Obama on Guns and Social Security Recipients

[Cow Poke]

Us old people may be in big trouble.

Source: WashingtonTimes

The Obama administration is pushing to ban Social Security beneficiaries from owning guns if they lack the mental capacity to manage their own disability payments — a move the NRA is calling the “largest gun grab in American history.”

The push is intended to integrate data for the first time from the Social Security Administration into the National Instant Criminal Background Check System (NICS), OutdoorHub reported. Beneficiaries who have been declared incompetent to manage pension or disability payments and assigned a fiduciary could then potentially lose their right to bear arms.

© Copyright Original Source

[Raphael]

To chuck a cat amongst the pigeons, if you lack the mental capacity to be able to manage your own disability payments (I am assuming that is a relatively simple process), I don't know if I would be happy trusting your mental capacity to keep track of what guns you have.

If you're at that point, you really should be transferring their ownership to someone else.

(My father is 76, and more than capable of managing his own finances his PhD in economics may help with that, so I don't think old people automatically means unable to manage payments)

[Catholicity]

Well to be honest. My daughter's great grandfather owned an illegal Oozi. (black market weapon) He kept it by his head. When the dementia set in, he was so bad off he took it out side and started shooting at imaginary neighborhood cats he thought were bothering his cat. On another occasion he was showing it, loaded, to his 4 year old great grandson. I told my daughter's grandmother that in order for her to see him, the gun needed to be unloaded or there needed to be total supervision since he was incapable of making safety judgements. They finally complied. Honestly? Because of the dementia, he needed to have the weapon and any other's taken away. He also shouldn't have been allowed alcohol or driving privileges. And trust me eventually finances were off the table. Once the ability to add subtract and multiply goes, you can't really get it back.

[Cow Poke]

I'm not defending the right of a person to own a gun, where that person is not competent to make decisions.

I'm concerned about the Social Security data being shared with other agencies for purposes other than originally stated. When I got my original social security card, it stated right on the card "not to be used for identification", yet... here we are!

[Cow Poke]

I think old people who say stupid stuff like "If you hear someone in your yard, get your double-barreled shotgun, go on your balcony and fire a couple rounds”. THAT guy sounds more dangerous than a social security recipient who has a financial payee assigned them.


Just because somebody can't handle their finances doesn't mean they're unsafe, or a threat to society.

[Cow Poke]

When I got my original social security card, it stated right on the card "not to be used for identification", yet... here we are!

From SSA.gov:

Q21: When did Social Security cards bear the legend "NOT FOR IDENTIFICATION"?

A: The first Social Security cards were issued starting in 1936, they did not have this legend. Beginning with the sixth design version of the card, issued starting in 1946, SSA added a legend to the bottom of the card reading "FOR SOCIAL SECURITY PURPOSES -- NOT FOR IDENTIFICATION." This legend was removed as part of the design changes for the 18th version of the card, issued beginning in 1972. The legend has not been on any new cards issued since 1972.

[Raphael]

Also to add, over here your gun licence is valid for 10 years, and when you renew it you will be assessed, and if you're like Cath's daughter's great grandfather, you ain't gonna get your licence renewed.

[Cow Poke]

To chuck a cat amongst the pigeons, if you lack the mental capacity to be able to manage your own disability payments (I am assuming that is a relatively simple process), I don't know if I would be happy trusting your mental capacity to keep track of what guns you have.

If you're at that point, you really should be transferring their ownership to someone else.

(My father is 76, and more than capable of managing his own finances his PhD in economics may help with that, so I don't think old people automatically means unable to manage payments)

My Dad is in his 90's, and one of my sisters handles his finances. Dad gets confused on dates, and forgets to write and mail checks. He is surprisingly sharp in most other areas of life, is a WWII Vet, and owns a couple of handguns that he never handles. (Doesn't even have ammo for them)

From OutDoorHub:

Many critics of the plan argue that it will target gun owners based solely on financial competence, rather than mental illness, which is what the Obama administration had in mind. Gun rights advocates, mental health experts, and activists for the disabled say the plan will affect beneficiaries who are perfectly capable of owning a firearm without being a danger to themselves or others.

“Someone can be incapable of managing their funds but not be dangerous, violent or unsafe,” Dr. Marc Rosen, a psychologist at Yale, told the Times. “They are very different determinations.”

[Cow Poke]

Well to be honest. My daughter's great grandfather owned an illegal Oozi.

Uzi. An "oozi" is a wound that produces puss*.






*OK, so I made that up.

[Cow Poke]

Also to add, over here your gun licence is valid for 10 years, and when you renew it you will be assessed, and if you're like Cath's daughter's great grandfather, you ain't gonna get your licence renewed.

OK, but she already stated it was illegally owned. An Uzi is an automatic weapon (class III firearm) which is not legal to be owned by other than police or military without an expensive federal tax stamp and special circumstances (like a class III dealer's license).

[Catholicity]

However My ex husband has an assigned payee and he', terrified of the sound a gun makes and woul never shoot just because. And he definately cant handle his finances but needless to say lest he randomly go into a statw of mania or paranoia he should never have access to a gun eve if he's been in remission from mania for years

[Catholicity]

However the SS number thing is intrusive though its been a form of id for 31 years

[rogue06]

Uzi. An "oozi" is a wound that produces puss*.






*OK, so I made that up.

I was gonna comment on the "oozi" but knew that since our resident grammar/spelling nazi was involved in the thread it wouldn't be necessary

[Roy]

Uzi. An "oozi" is a wound that produces puss.

Pus. A "puss" is a small mammal that mows.

Roy

[JonathanL]

Pus. A "puss" is a small mammal that mows.

Roy

It's also a kiss if you're Swedish.