Announcement

Collapse

Christianity 201 Guidelines

orthodox Christians only.

Discussion on matters of general mainstream evangelical Christian theology that do not fit within Theology 201. Have some spiritual gifts ceased today? Is the KJV the only viable translation for the church today? In what sense are the books of the bible inspired and what are those books? Church government? Modern day prophets and apostles?

This forum is primarily for Christians to discuss matters of Christian doctrine, and is not the area for debate between atheists (or those opposing orthodox Christianity) and Christians. Inquiring atheists (or sincere seekers/doubters/unorthodox) seeking only Christian participation and having demonstrated a manner that does not seek to undermine the orthodox Christian faith of others are also welcome, but must seek Moderator permission first. When defining “Christian” or "orthodox" for purposes of this section, we mean persons holding to the core essentials of the historic Christian faith such as the Trinity, the Creatorship of God, the virgin birth, the bodily resurrection of Christ, the atonement, the future bodily return of Christ, the future bodily resurrection of the just and the unjust, and the final judgment. Persons not holding to these core doctrines are welcome to participate in the Comparative Religions section without restriction, in Theology 201 as regards to the nature of God and salvation with limited restrictions, and in Christology for issues surrounding the person of Christ and the Trinity. Atheists are welcome to discuss and debate these issues in the Apologetics 301 forum without such restrictions.

Additionally and rarely, there may be some topics or lines of discussion that within the Moderator's discretion fall so outside the bounds of mainstream orthodox doctrine (in general Christian circles or in the TheologyWeb community) or that deny certain core values that are the Christian convictions of forum leadership that may be more appropriately placed within Unorthodox Theology 201. NO personal offense should be taken by such discretionary decision for none is intended. While inerrancy is NOT considered a requirement for posting in this section, a general respect for the Bible text and a respect for the inerrantist position of others is requested.

The Tweb rules apply here like they do everywhere at Tweb, if you haven't read them, now would be a good time.

Forum Rules: Here
See more
See less

The Leaven in Matt 13:33

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #31
    Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post

    Birds frequently represent evil in scripture. Rocks are inanimate objects. We build our house on the solid rock - representing Christ - so rocks are more likely to represent solid ground, not evil.

    Leaven, on the other hand, never appears in scripture as a good thing, except for here, if you want to see it that way.
    I just take more stock in the imagery of Daniel 4. In that passage, the birds are merely shown to be dependent on the fruit of the trees for sustenance. They were not destroying the tree. The general trend in the passage is to more clearly describe the good (and previously unknown) attributes of the kingdom. Since Jesus is the sower here. So this is the time while Jesus was still among the disciples.

    The bigger imagery of Daniel 4 seems more relevant than some other connections of birds that people might find. I do presently lack a sense of which passages on birds creates this general impression that the birds represent bad things.

    The general concern I have is that certain perceived symbols may improperly influence the interpretation of passages. It would be like relying much on numerology (of the form that 7 is perfection, 6 is man's imperfection) to interpret passages.

    A similar error occurs, even among scholars, when interpreting Romans. The scholars find certain themes in the early passages and then assume that these early passages introduce points that will be discussed later on.

    Comment


    • #32
      Originally posted by mikewhitney View Post

      I just take more stock in the imagery of Daniel 4. In that passage, the birds are merely shown to be dependent on the fruit of the trees for sustenance. They were not destroying the tree. The general trend in the passage is to more clearly describe the good (and previously unknown) attributes of the kingdom. Since Jesus is the sower here. So this is the time while Jesus was still among the disciples.

      The bigger imagery of Daniel 4 seems more relevant than some other connections of birds that people might find. I do presently lack a sense of which passages on birds creates this general impression that the birds represent bad things.

      The general concern I have is that certain perceived symbols may improperly influence the interpretation of passages. It would be like relying much on numerology (of the form that 7 is perfection, 6 is man's imperfection) to interpret passages.

      A similar error occurs, even among scholars, when interpreting Romans. The scholars find certain themes in the early passages and then assume that these early passages introduce points that will be discussed later on.
      Yeah, I'd say that goes for the birds, as we see the very notable exception of the Holy Spirit descending on Jesus in the form of a dove - I got that.
      That's not just a case of "the birds doing no damage" but the bird representing Divinity itself.

