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  • #16
    Originally posted by JohnnyP View Post
    Don't you think it would be better just to do stuff like I do,
    I would rather have a root canal without anesthesia than be like you.

    talk about religion for free,
    Most of the ministry I have done in my life has been "for free" -- I have worked other jobs for income.

    rather than make a business of it where you have to worry about licensing by the government
    We are not licensed by the government --- where in the world do you get your information, and why are you so consistently and profoundly wrong.

    and paying lawyers and all that crap?
    Who said anything about paying lawyers? They serve us for free. You know... "wise as serpents and harmless as doves".

    John 15:18 If the world hate you, ye know that it hated me before it hated you.
    Yeah, always throw in a Bible verse in attempt to make your bad logic look spiritual.

    I really don't get the notion of some Christians that they ought to be able to fit in with the world. They ought to stay out of it much as possible.
    I really don't get the notion of some Christians spouting off on things they know nothing about. They ought to stay out of it as much as possible.
    The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

    Comment


    • #17
      Originally posted by Adrift View Post
      Makes me wonder how far we are from a future where Christianity in the Western world becomes a sort of underground movement. Where Christians, deciding to no longer to be a part of a system that is forced to sanctify unholy unions, unplugs from the system. Maybe couples would go to their pastors and priests to have their unions religiously sanctified, and then go to a court to get the union officiated. Basically letting the world have the word "marriage", and letting them do whatever they want to do, and call it whatever they want to call it, but keeping the concept of Christian marriage holy. Hopefully Christ comes back before we come to that, but who knows?
      I have a feeling that the pendulum may swing back some before it totally goes too far, but who knows. What's interesting is that Christianity seems to be winning the war, at least to some degree, on abortion, but totally losing it on homosexuality.
      The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

      Comment


      • #18
        Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
        I have a feeling that the pendulum may swing back some before it totally goes too far, but who knows. What's interesting is that Christianity seems to be winning the war, at least to some degree, on abortion, but totally losing it on homosexuality.
        Yeah, I think its possible that the pendulum could swing back. I think we already see that with some of the new religious movements popping up. As much as Scientism and the New Atheist movement would love to shut up religion altogether, people are spiritual beings, and children have a reputation of rebelling against the ideology of their parents.

        That aside, what do you mean that Christians seem to be winning the war on abortion? I don't follow the news too closely, so maybe I missed something.

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Adrift View Post
          Yeah, I think its possible that the pendulum could swing back. I think we already see that with some of the new religious movements popping up. As much as Scientism and the New Atheist movement would love to shut up religion altogether, people are spiritual beings, and children have a reputation of rebelling against the ideology of their parents.

          That aside, what do you mean that Christians seem to be winning the war on abortion? I don't follow the news too closely, so maybe I missed something.
          I think the momentum has changed. For example, Wendy Davis in Texas tried to make it a major issue, and she lost INCREDIBLY badly. Many of the liberals who ran on "the war on Women" also lost badly. It doesn't resonate anymore. It's overused. Women are beginning to realize it's silly to be seen only for their "reproductive rights" potential.

          Also, I think technology is helping us here --- when families have the ability to hang pictures (sonograms) of their new unborn baby brother or sister on the fridge, and there's actual "movies" of the unborn tiny baby sucking its thumb, or tiny unborn twins hugging each other, it makes it FAR more difficult to argue that's "just tissue".
          The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

          Comment


          • #20
            I have to humbly disagree about us winning that war, CP.... abortion is still a national epidemic. It's dipped some but is still very high.
            "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

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            • #21
              Originally posted by Adrift View Post
              Makes me wonder how far we are from a future where Christianity in the Western world becomes a sort of underground movement. Where Christians, deciding to no longer to be a part of a system that is forced to sanctify unholy unions, unplugs from the system. Maybe couples would go to their pastors and priests to have their unions religiously sanctified, and then go to a court to get the union officiated. Basically letting the world have the word "marriage", and letting them do whatever they want to do, and call it whatever they want to call it, but keeping the concept of Christian marriage holy. Hopefully Christ comes back before we come to that, but who knows?
              Or just not go to a court at all. Many states recognize common law marriages of people who cohabit long-term. As long as a couple is married in the eyes of the church, I don't think they'd much care whether it was state-sanctioned or not. It's not as if society much cares if one's birth is "legitimate" these days.
              Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom

              Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
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              I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

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              • #22
                I am afraid I agree with KG on this. It is not about political resonance. It is about the filthy moral state in this once great United States.
                Micah 6:8 He has told you, O man, what is good; and what does the LORD require of you but to do justice, and to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God?

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
                  I have to humbly disagree about us winning that war, CP.... abortion is still a national epidemic. It's dipped some but is still very high.
                  Sure it's still a major problem, and maybe I'm being overly optimistic, and only reflecting what's been going on in Texas. I tried to double check some of my sources, but the !#@!^#!#$ graphs are done in shades of green, and I can't tell which is which cause I'm colorblind.

                  Our Church is actively involved in a local pregnancy center, so maybe I'm just "too close to the problem".
                  The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Originally posted by One Bad Pig View Post
                    Or just not go to a court at all. Many states recognize common law marriages of people who cohabit long-term. As long as a couple is married in the eyes of the church, I don't think they'd much care whether it was state-sanctioned or not. It's not as if society much cares if one's birth is "legitimate" these days.
                    In the 39 years Mrs CP and I have been married, we have never had to show our "marriage license" a single time for anything.
                    The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Jedidiah View Post
                      I am afraid I agree with KG on this. It is not about political resonance. It is about the filthy moral state in this once great United States.
                      Not to start a fight or anything but could you pick a year you think the US was morally 'great'.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by Jedidiah View Post
                        I am afraid I agree with KG on this. It is not about political resonance. It is about the filthy moral state in this once great United States.
                        I don't know,when I was born in '65 Jim Crow was just being abolished. I'm not sure I agree with those who long for the good old days...

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                          I really don't get the notion of some Christians spouting off on things they know nothing about. They ought to stay out of it as much as possible.
                          Trying to fit preaching in with the "system of things" can be a distraction from what I see, that's all I'm saying in reference to the OP.

                          I want to add that I respect you put your life on the line to protect others as a policeman, that you quit when something conflicted with your morals, and that you apparently devoted a lot of the rest of your life to preaching. Nobody can take that away, you are a good man.

                          I just wanted to discuss it objectively. I apologize where I offended you personally. Where I did I was wrong. I feel bad for making you feel bad. I'm sorry.
                          Last edited by JohnnyP; 12-04-2014, 08:21 PM.

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                            Sure it's still a major problem, and maybe I'm being overly optimistic, and only reflecting what's been going on in Texas. I tried to double check some of my sources, but the !#@!^#!#$ graphs are done in shades of green, and I can't tell which is which cause I'm colorblind.

                            Our Church is actively involved in a local pregnancy center, so maybe I'm just "too close to the problem".
                            I think it's a good thing that people like you who are on the front lines of the issue haven't become jaded... that even in the midst of darkness, God is still working.
                            "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Abortion in my state did take a big hit a few years ago when Dr. Tiller's clinic closed, but the circumstances aren't anything I want to rejoice over (DE, don't bother).
                              "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by pancreasman View Post
                                Not to start a fight or anything but could you pick a year you think the US was morally 'great'.
                                There was a time when America at least paid lip service to Christian morality. If our modern media is any indication, we stopped pretending years ago.

                                Comment

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