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dee dee thread derail

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  • dee dee thread derail

    Originally posted by Catholicity
    Okay, first of all I've seen some pretty interesting cases in divorces, i.e abandoning spouses that cannot be reached, spouses who have affairs, abuse, etc. Simply letting the marriage go without repercussion is sometimes the only justice available. And these are actually the majority more so than the minority of "irreconcilable differences." So unless you've been there you don't actually have a clue about it.
    I'm not sure how your divorce makes you any more qualified to talk about divorces in general than me. I know of multiple divorced individuals offline. All of them ended due to "irreconcilable differences". The only place I've found people where they didn't has been on the Internet.

    In some states if you can't afford a lawyer, legal aid won't help you. Its kind of a take what you can, hide for a year, and then file, and that may be your best option if you don't have money. That's the legal system. Oh well.
    Opposing no fault divorce is hardly the same as supporting the status quo. In fact the status quo probably contributes to the above type of scenario.


    Secondly yes more than one thing changed from the OT to the New. And the biggest one is forgiveness.
    Yes, there's no forgiveness in the OT.

    By your logic everyone should be put to death for sinning.
    First, I'm not sure what you mean by "my logic". The OT didn't put you to death "for sinning", they put you to death for breaking particular laws, of which same sex intercourse was one.
    Second, I don't want to put anyone to death over homosexuality (I'm fine with executing adulterers though). I was explaining why KG's rationale was flawed. Though at least he has a rationale. You just have incoherent screeching.

    Well as a matter of fact there were numerous sins in the OT that called for death in the OT. The wages of sin is death. But because of Jesus, we can turn ourselves around and get forgiveness. Saying someone should be stoned for x y or z sin, you might as well call for death for every sin. Grow up.
    Not all sins are equal, so no, there is no alternate universe in which I would propose this, nor could my words be interpreted as such by any but the most dense of individuals.
    "As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths." Isaiah 3:12

    There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.

  • #2
    Originally posted by Dee Dee Warren
    In our culture we are not a Christian theocracy. I do not support the criminalization of adultery, homosexuality, etc.
    I don't particularly support criminalizing homosexuality, though given how busy gay organizations are trampling on other people's rights to not say anything they might find offensive and employ vicious attacks to shut down any shred of dissent, my sole reaction to its criminalization would be to laugh my behind off.

    Adultery is different though. I think the primary culprit of of modern social dysfunction has been the destruction of loyalty as a meaningful concept (at all levels, from family and friends down to the country you live in), largely by expanding it into globalist drivel where everybody is equally loyal to everybody (and thus not actually loyal to anything). I don't think this has much to do specifically with Christianity and is, in fact, a serious issue even if Christianity isn't true. The criminalization of adultery, while generally associated with religious fundamentalists, can be quite easily defended on secular grounds.
    "As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths." Isaiah 3:12

    There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Darth Executor View Post
      I don't particularly support criminalizing homosexuality, though given how busy gay organizations are trampling on other people's rights to not say anything they might find offensive and employ vicious attacks to shut down any shred of dissent, my sole reaction to its criminalization would be to laugh my behind off.

      Adultery is different though. I think the primary culprit of of modern social dysfunction has been the destruction of loyalty as a meaningful concept (at all levels, from family and friends down to the country you live in), largely by expanding it into globalist drivel where everybody is equally loyal to everybody (and thus not actually loyal to anything). I don't think this has much to do specifically with Christianity and is, in fact, a serious issue even if Christianity isn't true. The criminalization of adultery, while generally associated with religious fundamentalists, can be quite easily defended on secular grounds.
      Well, she is right. For said stuff to be criminalized, God would have to be recognized as the legal head of state in the form of being declared the state religion, which is impossible for the U.S.
      Better to illuminate than merely to shine, to deliver to others contemplated truths than merely to contemplate.

      -Thomas Aquinas

      I love to travel, But hate to arrive.

      -Hernando Cortez

      What is the good of experience if you do not reflect?

      -Frederick 2, Holy Roman Emperor

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by TimelessTheist View Post
        Well, she is right. For said stuff to be criminalized, God would have to be recognized as the legal head of state in the form of being declared the state religion, which is impossible for the U.S.
        China is not particularly Christian.

        I'll throw in that Stalin, who is not exactly known for his theological musings, also criminalized homosexuality.
        "As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths." Isaiah 3:12

        There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.