      Jesus being recorded by a Jew speaking to a Jewish audience using leaven as an example of something good, however, is far more singular and stands out as 'opposite'.
      "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

      Comment


      • #33
        Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post

        Yeah, I'd say that goes for the birds, as we see the very notable exception of the Holy Spirit descending on Jesus in the form of a dove - I got that.
        That's not just a case of "the birds doing no damage" but the bird representing Divinity itself.

        Jesus being recorded by a Jew speaking to a Jewish audience using leaven as an example of something good, however, is far more singular and stands out as 'opposite'.
        i'm not finding a summary of the negative significance of leaven yet.

        Comment


        • #34
          Originally posted by mikewhitney View Post

          i'm not finding a summary of the negative significance of leaven yet.
          I'm not sure what you're referring to. I think leaven as evil goes to one of the old Testament festivals (I can't remember which) where the Israelites were instructed to remove all leaven from their homes.
          "For I desire mercy, not sacrifice, and acknowledgment of God rather than burnt offerings." Hosea 6:6

          "Theology can be an intellectual entertainment." Metropolitan Anthony Bloom

          Comment


          • #35
            Originally posted by mikewhitney View Post
            i'm not finding a summary of the negative significance of leaven yet.
            The "negative significance"? What does that even mean?

            Just real quick....

            Ex 12:15 Seven days shall ye eat unleavened bread; even the first day ye shall put away leaven out of your houses: for whosoever eateth leavened bread from the first day until the seventh day, that soul shall be cut off from Israel.
            EX 12:19 Seven days shall there be no leaven found in your houses: for whosoever eateth that which is leavened, even that soul shall be cut off from the congregation of Israel, whether he be a stranger, or born in the land.
            EX 12:20 Ye shall eat nothing leavened; in all your habitations shall ye eat unleavened bread.
            Ex 12:34 And the people took their dough before it was leavened, their kneadingtroughs being bound up in their clothes upon their shoulders.
            Ex 12:39 And they baked unleavened cakes of the dough which they brought forth out of Egypt, for it was not leavened; because they were thrust out of Egypt, and could not tarry, neither had they prepared for themselves any victual.
            Ex 13:3 And Moses said unto the people, Remember this day, in which ye came out from Egypt, out of the house of bondage; for by strength of hand the Lord brought you out from this place: there shall no leavened bread be eaten.
            Ex 13:7 Unleavened bread shall be eaten seven days; and there shall no leavened bread be seen with thee, neither shall there be leaven seen with thee in all thy quarters.
            Ex 23:18 Thou shalt not offer the blood of my sacrifice with leavened bread; neither shall the fat of my sacrifice remain until the morning.
            Ex 34:25 Thou shalt not offer the blood of my sacrifice with leaven; neither shall the sacrifice of the feast of the passover be left unto the morning.
            Lev 2:11 No meat offering, which ye shall bring unto the Lord, shall be made with leaven: for ye shall burn no leaven, nor any honey, in any offering of the Lord made by fire.
            Lev 6:17 It shall not be baken with leaven. I have given it unto them for their portion of my offerings made by fire; it is most holy, as is the sin offering, and as the trespass offering.
            Lev 7:13 Besides the cakes, he shall offer for his offering leavened bread with the sacrifice of thanksgiving of his peace offerings.
            Lev 10:12 And Moses spake unto Aaron, and unto Eleazar and unto Ithamar, his sons that were left, Take the meat offering that remaineth of the offerings of the Lord made by fire, and eat it without leaven beside the altar: for it is most holy:
            Lev 23:17 Ye shall bring out of your habitations two wave loaves of two tenth deals; they shall be of fine flour; they shall be baken with leaven; they are the firstfruits unto the Lord.
            Deut 16:3 Thou shalt eat no leavened bread with it; seven days shalt thou eat unleavened bread therewith, even the bread of affliction; for thou camest forth out of the land of Egypt in haste: that thou mayest remember the day when thou camest forth out of the land of Egypt all the days of thy life.
            Deut 16:4 And there shall be no leavened bread seen with thee in all thy coast seven days; neither shall there any thing of the flesh, which thou sacrificedst the first day at even, remain all night until the morning.
            Hosea 7:4 They are all adulterers, as an oven heated by the baker, who ceaseth from raising after he hath kneaded the dough, until it be leavened.
            Amos 4:5 And offer a sacrifice of thanksgiving with leaven, and proclaim and publish the free offerings: for this liketh you, O ye children of Israel, saith the Lord God.
            Matt 13:33 Another parable spake he unto them; The kingdom of heaven is like unto leaven, which a woman took, and hid in three measures of meal, till the whole was leavened.
            Matt 16:6 Then Jesus said unto them, Take heed and beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and of the Sadducees.
            Matt 16:11 How is it that ye do not understand that I spake it not to you concerning bread, that ye should beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and of the Sadducees?
            Matt 16:12 Then understood they how that he bade them not beware of the leaven of bread, but of the doctrine of the Pharisees and of the Sadducees.
            Mark 8:15 And he charged them, saying, Take heed, beware of the leaven of the Pharisees, and of the leaven of Herod.
            Luke 12:1 In the mean time, when there were gathered together an innumerable multitude of people, insomuch that they trode one upon another, he began to say unto his disciples first of all, Beware ye of the leaven of the Pharisees, which is hypocrisy.
            Luke 13:21 It is like leaven, which a woman took and hid in three measures of meal, till the whole was leavened.
            1 Cor 5:6 Your glorying is not good. Know ye not that a little leaven leaveneth the whole lump?
            1 Cor 5:7 Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us:
            1 Cor 5:8 Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.
            Gal 5:9 A little leaven leaveneth the whole lump.


