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Discussion on matters of general mainstream Christian churches. What are the differences between Catholics and protestants? How has the charismatic movement affected the church? Are Southern baptists different from fundamentalist baptists? It is also for discussions about the nature of the church.

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Baptism in Jesus’ name, Trinitarian style.

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  • #16
    Originally posted by Dave L View Post

    Any believer can baptize others.
    That is true.


    Phillip was appointed by the apostles to bear their gifts of healing.
    Really? Where does that story come from?
    1Cor 15:34 εκνηψατε δικαιως και μη αμαρτανετε αγνωσιαν γαρ θεου τινες εχουσιν προς εντροπην υμιν λεγω
    Come to your senses as you ought and stop sinning; for I say to your shame, there are some who know not God.
    .
    "when the church no longer teaches its people why they believe what they believe, the world will often step in and fill in the gaps." Ryan Danker

    "The synoptic gospels claim that Jesus was crucified on the 15th day of Nisan and buried on the 14th day of Nisan:" Majority Consensus

    Comment


    • #17
      Originally posted by tabibito View Post

      That is true.




      Really? Where does that story come from?
      The pivotal passage that answers this question indirectly is found in the “Great Commission” passage (Matthew 28:18-20). This passage records Jesus’ command to make disciples of all nations and includes baptizing as part of the process of making those disciples. If this commission is given to all Christians (as is commonly held), then it follows that the authority to baptize is also given to all Christians.

      https://www.gotquestions.org/baptize-who.html

      Comment


      • #18
        Originally posted by Dave L View Post

        The pivotal passage that answers this question indirectly is found in the “Great Commission” passage (Matthew 28:18-20). This passage records Jesus’ command to make disciples of all nations and includes baptizing as part of the process of making those disciples. If this commission is given to all Christians (as is commonly held), then it follows that the authority to baptize is also given to all Christians.

        https://www.gotquestions.org/baptize-who.html
        I already stipulated that any Christian can baptise others into Christ - I asked where you got the story that "Philip was appointed by the apostles to bear their gifts of healing." According to Paul, which of the gifts of the Spirit are bestowed on an individual is decided at God's sole discretion.
        1Cor 15:34 εκνηψατε δικαιως και μη αμαρτανετε αγνωσιαν γαρ θεου τινες εχουσιν προς εντροπην υμιν λεγω
        Come to your senses as you ought and stop sinning; for I say to your shame, there are some who know not God.
        .
        "when the church no longer teaches its people why they believe what they believe, the world will often step in and fill in the gaps." Ryan Danker

        "The synoptic gospels claim that Jesus was crucified on the 15th day of Nisan and buried on the 14th day of Nisan:" Majority Consensus

        Comment


        • #19
          Originally posted by tabibito View Post

          I already stipulated that any Christian can baptise others into Christ - I asked where you got the story that "Philip was appointed by the apostles to bear their gifts of healing." According to Paul, which of the gifts of the Spirit are bestowed on an individual is decided at God's sole discretion.
          If you pay close attention in Acts, only the Apostles spoke in tongues or healed. Along with those they laid their hands on. Once you absorb this, Philip was one of the table waiters they laid hands on so they could preach the word. Cornelius had his own outpouring of the Spirit in Peter's presence.

          Comment


          • #20
            Originally posted by Dave L View Post

            If you pay close attention in Acts, only the Apostles spoke in tongues or healed. Along with those they laid their hands on. Once you absorb this, Philip was one of the table waiters they laid hands on so they could preach the word. Cornelius had his own outpouring of the Spirit in Peter's presence.
            Is Acts 10:44-47 not in your copy of the Bible? "It happened in the presence of Peter" but he did not lay hands on them to receive the Holy Spirit - which you have stipulated was necessary.

            Nor have you taken into account the whole Pentecost event as recorded in Acts 2.

            More to the point - what is in Acts that annuls Paul's exposition?

            Last edited by tabibito; 01-09-2022, 08:40 AM.
            1Cor 15:34 εκνηψατε δικαιως και μη αμαρτανετε αγνωσιαν γαρ θεου τινες εχουσιν προς εντροπην υμιν λεγω
            Come to your senses as you ought and stop sinning; for I say to your shame, there are some who know not God.
            .
            "when the church no longer teaches its people why they believe what they believe, the world will often step in and fill in the gaps." Ryan Danker

            "The synoptic gospels claim that Jesus was crucified on the 15th day of Nisan and buried on the 14th day of Nisan:" Majority Consensus

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by tabibito View Post

              Is Acts 10:44-47 not in your copy of the Bible? Nor the whole Pentecost event as recorded in Acts 2.

