre- a-

Futurism, Historicism, Idealism, and Preterism, or just your garden variety Zionism.

From the tribulation to the anichrist. Whether your tastes run from Gary DeMar to Tim LaHaye or anywhere in between, your input is welcome here.

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UN Like United Religions

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  • UN Like United Religions

    Saw this article yesterday: http://blogs.reuters.com/faithworld/...-pope-francis/ about Shimon Peres proposing a United Nation style organization of Religious Groups. The purpose is to fight against those who commit violence in the name of religion.

    For the first time in my life, I see a viable way for a one world religion to be established.

    The group would start by saying the violence in the name of religion like practiced by militant Islam is wrong. To be "fair" they would add in the violence committed by Hindus and Buddhist in Asia plus Christian Missionary violence against native peoples in the past. This would sound all well and good and acceptance of the group to judge religion would grow.

    Eventually they will start looking at beliefs of groups and say these can't be permitted either. You think you're religion is the only way to God, you're out. Male-only clergy is not acceptable. Eventually you could go to different religions and have style differences but not real difference in belief. The end result would not be a single world-wide denomination but multiple denominations all teaching the same thing under this umbrella organization.
    "For I desire mercy, not sacrifice, and acknowledgment of God rather than burnt offerings." Hosea 6:6

    "Theology can be an intellectual entertainment." Metropolitan Anthony Bloom

  • #2
    "Teaching the same thing"? Surely you meant that in a rather loose sense.
    The greater number of laws . . . , the more thieves . . . there will be. ---- Lao-Tzu

    [T]he truth I’m after and the truth never harmed anyone. What harms us is to persist in self-deceit and ignorance -— Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

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    • #3
      What is needed is an unquestionable moral authority that says in a strong voice ‘No, God does not want this and does not permit it’
      Yes, terrorism is completely wrong. But we don't need a para-governmental agency to speak on God's behalf to establish that. That sounds blasphemous.
      "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Truthseeker View Post
        "Teaching the same thing"? Surely you meant that in a rather loose sense.
        No. I mean in the sense that they will define what is valid religious beliefs and all groups will only teach those beliefs. It may also be a more man-centered religion. Most religious believe systems more or less describe man's relation to man the same - i.e. the Golden Rule. The differences between religions are almost always involve the groups' view of the nature of God and how God relates to man. A group like this could achieve religious unity by emphasizing the common man-to-man aspects and minimizing the God-to-man aspects. The latter would most easily be accomplished by deifying man. At that point, all religions would look pretty identical.

        By the way, I don't view this as a short term project. It would take a long time to get this into being. The article just impacted me because I for the first time read a credible starting point for such a project.
        "For I desire mercy, not sacrifice, and acknowledgment of God rather than burnt offerings." Hosea 6:6

        "Theology can be an intellectual entertainment." Metropolitan Anthony Bloom

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        • #5
          Are you sure that the Scriptures teach an upcoming one-world-religion? I am confident talk of a movement like this will remain talk and never materialize. You would do well not to partake in this, you will only be wasting your time. Go make disciples, articulate the gospel, and a live a life characterized by good deeds and you will be on the right track.

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          • #6
            I was reminded of what China is doing. They're trying to set up their own nationalism-friendly, state-sponsored version of the Christian church. This is an excellent spiritual opportunity for genuine Christians in China. Consider what happened in Germany that led to the Confessing Church.
            "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

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            • #7
              Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
              This is an excellent spiritual opportunity for genuine Christians in China. Consider what happened in Germany that led to the Confessing Church.
              You like to paint a rosy picture, don't you?

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              • #8
                Setting up an organization that "replaces" God in anyway! Compare 1 Samuel 8, when the people demanded a king.
                The greater number of laws . . . , the more thieves . . . there will be. ---- Lao-Tzu

                [T]he truth I’m after and the truth never harmed anyone. What harms us is to persist in self-deceit and ignorance -— Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Manwë Súlimo View Post
                  You like to paint a rosy picture, don't you?
                  *hums Always Look on the Bright Side of Life*
                  "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Get the US out of the UN. No more American money to them.
                    Micah 6:8 He has told you, O man, what is good; and what does the LORD require of you but to do justice, and to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God?