            That's just a collection I've worked up since starting to study this. In some cases, it's actually OK to bring leavened bread as a peace offering, for example, but for Passover it was forbidden.



            "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

            Comment


            • #36
              Originally posted by Thoughtful Monk View Post

              I'm not sure what you're referring to. I think leaven as evil goes to one of the old Testament festivals (I can't remember which) where the Israelites were instructed to remove all leaven from their homes.
              CowPoke just posted a bunch of verses mentioning leaven. The symbolism of the leavened was primarily about the passover -- representing the inability to wait for the bread to rise.

              I see more of the use of leaven as widespread influence. I think the negative behaviors of boasting or false doctrines happen to be the effects that are seen to spread out like this -- more than sound doctrine.

              This is much like gossip. Gossip will tend to spread faster than praise of people. So we would not talk about the leaven of praise as much as we would speak of the leaven of gossip. So i don't find leaven as holding the negative connotation in itself nor in the parables of the mysteries in Matt 13.

              I think what has happened is that the NT interpretation of leaven has been read into the OT passages. While I do recognize that prophecies in the OT can be understood in their fulfillment of details found in the NT, this reinterpretation of the OT leaven passages may not be reasonable.
              Last edited by mikewhitney; 03-05-2021, 05:18 PM.

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by Thoughtful Monk View Post

                I'm not sure what you're referring to. I think leaven as evil goes to one of the old Testament festivals (I can't remember which) where the Israelites were instructed to remove all leaven from their homes.
                Yes, and that concept carries over into the NT where we're warned about the "leaven" that corrupts the teaching of the Gospel, false prophets, etc.
                Again, since Jesus was speaking to a Jewish audience, they would be quite familiar with the notion that unleavened bread was a 'biggie'.

                And the "festival" to which you refer includes Passover, where Jesus becomes our eternal sacrificial Lamb. He "repurposed" Passover into the Last Supper.
                "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

                Comment


                • #38
                  So, one more time - I don't intend using this as a "your interpretation is WRONG - this is the right one".

                  What I intend to do is, like I have done in other situations where there's more than one interpretation, say....

                  "Here's the way this is normally interpreted (even, in this case, by majority), but here's an alternate interpretation".

                  That's what I've found a number of the commentaries do - some of them indicating a preference one way or the other, and some of them simply offering both views for consideration.
                  "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Just adding my two scents ... uh, cents, here.

                    Going back to what Paul stated,

                    Your boasting is not good. Do you not know that a little leaven leavens the whole lump of dough? Clean out the old leaven so that you may be a new lump, just as you are in fact unleavened. For Christ our Passover also has been sacrificed. Therefore let us celebrate the feast, not with old leaven, nor with the leaven of malice and wickedness, but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth. (1 Corinthians 5:6-8, NASB)
                    Likewise Galatians 5:9,

                    A little leaven leavens the whole lump of dough. (Galatians 5:9, NASB)
                    That context could lead to the impression that leaven, or hametz in the Hebrew, represents sin or evil. I take it in the context of what is said in the Babylonian Talmud,

