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Eschatology 201 Guidelines

This area of the forum is primarily for Christian theists to discuss orthodox views of Eschatology. Other theist participation is welcome within that framework, but only within orthodoxy. Posts from nontheists that do not promote atheism or seek to undermine the faith of others will be permitted at the Moderator's discretion - such posters should contact the area moderators before posting.


Without turning this forum into a 'hill of foreskins' (Joshua 5:3), I believe we can still have fun with this 'sensitive' topic.

However, don't be misled, dispensationalism has only partly to do with circumcision issues. So, let's not forget about Innocence, Conscience, Promises, Kingdoms and so on.

End time -isms within orthodox Christianity also discussed here. Clearly unorthodox doctrines, such as those advocating "pantelism/full preterism/Neo-Hymenaeanism" or the denial of any essential of the historic Christian faith are not permitted in this section but can be discussed in Comparative Religions 101 without restriction. Any such threads, as well as any that within the moderator's discretions fall outside mainstream evangelical belief, will be moved to the appropriate area.

Millennialism- post-, pre- a-

Futurism, Historicism, Idealism, and Preterism, or just your garden variety Zionism.

From the tribulation to the anichrist. Whether your tastes run from Gary DeMar to Tim LaHaye or anywhere in between, your input is welcome here.

OK folks, let's roll!

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Why try to pinpoint the end times?

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  • Why try to pinpoint the end times?

    Obviously many Christians since the time of Jesus have been fascinated by trying to determine the timing of the end, more specifically, whether their generation seems to be the last one. From a practical perspective, what is the purpose of it? I don't see how it should have an effect on how we live our lives as Christians. We are to live holy lives as if Jesus could return at any time (thus the parable of the foolish virgins), so of course it could end at any time. What is the purpose of obsessing further? The only practical effect I can see of this is discrediting Christianity in the eyes of others if the predictions don't come true.
    "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

  • #2
    Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
    Obviously many Christians since the time of Jesus have been fascinated by trying to determine the timing of the end, more specifically, whether their generation seems to be the last one. From a practical perspective, what is the purpose of it? I don't see how it should have an effect on how we live our lives as Christians. We are to live holy lives as if Jesus could return at any time (thus the parable of the foolish virgins), so of course it could end at any time. What is the purpose of obsessing further? The only practical effect I can see of this is discrediting Christianity in the eyes of others if the predictions don't come true.
    We are commanded by the Lord Himself to "keep watch" and not be taken by surprised, as those living in darkness. In the time of tribulation, Christians will also have the responsibility of bearing witness to the truth in a time of "great deception."

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    • #3
      Originally posted by Darfius View Post
      We are commanded by the Lord Himself to "keep watch" and not be taken by surprised, as those living in darkness. In the time of tribulation, Christians will also have the responsibility of bearing witness to the truth in a time of "great deception."
      Wouldn't keeping watch involve being prepared at all times rather than engaging in the enterprise of speculation? (Obviously, if it were clear that the tribulation actually were going on, this would be different, but this is not the case.)
      "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

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      • #4
        I have serious doubt about whether the command to keep watch is really even dealing with a literal second coming. If that were all the command meant, then it would be irrelevant to the overwhelming majority of christians who do not make it until that point.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
          Wouldn't keeping watch involve being prepared at all times rather than engaging in the enterprise of speculation? (Obviously, if it were clear that the tribulation actually were going on, this would be different, but this is not the case.)
          If that were the case, what was the point of the signs given in the first place? Not just from Jesus and John, but Paul to the Thessalonians. Paul never told the Thessalonians they were wasting their time worrying about the end but corrected their misconceptions by giving them specific signs that were yet to occur.

          Also, your argument implies futurists aren't prepared at all times (that they slack off when they think the end is not near), which is no more the case than your Christian walk.
          "I was the CIA director. We lied, we cheated, we stole, it was like... we had entire training courses. It reminds you of the glory of the American experiment." - Mike Pompeo, Secretary of State (source).

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          • #6
            Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
            Wouldn't keeping watch involve being prepared at all times rather than engaging in the enterprise of speculation?
            Yes.
            "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

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            • #7
              Why have an eschatology thread if we're not supposed to discuss the end times?
              "I was the CIA director. We lied, we cheated, we stole, it was like... we had entire training courses. It reminds you of the glory of the American experiment." - Mike Pompeo, Secretary of State (source).

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              • #8
                Originally posted by seanD View Post
                Why have an eschatology thread if we're not supposed to discuss the end times?
                Discussing them is fine. Setting dates is futile.
                Mark 13:32“But about that day or hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father. 33Be on guard! Be alerte ! You do not know when that time will come.
                "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                  Discussing them is fine. Setting dates is futile.
                  Mark 13:32“But about that day or hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father. 33Be on guard! Be alerte ! You do not know when that time will come.
                  Where and when was a date set? I don't recall one being set here in this section since I've been here.
                  "I was the CIA director. We lied, we cheated, we stole, it was like... we had entire training courses. It reminds you of the glory of the American experiment." - Mike Pompeo, Secretary of State (source).

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by seanD View Post
                    Where and when was a date set? I don't recall one being set here in this section since I've been here.
                    Read the title of the thread, Sean. Focus on "pinpoint".
                    "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                      Read the title of the thread, Sean. Focus on "pinpoint".
                      You said we are not to set the day or hour of the Lord's return. To my knowledge, no one has done that here since I joined in 2008.
                      Last edited by seanD; 05-07-2014, 07:50 AM.
                      "I was the CIA director. We lied, we cheated, we stole, it was like... we had entire training courses. It reminds you of the glory of the American experiment." - Mike Pompeo, Secretary of State (source).

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
                        Obviously many Christians since the time of Jesus have been fascinated by trying to determine the timing of the end, more specifically, whether their generation seems to be the last one. From a practical perspective, what is the purpose of it? I don't see how it should have an effect on how we live our lives as Christians. We are to live holy lives as if Jesus could return at any time (thus the parable of the foolish virgins), so of course it could end at any time. What is the purpose of obsessing further? The only practical effect I can see of this is discrediting Christianity in the eyes of others if the predictions don't come true.
                        Because I'm not sure if he'll let me keep my new Alienware laptop?
                        Better to illuminate than merely to shine, to deliver to others contemplated truths than merely to contemplate.

                        -Thomas Aquinas

                        I love to travel, But hate to arrive.

                        -Hernando Cortez

                        What is the good of experience if you do not reflect?

                        -Frederick 2, Holy Roman Emperor

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by seanD View Post
                          You said we are not to set the day or hour of the Lord's return.
                          Actually, I said "setting dates is futile", and I quoted Jesus from Mark's account.

                          To my knowledge, no one has done that here since I joined in 2008.
                          I am not aware of anybody doing that, either, nor did I say they did. What I said was "setting dates is futile".
                          "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

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                          • #14
                            My take is that we all will meet Jesus soon. Because we all will die and go to be with him. So whether he comes back tomorrow or in 10,000 years, I will meet my Lord personally soon enough!

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by seanD View Post
                              You said we are not to set the day or hour of the Lord's return. To my knowledge, no one has done that here since I joined in 2008.
                              I'm not talking about setting a specific time (I've noticed date setters try to get around this by saying, it will happen this year, but we don't know what day!)... also a general time, such as your thread as to whether we are in the time of sorrows just preceding the tribulation.
                              "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

                              Comment

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