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The discovery of Mark Driscoll's 2000 Internet postings

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  • The discovery of Mark Driscoll's 2000 Internet postings

    Does this sort of thing matter now that it's been 14 years and he's somewhat distanced himself from the past?

    Here is a link: Language/content warning. http://www.patheos.com/blogs/warrent...sified-nation/

    My main issue is that his "apology" seemed to have been more about his volume than his content, so to speak. That, and what is posted here is not all that far removed from much of his more recent theology, though it's not as crudely put.

    Overall, I have not seen the best of fruit from this church.
    "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

  • #2
    As an aside, this really reads like something from a men's rights forum like what Elliott Rodger hung out on.
    "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

    Comment


    • #3
      I don't have a problem with what he said - I agree...
      Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
        As an aside, this really reads like something from a men's rights forum like what Elliott Rodger hung out on.
        I suppose poisoning the well before the thread even gets started is one way to go.
        "As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths." Isaiah 3:12

        There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by seer View Post
          I don't have a problem with what he said - I agree...
          The coarse language is a pretty blatant violation of Ephesians 4:29.
          "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

          Comment


          • #6
            Briefly went through article, Driscoll comes off like a dumb raging oaf but he's basically right about the, err, kittified church. One of the more common complaints I hear from many ex-Christians and atheists is that Christians are essentially neutered, getting overrun by liberals without putting up any fight, surrendering the lives and souls of their neighbours in expectation of some distant reward for themselves. They then blame the Bible for this, using the exact same type of interpretations someone like Spartacus might use to come up with convoluted ways to explain why it's not ok to fight back in virtually every circumstance. It's hard to fault their logic and though I correct the biblical errors wherever I can the latter's ultimately futile if all Christians display is the former.
            "As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths." Isaiah 3:12

            There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
              The coarse language is a pretty blatant violation of Ephesians 4:29.
              "Behold, I will corrupt your seed, and spread dung upon your faces, even the dung of your solemn feasts; and one shall take you away with it."

              Now if that's not edifying I don't know what is.
              "As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths." Isaiah 3:12

              There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
                The coarse language is a pretty blatant violation of Ephesians 4:29.
                I'm pretty sure cussing is not what that verse is talking about.
                Better to illuminate than merely to shine, to deliver to others contemplated truths than merely to contemplate.

                -Thomas Aquinas

                I love to travel, But hate to arrive.

                -Hernando Cortez

                What is the good of experience if you do not reflect?

                -Frederick 2, Holy Roman Emperor

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by TimelessTheist View Post
                  I'm pretty sure cussing is not what that verse is talking about.
                  I don't mean cussing, I mean the coarse sexual/slang references throughout.
                  "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
                    I don't mean cussing, I mean the coarse sexual/slang references throughout.
                    That's the cussing...
                    "As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths." Isaiah 3:12

                    There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      IIRC he has apologised for a lot of his earlier behaviour. After John Piper kinda took him under his wing for a bit he toned a fair bit of his rhetoric down.

                      I don't advocate everything Driscoll has said or done, nor do I agree with him on a few items, but I've personally benefited from a number of his sermon series (even where I've disagreed with him)

                      I certainly don't agree with the language he used, and the sentiments could have been communicated without the crudity. But by the same token when I was a RCC we had priest who would swear in his sermons on a number of occasions (to be fair to Fr Jabulani, English wasn't his first language, isiZulu was).
                      "If you can ever make any major religion look absolutely ludicrous, chances are you haven't understood it"
                      -Ravi Zacharias, The New Age: A foreign bird with a local walk

                      Be watchful, stand firm in the faith, act like men, be strong.
                      1 Corinthians 16:13

                      "...he [Doherty] is no historian and he is not even conversant with the historical discussions of the very matters he wants to pontificate on."
                      -Ben Witherington III

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Raphael View Post
                        IIRC he has apologised for a lot of his earlier behaviour. After John Piper kinda took him under his wing for a bit he toned a fair bit of his rhetoric down.

                        I don't advocate everything Driscoll has said or done, nor do I agree with him on a few items, but I've personally benefited from a number of his sermon series (even where I've disagreed with him)
                        He was truer to his calling and more descriptive of the details of living in the nation of effeminates then than he is now, that much is certain. Now that the rot has spread farther and is mostly undeniable, you can find more scholarly descriptions of it among people like Dalrock. The posts are an endearing reminder of the time and the attitude that if you just posted the truth as you saw it hard enough, you could turn things around. Alas, it is never that simple, the people actually responsible for and profiting off of the evil and emasculating system have to be fired, executed, replaced, and very occasionally deeply convicted of the wrongness of their previous actions (usually by the prior firings, executions, replacements, etc.) for a new order to arise, not simply denounced randomly and anonymously. But let us not judge the man who felt himself alone in his visions too harshly.

                        I certainly don't agree with the language he used, and the sentiments could have been communicated without the crudity. But by the same token when I was a RCC we had priest who would swear in his sermons on a number of occasions (to be fair to Fr Jabulani, English wasn't his first language, isiZulu was).
                        There aren't a lot of conservative upsides to full-time immigrant pastors, but that's definitely one of them.

                        In short, you could have listened to Mark back then, and made this whole 'restoration' process easier. Now you have me.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Where is this apology that you're referring to?
                          Watch your links! http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/fa...corumetiquette

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            There aren't a lot of conservative upsides to full-time immigrant pastors, but that's definitely one of them.
                            ummm isiZulu was his main language because this was back when I used to live in South Africa.
                            And the priest we had after Fr Jabulani had to retire (sadly a small problem with alcohol) was also a Zulu but was fluent in over 10 languages. He learnt French while living in the Vatican, but the only language he and his teacher had in common at the time was Latin.
                            "If you can ever make any major religion look absolutely ludicrous, chances are you haven't understood it"
                            -Ravi Zacharias, The New Age: A foreign bird with a local walk

                            Be watchful, stand firm in the faith, act like men, be strong.
                            1 Corinthians 16:13

                            "...he [Doherty] is no historian and he is not even conversant with the historical discussions of the very matters he wants to pontificate on."
                            -Ben Witherington III

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by DesertBerean View Post
                              Where is this apology that you're referring to?
                              Not sure right now DB, it may have been in one of his books I read. I do remember it wasn't a specific apology, but a general one about his previous actions.
                              "If you can ever make any major religion look absolutely ludicrous, chances are you haven't understood it"
                              -Ravi Zacharias, The New Age: A foreign bird with a local walk

                              Be watchful, stand firm in the faith, act like men, be strong.
                              1 Corinthians 16:13

                              "...he [Doherty] is no historian and he is not even conversant with the historical discussions of the very matters he wants to pontificate on."
                              -Ben Witherington III

                              Comment

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