              More to the point - what is in Acts that annuls Paul's exposition?
              You do not understand Acts. Spend some time with it, It's hard to understand. But only the Apostles could speak in tongues and give the gifts to others through their hands.

              Comment


              • #22
                Paul refers to other people speaking in tongues and even has to give them rules on how to do so in an orderly manner.
                If it weren't for the Resurrection of Jesus, we'd all be in DEEP TROUBLE!

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by Christianbookworm View Post
                  Paul refers to other people speaking in tongues and even has to give them rules on how to do so in an orderly manner.
                  He laid hands on them.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Dave L View Post

                    You do not understand Acts. Spend some time with it, It's hard to understand. But only the Apostles could speak in tongues and give the gifts to others through their hands.
                    "Only the apostles could speak in tongues"?

                    Acts 19:6 And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Spirit came on them, and they began speaking with tongues and prophesying.

                    Was everyone present and exercising the gifts an apostle?

                    Why are you pretending that Acts is the final authority on matters that it doesn't even address?
                    1Cor 15:34 εκνηψατε δικαιως και μη αμαρτανετε αγνωσιαν γαρ θεου τινες εχουσιν προς εντροπην υμιν λεγω
                    Come to your senses as you ought and stop sinning; for I say to your shame, there are some who know not God.
                    .
                    "when the church no longer teaches its people why they believe what they believe, the world will often step in and fill in the gaps." Ryan Danker

                    "The synoptic gospels claim that Jesus was crucified on the 15th day of Nisan and buried on the 14th day of Nisan:" Majority Consensus

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by tabibito View Post

                      "Only the apostles could speak in tongues"?

                      Acts 19:6 And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Spirit came on them, and they began speaking with tongues and prophesying.

                      Was everyone present and exercising the gifts an apostle?

                      Why are you pretending that Acts is the final authority on matters that it doesn't even address?
                      I said the Apostles and those they laid hands on.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by Dave L View Post

                        I said the Apostles and those they laid hands on.
                        You said "But only the Apostles could speak in tongues and give the gifts to others" OK - maybe it was a typo, but Peter didn't lay his hands on anyone when he was with Cornelius, so your story won't float there, either. So what will you do? Change the story to "only people who were in the presence of apostles"?

                        And that still won't get you out of the quagmire that you create by ignoring the record of scripture as a whole. Or do you contend that Paul's accounts are not authoritative?
                        1Cor 15:34 εκνηψατε δικαιως και μη αμαρτανετε αγνωσιαν γαρ θεου τινες εχουσιν προς εντροπην υμιν λεγω
                        Come to your senses as you ought and stop sinning; for I say to your shame, there are some who know not God.
                        .
                        "when the church no longer teaches its people why they believe what they believe, the world will often step in and fill in the gaps." Ryan Danker

                        "The synoptic gospels claim that Jesus was crucified on the 15th day of Nisan and buried on the 14th day of Nisan:" Majority Consensus

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by Dave L View Post

                          You do not understand Acts. Spend some time with it, It's hard to understand. But only the Apostles could speak in tongues and give the gifts to others through their hands.
                          No. It really isn't. You just need to pretend it is to continue with your contradictory claims.

                          I'm always still in trouble again

                          "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                          "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
                          "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                            No. It really isn't. You just need to pretend it is to continue with your contradictory claims.
                            True enough. I recommend Luke and Acts for people who enquire about Christianity - those accounts are quite easy to understand.
                            1Cor 15:34 εκνηψατε δικαιως και μη αμαρτανετε αγνωσιαν γαρ θεου τινες εχουσιν προς εντροπην υμιν λεγω
                            Come to your senses as you ought and stop sinning; for I say to your shame, there are some who know not God.
                            .
                            "when the church no longer teaches its people why they believe what they believe, the world will often step in and fill in the gaps." Ryan Danker

                            "The synoptic gospels claim that Jesus was crucified on the 15th day of Nisan and buried on the 14th day of Nisan:" Majority Consensus

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                              Unless Acts 8:16 has been removed from the Bible you are clearly incorrect.
                              They were baptized in the name of Jesus. Just as all believers up until the Antichrist gave you and others your method. The Baptism of the Holy Spirit came only through an apostle's hand, Cornelius being the exception.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by Dave L View Post

                                They were baptized in the name of Jesus. Just as all believers up until the Antichrist gave you and others your method. The Baptism of the Holy Spirit came only through an apostle's hand, Cornelius being the exception.
                                They were baptizing in Jesus' name "because the Holy Spirit had not yet come on any of them" yet. Afterwards...

                                I'm always still in trouble again

                                "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                                "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
                                "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

                                Comment

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