                    R. Dimi was sitting and reciting this statement [of R. Samuel b. R. Isaac] when Abaye said to him: Are then all forbidden substances of the Torah neutralized only in hundred-fold? Surely we have learnt: With regard to what did they say that every [substance of terumah] which leavens, or flavours, or is mixed with [common food], must be treated with stringency? . . . With regard to homogeneous substances there is always stringency – thus if wheaten leaven [of terumah] fell into wheaten dough [of common food], and there was sufficient of it to leaven the dough, it is forbidden, whether there was so little of the leaven as to be neutralized in a hundred and one, it is forbidden, whether it could leaven the dough or not. Can it then be said that both the first and second clauses are [alike in that neutralization takes place only] in a hundred? – No, the first clause deals with neutralization and one, whereas the second clause deals with neutralization in a hundred. Why is it then, where there were a hundred and one times [the quantity of the forbidden leaven], even though it can still leaven the dough, that it is not neutralized? He [R. Dimi] remained silent. Said [Abaye] to him: Perhaps it is different with leaven for leaven is very sharp! (Babylonian Talmud, Tractate Chullin, folio 99a-b)
                    Another quote, from the Mishnah of the Talmud (indicated in the Soncino translation of R. Dr. Isidore Epstein by uppercase text):

                    [IN THE CASE OF] A SPECIES [MIXED] WITH [SOMETHING] NOT ITS [LIKE] SPECIES. IN WHAT [DEFINED] MANNER [OF A MIXTURE OF SPECIES, SHOULD ONE RULE STRINGENTLY]? IF LEAVEN OF WHEAT FELL INTO DOUGH OF WHEAT AND THERE BE OF IT [THE ADMIXTURE] A QUANTITY SUFFICIENTLY [LARGE] TO CAUSE FERMENTATION, [THEN] WHETHER THERE BE OF IT A QUANTITY SUFFICIENTLY [SMALL] TO BECOME NEUTRALIZED IN ONE-HUNDRED-AND-ONE, OR THERE BE OF IT [A QUANTITY] NOT SUFFICIENTLY [SMALL] TO BECOME NEUTRALIZED IN ONE-HUNDRED-AND-ONE, IT [THE MIXTURE] IS PROHIBITED; [ALSO] IF THERE BE OF IT [THE ADMIXTURE] A QUANTITY NOT SUFFICIENTLY [SMALL] TO BECOME NEUTRALIZED IN ONE-HUNDRED-AND-ONE, [THEN] WHETHER THERE BE OF IT [A QUANTITY] SUFFICIENTLY [LARGE] TO CAUSE FERMENTATION, OR THERE BE OF IT [A QUANTITY] NOT SUFFICIENTLY [LARGE] TO CAUSE FERMENTATION, [THE MIXTURE] IS [LIKEWISE] PROHIBITED. (Tractate Orlah, Chapter 2, Mishnah 6, bracketed text by translator)
                    The popular thought is that hametz is yeast. Actually it's fermented bread or dough, possibly but not necessarily by yeast. Jesus was well familiar with what He called the Mishnah, or repetition or tradition of the Pharisees. So was Paul, himself a Pharisee up to the time he was arrested in Jerusalem. (Acts 23:6) The teaching quoted above is that mixing one part of hametz with 100 parts of matzo, or unfermented bread, yields 101 parts of fermented bread. Which is what Paul was stating.

                    I sometimes tell people that the reason Jesus chose twelve disciples was so that they would outnumber the leaven of the Pharisees (Mt. 16:6; Mk 8:15, Lk. 12:1).
                    Last edited by Faber; 03-05-2021, 05:34 PM.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by Faber View Post
                      Just adding my two scents ... uh, cents, here.
                      I LOVE the scent of fresh baking bread! When we lived in Tyler Texas, we lived about a block away from Mrs Baird's bakery!

                      Seriously, though, thanks for weighing in.

                      "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                        So, one more time - I don't intend using this as a "your interpretation is WRONG - this is the right one".

                        What I intend to do is, like I have done in other situations where there's more than one interpretation, say....

                        "Here's the way this is normally interpreted (even, in this case, by majority), but here's an alternate interpretation".

                        That's what I've found a number of the commentaries do - some of them indicating a preference one way or the other, and some of them simply offering both views for consideration.
                        I try to clarify ... and a little bit to persuade. I generally do not expect anyone to be convinced. I know from the get-go on that my understanding differs from others -- but it is on strong grounds that I have found this view. (Of course, this understanding cannot be challenged until I share it more officially and widespread.)