        Comment


        • #5
          People who would enact their own laws basically think they are smarter than God, or else more noble. If we are going to punish adultery via fault-based divorce law, like Dee Dee advocates, then why not go all the way? Because God was too mean, and we are better than him?

          Comment


          • #6
            Adultery should be criminalized. It can at least be classified under emotional abuse.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Obsidian View Post
              People who would enact their own laws basically think they are smarter than God, or else more noble. If we are going to punish adultery via fault-based divorce law, like Dee Dee advocates, then why not go all the way? Because God was too mean, and we are better than him?
              You were the poster who believed that speed limits were unbiblical because they added to God's law, right?
              "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by KingsGambit
                You were the poster who believed that speed limits were unbiblical because they added to God's law, right?
                The mosaic law does not condone punishing people for negligence that doesn't lead to damage. And I use the word "negligence" loosely, because most speed limits are set arbitrarily low for the purpose of generating revenue, and have little to do with negligence. Giving legislative power to man is a recipe for corruption.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Darth Executor View Post
                  I don't particularly support criminalizing homosexuality ...
                  So were you joking or using exaggeration rhetorically (or something else?) when you said yesterday that you thought 'convicted homosexuals should be executed'?

                  By the way, I can't find that post of yours. Was it deleted perhaps?

                  I do not want to start a pointless argument, but I do admire some very insightful points you make sometimes while at other times I am appalled at some of your statements (as you know). Thus, I am merely trying to understand you better.
                  Last edited by robrecht; 02-22-2014, 01:14 PM.
                  βλέπομεν γὰρ ἄρτι δι᾿ ἐσόπτρου ἐν αἰνίγματι, τότε δὲ πρόσωπον πρὸς πρόσωπον·
                  ἄρτι γινώσκω ἐκ μέρους, τότε δὲ ἐπιγνώσομαι καθὼς καὶ ἐπεγνώσθην.

                  אָכֵ֕ן אַתָּ֖ה אֵ֣ל מִסְתַּתֵּ֑ר אֱלֹהֵ֥י יִשְׂרָאֵ֖ל מוֹשִֽׁיעַ׃

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Obsidian
                    I think convicted homosexuals should be stoned to death. If we are going to let them live anyway, letting them "marry" each other does not make a huge difference except that it adds insult to injury and makes the government somewhat complicit in their perversion. (To the people who say that the government should have nothing to do with marriage, I wonder if they would say the same for every other contract and fraud.)

                    Anyway, I agree with Dee Dee. I also think adulterers should be killed, by the way.
                    I was not exaggerating.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Was David sinning when he enacted a new law that remained "to this day" in 1 Samuel 30:25?
                      "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        No, but Israel was sinning when it asked for a king. Anyway, all that "law" did was set up a system for how to divide up the spoils.

                        Deuteronomy 20:14
                        But the women, and the little ones, and the cattle, and all that is in the city, even all the spoil thereof, shalt thou take unto thyself; and thou shalt eat the spoil of thine enemies, which the Lord thy God hath given thee.

                        The spoils were going to be divided one way or another. An administrative decision had to be made for how to do it. I don't see how David's decision would add to the law. All it did was implement it.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by robrecht View Post
                          So were you joking or using exaggeration rhetorically (or something else?) when you said yesterday that you thought 'convicted homosexuals should be executed'?

                          By the way, I can't find that post of yours. Was it deleted perhaps?
                          Wasn't my post, that's probably the main reason why you can't find it.
                          "As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths." Isaiah 3:12

                          There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Darth Executor View Post
                            Wasn't my post, that's probably the main reason why you can't find it.
                            Oh, good, glad to hear it. Sorry for the misrepresentation!
                            Last edited by robrecht; 02-23-2014, 02:18 PM.
                            βλέπομεν γὰρ ἄρτι δι᾿ ἐσόπτρου ἐν αἰνίγματι, τότε δὲ πρόσωπον πρὸς πρόσωπον·
                            ἄρτι γινώσκω ἐκ μέρους, τότε δὲ ἐπιγνώσομαι καθὼς καὶ ἐπεγνώσθην.

                            אָכֵ֕ן אַתָּ֖ה אֵ֣ל מִסְתַּתֵּ֑ר אֱלֹהֵ֥י יִשְׂרָאֵ֖ל מוֹשִֽׁיעַ׃

                            Comment

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