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Scrawly View Post
                      Are you sure that the Scriptures teach an upcoming one-world-religion? I am confident talk of a movement like this will remain talk and never materialize. You would do well not to partake in this, you will only be wasting your time. Go make disciples, articulate the gospel, and a live a life characterized by good deeds and you will be on the right track.
                      I would not get involved in a group like this as it is against what I believe. You may certainly be right that it is all talk. Given the current state of the world, I'm not sure that will stay talk.

                      I understand some interpretations of Revelation describe a one-world religious system. That is not the point of this thread and I have no interest in discussing whether or not Revelations says that.

                      We are also suppose to know the times in addition to what you list. Sometimes Christians get surprised when if they looked around they would have seen it coming.
                      "For I desire mercy, not sacrifice, and acknowledgment of God rather than burnt offerings." Hosea 6:6

                      "Theology can be an intellectual entertainment." Metropolitan Anthony Bloom

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
                        Yes, terrorism is completely wrong. But we don't need a para-governmental agency to speak on God's behalf to establish that. That sounds blasphemous.

                        You are right, we don't need the government to speak what God has already clearly said.

                        We are so use to separation of church and state that we forget its a relatively new idea (circa 1600 AD if memory serves) in human history. Its only really been practiced in the last 200 years or so. Before that I am not aware of a state that did not have an official religion and other religions present in the borders were somewhere been tolerated and persecuted.
                        "For I desire mercy, not sacrifice, and acknowledgment of God rather than burnt offerings." Hosea 6:6

                        "Theology can be an intellectual entertainment." Metropolitan Anthony Bloom

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
                          *hums Always Look on the Bright Side of Life*
                          *Joins in for the whistling part*

                          I'm always still in trouble again

                          "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                          "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Thoughtful Monk View Post
                            You are right, we don't need the government to speak what God has already clearly said.

                            We are so use to separation of church and state that we forget its a relatively new idea (circa 1600 AD if memory serves) in human history. Its only really been practiced in the last 200 years or so. Before that I am not aware of a state that did not have an official religion and other religions present in the borders were somewhere been tolerated and persecuted.
                            I think the history of Christianity suggests that state-sponsored churches are not a good idea, but I don't want to derail your thread so I'll just leave this there.
                            "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Thoughtful Monk View Post
                              I would not get involved in a group like this as it is against what I believe.
                              I meant not to get involved through speculation. You wrote: "By the way, I don't view this as a short term project. It would take a long time to get this into being." I believe this project of yours will be a waste of time if you choose to get involved in end-time speculation. Many people have done this and entire ministries revolve around this sort of speculation and very little good comes from it.

                              You may certainly be right that it is all talk. Given the current state of the world, I'm not sure that will stay talk.
                              The current state of the world is "fallen". This state has been unchanged for quite some time now.

                              I understand some interpretations of Revelation describe a one-world religious system. That is not the point of this thread and I have no interest in discussing whether or not Revelations says that.
                              Maybe it would be a good idea to see how rooted in Scripture this idea of a future one-world-religion actually is, because if there is no good justification for that view, then you will be misguided looking for end-time scenarios in current events and headlines in news sources.

                              We are also suppose to know the times in addition to what you list. Sometimes Christians get surprised when if they looked around they would have seen it coming.
                              Some people will continue to be hostile to the message of the gospel and others will be saved by it. The world will continue to go through ups and downs. Things are progressively getting better for the most part on a practical level, yet the spirit of the anti-Christ will remain active in its opposition to the spread of the gospel. We should indeed not be surprised by that.
                              Last edited by Scrawly; 09-07-2014, 04:27 AM.

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