                        here is one commentary view on this
                        Source: France, R. T. Matthew: An Introduction and Commentary. Vol. 1. Downers Grove, InterVarsity, 1985. Tyndale New Testament Commentaries.


                        The yeast (13:33). The theme is again of contrast between the tiny quantity of yeast and the size of its effect. Three measures of meal would be about 40 litres, which would make enough bread for a meal for 100 people, a remarkable baking for an ordinary woman, but it makes the point vividly! Leaven (yeast) is usually in the Bible a symbol for the pervasive power of evil, but it is its pervasiveness, not its metaphorical connections, which is in view here. Hid is not the natural verb here, and must be designed to emphasize the secret, inconspicuous way the kingdom of heaven begins to take effect.
                        So the three parables of growth all focus on the paradox of insignificant or hidden beginnings and a triumphant climax.

                        © Copyright Original Source



                        The only thing I found similar to the three measures here is in Abraham's encounter with the 3 men -- where he prepared a meal for them. I don't know if I would still find that comparison valid, but this is what I remember. (The conversion to pounds or liters can interrupt the discovery of even this unsettled observation.)

                        Note that the Tyndale commentary series seems to be sufficiently compatible with an evangelical viewpoint -- trusting the integrity of scripture and the connection with Christ being raised from the dead

                        Here's another commentary
                        Most translations refer to her as using “yeast,” but this is not strictly accurate. Leaven was a piece of last week’s dough, which certainly made this week’s dough rise, but was not strictly “yeast.” Some exegetes hold that leaven must be taken as a symbol for evil on the grounds that this is the way it is to be understood in the Old Testament (Morgan, for example). But this is not invariably the case, for leaven was sometimes specified for use in sacrificial offerings (Lev. 7:13; 23:17–18). That in some contexts it may be used as a symbol for evil forces does not mean that in others it cannot stand for what is good. We should take this parable as making much the same point as the previous one; they reinforce one another. Jesus speaks of the woman as putting her piece of leaven into three measures of flour85 (the quantity used by Sarah, Gen. 18:6; Gideon, Judg. 6:19; and Hannah, 1 Sam. 1:24) until the whole was leavened. The leaven was but a small amount, but in time it changed the large quantity of flour

                        Morris, Leon. The Gospel according to Matthew. Grand Rapids: Eerdmans, 1992. The Pillar New Testament Commentary.
                        Or this one:
                        Thus the text does not describe what a farmer’s wife ordinarily does. For the hearers of Jesus this image probably was again a great surprise. Leaven is not one of the metaphors that demonstrates a relationship to the kingdom of God. In fact, the Passover rituals would lead one to think of something negative. What is leavened is to be removed during the Passover celebration and is useless for sacrifice. However, this association is probably not at all important, for Jesus is speaking ... of baking bread.... The issue is rather that leaven is hidden in the flour but irresistibly leavens a large amount of flour. Thus it is with the kingdom of God. Once the “leaven” is in it, an irresistible process leads to excessive fullness. In this parable the idea of “growth” is more central than it is in the parable of the mustard seed; in my view its closest parallel is the parable of the seed growing by itself.

                        Luz, Ulrich. Matthew: A Commentary. Ed. Helmut Koester. Minneapolis: Augsburg, 2001. Hermeneia—a Critical and Historical Commentary on the Bible.
                        I generally find Hermeneia to have too much scholarly focused discussions. This text seems okay.

                        Hope this is of interest.
                        Last edited by mikewhitney; 03-05-2021, 05:49 PM.

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by mikewhitney View Post

                          That would take us into the discussion of the parable of the sower and the seed. If we say the birds were evil, then we would have to say the rocks were evil too. If I can use another distraction, I may start a different thread on the parables.
                          If you want to start a parable thread, please go ahead. I'm interested to see what you have to say.
                          "For I desire mercy, not sacrifice, and acknowledgment of God rather than burnt offerings." Hosea 6:6

                          "Theology can be an intellectual entertainment." Metropolitan Anthony Bloom

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Originally posted by mikewhitney View Post

                            I try to clarify ... and a little bit to persuade. I generally do not expect anyone to be convinced. I know from the get-go on that my understanding differs from others -- but it is on strong grounds that I have found this view. (Of course, this understanding cannot be challenged until I share it more officially and widespread.)

