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Ohio bill and ectopic pregnancies?

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  • Ohio bill and ectopic pregnancies?

    I have heard that Ohio's heartbeat bill effectively bans the treatment of ectopic pregnancies, which are fatal for women if untreated. I haven't been able to hear the pro-life side of this but I am rather concerned. Has anybody heard more?
    "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

  • #2
    I'll try to look into it after Church - I would hope there are some exceptions, just like exceptions to abortion in the case of the mother's life being in actual danger. Maybe by that time, somebody else will have answered.
    "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

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    • #3
      The embryo dies of prematurity. Undesired side effect of trying to save the mom.
      If it weren't for the Resurrection of Jesus, we'd all be in DEEP TROUBLE!

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Christianbookworm View Post
        The embryo dies of prematurity. Undesired side effect of trying to save the mom.
        What I am hearing is that whoever wrote the law doesn't understand how they work, and pro choicers are having a field day over it.
        "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

        Comment


        • #5
          They didn't put that it's acceptable to deliver early to save the mother? And if the baby tragically dies, it isn't the same as an abortion.
          If it weren't for the Resurrection of Jesus, we'd all be in DEEP TROUBLE!

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
            What I am hearing is that whoever wrote the law doesn't understand how they work, and pro choicers are having a field day over it.
            Yeah, from the little that I've seen (otherwise preoccupied with Mothers Day) it looks like a... um.... mess.
            "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

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            • #7
              Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
              I have heard that Ohio's heartbeat bill effectively bans the treatment of ectopic pregnancies, which are fatal for women if untreated. I haven't been able to hear the pro-life side of this but I am rather concerned. Has anybody heard more?
              Not according to the bill.

              Source: http://search-prod.lis.state.oh.us/solarapi/v1/general_assembly_132/bills/hb258/EN/05?format=pdf



              (B) Sections 2919.192 to 2919.195 of the Revised Code apply only to intrauterine
              pregnancies.

              (A)(1) "Medical emergency" has the same meaning as in section 2919.16 of the Revised Code.
              (A)(2) "Medical necessity" means a medical condition of a pregnant woman that, in the
              reasonable judgment of the physician who is attending the woman, so complicates the pregnancy that
              it necessitates the immediate performance or inducement of an abortion.

              (E) If a medical emergency or medical necessity compels the performance or inducement of
              an abortion, the physician who will perform or induce the abortion, prior to its performance or
              inducement if possible, shall inform the pregnant woman of the medical indications supporting the
              physician's judgment that an immediate abortion is necessary.


              "Intrauterine pregnancy" means a pregnancy in which the fetus is attached to the
              placenta within the uterus of the pregnant woman .

              © Copyright Original Source



              Ectopic pregnancies do not fall under this code.
              That's what
              - She

              Without a clear-cut definition of sin, morality becomes a mere argument over the best way to train animals
              - Manya the Holy Szin (The Quintara Marathon)

              I may not be as old as dirt, but me and dirt are starting to have an awful lot in common
              Stephen R. Donaldson

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              • #8
                A similar bill has been proposed in the same state: https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...box=1575018221

                I grant that the article itself is very biased against the pro-life movement, but I was linked to this article by a pro-life organization I follow that was horrified that this bill was ever proposed.

                Frankly, I don't blame outsiders from asking "what's the real goal?" when they see such things.
                "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
                  A similar bill has been proposed in the same state: https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...box=1575018221

                  I grant that the article itself is very biased against the pro-life movement, but I was linked to this article by a pro-life organization I follow that was horrified that this bill was ever proposed.

                  Frankly, I don't blame outsiders from asking "what's the real goal?" when they see such things.
                  I think it was poorly written, the section defining "abortion murder" starts with a disclaimer defining "reasonable medical judgement" as a judgement by any prudent physician, which leaves a pretty wide range of options.

                  I find it hard to believe that the topic of ectopic pregnancies are unknown to anyone who has wrestled with the legal and moral issues of ectopic pregnancies. That said, there are some on the pro life side that see ectopic pregnancy as morally equivalent to the "health and welfare" or mental health of the woman loophole (which practically allows any abortion).

                  I see this bill as a disaster for pro life, it places the pro life concept in a poor light.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by simplicio View Post
                    I think it was poorly written, the section defining "abortion murder" starts with a disclaimer defining "reasonable medical judgement" as a judgement by any prudent physician, which leaves a pretty wide range of options.

                    I find it hard to believe that the topic of ectopic pregnancies are unknown to anyone who has wrestled with the legal and moral issues of ectopic pregnancies. That said, there are some on the pro life side that see ectopic pregnancy as morally equivalent to the "health and welfare" or mental health of the woman loophole (which practically allows any abortion).

                    I see this bill as a disaster for pro life, it places the pro life concept in a poor light.
                    Did you read my response?
                    That's what
                    - She

                    Without a clear-cut definition of sin, morality becomes a mere argument over the best way to train animals
                    - Manya the Holy Szin (The Quintara Marathon)

                    I may not be as old as dirt, but me and dirt are starting to have an awful lot in common
                    Stephen R. Donaldson

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Bill the Cat View Post
                      Did you read my response?
                      Yes, I read your answer. And I also skimmed through the bill.

                      Few actually read the bills, most seem to take a summary from whatever source they are reading.

                      My point is that few on the pro life side have really thought through to an ethical position, other than "abortion is wrong". The example of abortion applied to ectopic pregnancies I the case in point. I suspect that it was placed in there without thought, and maybe by an abortion hard liner.

                      If abortion is wrong in every case, then it is also wrong for the case of the ectopic pregnancy. And the Ohio bill should stand as written. After reading the answers here, I suspect quite a few pro life Christians disagree with the bill as written.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        If there is no way to save both, the baby should be delivered prematurely. If they can't be saved in the NICU, provide comfort care until the end.
                        If it weren't for the Resurrection of Jesus, we'd all be in DEEP TROUBLE!

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Bill the Cat View Post
                          Did you read my response?
                          I think this is a separate bill altogether, which was proposed in the last month as opposed to the OP from several months ago. This one details a specific procedure that is actually medically impossible (according to my wife, who read the bill and has a relevant background in that area that I lack).
                          "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
                            A similar bill has been proposed in the same state: https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...box=1575018221

                            I grant that the article itself is very biased against the pro-life movement, but I was linked to this article by a pro-life organization I follow that was horrified that this bill was ever proposed.

                            Frankly, I don't blame outsiders from asking "what's the real goal?" when they see such things.
                            Bill?

                            "He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot


                            "Forgiveness is the way of love." Gary Chapman

                            My Personal Blog

                            My Novella blog (Current Novella Begins on 7/25/14)

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Teallaura View Post
                              Bill?
                              Hb 413. It is in committee. https://www.legislature.ohio.gov/leg...d=GA133-HB-413

                              The bill is 723 pp. The main part is section 2904, lines 5300 to 5380. It creates a new crime, 'aggravated abortion murder". I am not a lawyer, but I wonder if it places the woman as a perpetrator of a violent crime, not a victim of abortion. My read is that it does.

                              I don't know how it would affect ministries to women who have had abortion. It reminds me of the good old days, when protests at clinics had protesters screaming murderer. It was not effective then, and took some time and effort to change hearts and minds in the pro life camp.
                              Last edited by simplicio; 12-03-2019, 02:45 AM.

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