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Belgium due to legalize euthanasia for all kids

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  • Belgium due to legalize euthanasia for all kids

    regardless of age.

    http://www.theguardian.com/world/201...dren-age-limit

    "It is not about deciding whether a child is or is not to die," said Daniel Baquelaine, an MP who backs the new law and who is also a doctor. "Death is coming quickly. It is therefore necessary to allow the child to express what he thinks of the end of life, about how to die."

    The extension of the right to die to minors is hedged with tight conditions. The bill states that the child must "be in a hopeless medical situation of constant and unbearable suffering that cannot be eased and which will cause death in the short-term".

    Parental approval is needed, although it is not quite clear what happens if two parents of a child disagree. Psychiatric and medical advice is also required.
    "As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths." Isaiah 3:12

    There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.

  • #2
    And they say secularism doesn't do any harm.....
    Better to illuminate than merely to shine, to deliver to others contemplated truths than merely to contemplate.

    -Thomas Aquinas

    I love to travel, But hate to arrive.

    -Hernando Cortez

    What is the good of experience if you do not reflect?

    -Frederick 2, Holy Roman Emperor

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    • #3
      Originally posted by TimelessTheist View Post
      And they say secularism doesn't do any harm.....
      I'm not sure I follow this. We have two alternatives: Allow the child to suffer unbearable pain for as long as possible before dying (within a day or two), or let the child die a bit earlier and skip the pain.

      Which of these options is "secularism"? Which is better?

      Comment


      • #4
        The not killing people option is better. Sad I have to point that out.
        The State. Ideas so good they have to be mandatory.

        sigpic

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        • #5
          One of the conditions is that the child has some kind of condition with "will cause death in the short-term". I'm wondering if there's a definition for "the short-term". And if it's "short", why isn't hospice an option?
          "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

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          • #6
            Originally posted by phank View Post
            I'm not sure I follow this. We have two alternatives: Allow the child to suffer unbearable pain for as long as possible before dying (within a day or two), or let the child die a bit earlier and skip the pain.
            You don't understand how euthanasia works in Belgium. Sure, there are people choose to die and meet the criteria for euthanasia. But there are also cases where
            1) Doctors ignore what the patients think and make the decision for them or
            2) Trivial reason is given for the euthanasia eg. (Blindness is unbearable pain)

            Another important question besides all these is, given that the consent of a child is not equivalent to the consent of an adult in many situations, why should it be so in this case?

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Paprika View Post
              You don't understand how euthanasia works in Belgium. Sure, there are people choose to die and meet the criteria for euthanasia. But there are also cases where
              1) Doctors ignore what the patients think and make the decision for them or
              2) Trivial reason is given for the euthanasia eg. (Blindness is unbearable pain)

              Another important question besides all these is, given that the consent of a child is not equivalent to the consent of an adult in many situations, why should it be so in this case?
              The first reason is enough to oppose it even on non-moral grounds. But another issue is that older people will in some cases feel a pressure to go through with assisted suicide (either pressure from themselves or from family) so it can be "over with" for the family. Nobody should have to be in that situation.
              "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by phank View Post
                I'm not sure I follow this. We have two alternatives: Allow the child to suffer unbearable pain for as long as possible before dying (within a day or two), or let the child die a bit earlier and skip the pain.

                Which of these options is "secularism"? Which is better?
                What is the definition of unbearable pain (physical or emotional)? When is pain unbearable? When is the time that you should ask the child for his/her consent? After an hour/days/months of "unbearable pain"? If you only have 20% chance (based on doctors opinion) of living and you are experiencing unbearable pain, can you give consent to be "euthanise". How about 40%?

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                • #9
                  Considering that Dutch doctors already decided that people who have no physical or mental illness but are "suffering through living" (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC543860/) should be allowed to be euthanised. this is a foot in the door that the really needs to be kept out.

                  To quote Wesley Smith "Culture of Death? What Culture of Death"
                  "If you can ever make any major religion look absolutely ludicrous, chances are you haven't understood it"
                  -Ravi Zacharias, The New Age: A foreign bird with a local walk

                  Be watchful, stand firm in the faith, act like men, be strong.
                  1 Corinthians 16:13

                  "...he [Doherty] is no historian and he is not even conversant with the historical discussions of the very matters he wants to pontificate on."
                  -Ben Witherington III

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                  • #10
                    Considering too that most kids would rather not feel even the business end of a shot, they're not the best authority on what is too much pain for them.
                    Watch your links! http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/fa...corumetiquette

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Pinoy View Post
                      What is the definition of unbearable pain (physical or emotional)? When is pain unbearable? When is the time that you should ask the child for his/her consent? After an hour/days/months of "unbearable pain"? If you only have 20% chance (based on doctors opinion) of living and you are experiencing unbearable pain, can you give consent to be "euthanise". How about 40%?
                      What do you know of pain, Pinoy?

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Darth Executor View Post
                        Upon reading the article:

                        Supporters said the bill would help bring ethical clarity and close loopholes – such as where doctors were quietly acceding to child euthanasia in excruciating circumstances but then facing prosecution for breaking the law.
                        ...
                        "The existence of a law is the best means of guarding against possible malpractice," said Le Soir, the main French language newspaper in Belgium.
                        So doctors are already breaking the existing laws and euthanising children, and this law is just to cover their asses, cloaked under the guise of "think of the children!".

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          So parental approval is needed... I have no idea how the legal logistics work in Belgium but in the US it's because kids aren't considered capable of making their own decision. Could this mean that parents could make that decision for their kids without even asking them? "I'm tired of paying these medical bills, let's just get rid of Junior."
                          "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
                            So parental approval is needed... I have no idea how the legal logistics work in Belgium but in the US it's because kids aren't considered capable of making their own decision. Could this mean that parents could make that decision for their kids without even asking them? "I'm tired of paying these medical bills, let's just get rid of Junior."
                            Given that patient approval is in practice not needed for euthanasia, what do you think?

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Remember a few years ago when there was that loophole in Nebraska's law that allowed parents to abandon their children without consequence? It was written so that people could have somewhere to take newborns they couldn't take care of, but people ended up coming from all around the country to drop off older children. Let's hope Belgium does not become the new Nebraska.
                              "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

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