                            here is one commentary view on this
                            Source: France, R. T. Matthew: An Introduction and Commentary. Vol. 1. Downers Grove, InterVarsity, 1985. Tyndale New Testament Commentaries.


                            The yeast (13:33). The theme is again of contrast between the tiny quantity of yeast and the size of its effect. Three measures of meal would be about 40 litres, which would make enough bread for a meal for 100 people, a remarkable baking for an ordinary woman, but it makes the point vividly! Leaven (yeast) is usually in the Bible a symbol for the pervasive power of evil, but it is its pervasiveness, not its metaphorical connections, which is in view here. Hid is not the natural verb here, and must be designed to emphasize the secret, inconspicuous way the kingdom of heaven begins to take effect.
                            So the three parables of growth all focus on the paradox of insignificant or hidden beginnings and a triumphant climax.

                            © Copyright Original Source



                            The only thing I found similar to the three measures here is in Abraham's encounter with the 3 men -- where he prepared a meal for them. I don't know if I would still find that comparison valid, but this is what I remember. (The conversion to pounds or liters can interrupt the discovery of even this unsettled observation.)

                            I've heard it explained that the three measures would be enough to last them a month for their long journey. That sounds about right. one meal for 100 people or 33 meals for each of the three visitors.

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post

                              I LOVE the scent of fresh baking bread! When we lived in Tyler Texas, we lived about a block away from Mrs Baird's bakery!

                              Seriously, though, thanks for weighing in.
                              Maybe we need a bread thread -- but without the rhymes.

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by Faber View Post
                                Just adding my two scents ... uh, cents, here.

                                Going back to what Paul stated,



                                Likewise Galatians 5:9,



                                That context could lead to the impression that leaven, or hametz in the Hebrew, represents sin or evil. I take it in the context of what is said in the Babylonian Talmud,



                                Another quote, from the Mishnah of the Talmud (indicated in the Soncino translation of R. Dr. Isidore Epstein by uppercase text):



                                The popular thought is that hametz is yeast. Actually it's fermented bread or dough, possibly but not necessarily by yeast. Jesus was well familiar with what He called the Mishnah, or repetition or tradition of the Pharisees. So was Paul, himself a Pharisee up to the time he was arrested in Jerusalem. (Acts 23:6) The teaching quoted above is that mixing one part of hametz with 100 parts of matzo, or unfermented bread, yields 101 parts of fermented bread. Which is what Paul was stating.

                                I sometimes tell people that the reason Jesus chose twelve disciples was so that they would outnumber the leaven of the Pharisees (Mt. 16:6; Mk 8:15, Lk. 12:1).
                                Can you tell whether these refer to a negative assessment about leaven in general or about the bread which qualifies for the passover, feast of unleavened bread and the unleavened sacrifices? These quotes reflect the extreme lengths of interpretations that were being done to explain how to meet the requirements of the Mosaic Law. The real problem on this respect would have concerned people who intend to make the bread leavened -- to intentionally deviate from the design of the passover feasts.

                                I generally have not been impressed by the contributions of post-first-century writings on the interpretation of scripture. Maybe the best instances occur where clearer parallels are identified -- or some of these later writings which contextually would have been a first century practice (or viewpoint). This is not to disregard some benefits by Sanders in 1977 with his arguments against some improper characterizations of first-century Judaism.

                                Comment

                                Related Threads

                                Collapse

                                Topics Statistics Last Post
                                Started by Christian3, 04-12-2021, 12:01 PM
                                4 responses
                                43 views
                                0 likes
                                Last Post Christian3  
                                Started by Bill the Cat, 04-08-2021, 11:06 AM
                                22 responses
                                221 views
                                0 likes
                                Last Post NorrinRadd  
                                Started by rogue06, 04-04-2021, 06:59 AM
                                3 responses
                                31 views
                                3 likes
                                Last Post Cerebrum123  
                                Started by Cow Poke, 04-01-2021, 10:22 AM
                                8 responses
                                64 views
                                0 likes
                                Last Post NorrinRadd  
                                Started by Cow Poke, 04-01-2021, 07:22 AM
                                26 responses
                                108 views
                                1 like
                                Last Post Christianbookworm  
                                Working...
                                X