Announcement

Collapse

Civics 101 Guidelines

Want to argue about politics? Healthcare reform? Taxes? Governments? You've come to the right place!

Try to keep it civil though. The rules still apply here.
See more
See less

Definitions of Marriage

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Originally posted by Spartacus View Post
    All of them, especially phank's, are religious.
    I'm sorry to cut in, since this is your thread, but this claim is simply incorrect. If you insist on misrepresenting my views, do you really think it's proper to lock me out?

    My view is very similar to Psychic Missile's. LEGAL marriage is nothing but a contract between the couple and the government. The relationship itself is whatever the two partners choose to make of it, or at least what they are trying to make of it. For many (including my wife and myself), religion plays no role whatsoever. And no contract with the government, represented by a license, can possibly substitute for the commitment, loyalty, cooperation, communication, and consideration required to stay together for a long time.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by phank View Post
      I'm sorry to cut in, since this is your thread, but this claim is simply incorrect. If you insist on misrepresenting my views, do you really think it's proper to lock me out?

      My view is very similar to Psychic Missile's. LEGAL marriage is nothing but a contract between the couple and the government. The relationship itself is whatever the two partners choose to make of it, or at least what they are trying to make of it. For many (including my wife and myself), religion plays no role whatsoever. And no contract with the government, represented by a license, can possibly substitute for the commitment, loyalty, cooperation, communication, and consideration required to stay together for a long time.
      The ought to have made it clear that I was being entirely sarcastic.

      Incidentally, if you have a problem, better to take it up with me via PM than to violate forum rules.
      Don't call it a comeback. It's a riposte.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Spartacus View Post
        It's a tradition that works for explicable reasons.
        Sure. Is it better than the alternatives? I don't think anybody can answer that question.

        That's precisely the message that a further redefinition of the civil institution will send.
        How so? Was that message sent when women become people instead of property or interracial marriage was legalized?

        No one can be forced by law to enter into a marriage. Period. But once they have entered into a marriage, they take on certain obligations.
        What obligations do you think necessitate a person being stuck in a marriage they don't want?

        Apparently I've spent more time around mothers of infants recently than you have.
        Probably. I'm all ears if you'd like to share the wisdom of experience and answer my questions/argument.

        Do you see an argument for the father taking on obligations as caregiver as well?
        No. I think that role is interchangeable specifically in the case of hormones.

        All of them, especially phank's, are religious.

        I believe I've explained several times why the Catholic Church's view is not inherently a religious one. Its argument is that marriage is knowable by human reason and does not require divine revelation to understand and accept. People may accept it for religious reasons, but it's not inherently religious.
        What type of marriage specifically? When was this knowledge gained?

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Psychic Missile View Post
          Sure. Is it better than the alternatives? I don't think anybody can answer that question.
          Social science can. These sorts of questions are the reason it exists in the first place.

          How so? Was that message sent when women become people instead of property or interracial marriage was legalized?
          Bans on miscegnation were, as I have previously explained, historical anomalies. They rose with American slave culture (more specifically, with race theory) and died with the civil rights movement. At no other place or time in western history since greece at least was interracial marriage banned.

          What obligations do you think necessitate a person being stuck in a marriage they don't want?
          1. the vows themselves. If you vow to stay faithful to a person "in sickness and in health, for richer, for poorer, for as long as you both shall live," and then back out of that vow just because you no longer feel like fulfilling it, what does that say about your word? About your resolve? Your capacity to be loyal? In other words, backing out of a solemn vow is a morally despicable act.

          2. the children.

          Probably. I'm all ears if you'd like to share the wisdom of experience and answer my questions/argument.
          Ask any mothers you know how their children behaved in utero and whether/how it corresponded to their later behavior.

          No. I think that role is interchangeable specifically in the case of hormones.
          So the man, who provided half of the genetic material for the child, has no obligation to help take care of the child after it is born? He can just walk away any time he feels like it?

          What type of marriage specifically? When was this knowledge gained?
          Unfortunately, I'm coming up on another period of academic crunch time, so I'm going to have to cut back on the replies again with respect to both frequency and complexity. The Catechism may give you a better sense of how the Church presents marriage to the faithful, as might diving back into earlier posts in this thread.

          http://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_cs...m/p2s2c3a7.htm
          Don't call it a comeback. It's a riposte.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Spartacus View Post
            The ought to have made it clear that I was being entirely sarcastic.

            Incidentally, if you have a problem, better to take it up with me via PM than to violate forum rules.
            You mentioned him in the thread. He's allowed to post here again. That's the way it works.
            I'm not here anymore.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Carrikature View Post
              You mentioned him in the thread. He's allowed to post here again. That's the way it works.
              Is that so? Even in such an obviously sarcastic case?

              Fair enough.
              Don't call it a comeback. It's a riposte.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Spartacus View Post
                Is that so? Even in such an obviously sarcastic case?

                Fair enough.
                Well, as I quite ably demonstrated in another thread, sarcasm is very easy to miss in this sort of environment. FWIW
                I DENOUNCE DONALD J. TRUMP AND ALL HIS IMMORAL ACTS.

                Comment

                Related Threads

                Collapse

                Topics Statistics Last Post
                Started by little_monkey, Yesterday, 04:19 PM
                16 responses
                106 views
                0 likes
                Last Post One Bad Pig  
                Started by whag, 03-26-2024, 04:38 PM
                53 responses
                306 views
                0 likes
                Last Post Mountain Man  
                Started by rogue06, 03-26-2024, 11:45 AM
                25 responses
                109 views
                0 likes
                Last Post rogue06
                by rogue06
                 
                Started by Hypatia_Alexandria, 03-26-2024, 09:21 AM
                33 responses
                196 views
                0 likes
                Last Post Roy
                by Roy
                 
                Started by Hypatia_Alexandria, 03-26-2024, 08:34 AM
                84 responses
                357 views
                0 likes
                Last Post JimL
                by JimL
                 
                Working...
                X