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Losing Our Religion?

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  • #16
    Originally posted by Irate Canadian View Post
    When a god asks you to love him, he is really asking for something to eat.
    “I think God, in creating man, somewhat overestimated his ability.” ― Oscar Wilde
    “And if there were a God, I think it very unlikely that He would have such an uneasy vanity as to be offended by those who doubt His existence” ― Bertrand Russell
    “not all there” - you know who you are

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    • #17
      So ... if Americans are identifying less with organised religion it's bad news because the country is sliding into a moral abyss, but good news because nominal Christians aren't bothering to say they're Christians any more.

      Comment


      • #18
        Originally posted by firstfloor View Post
        When a god asks you to love him, he is really asking for something to eat.
        You're not even trying anymore and your posts seem mostly mental static I scroll past ... and I'm not even a theist!

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        • #19
          And it's stuff like this that led to my posts.

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          • #20
            Originally posted by DLAbaoaqu View Post
            And it's stuff like this that led to my posts.
            Now, now, nobody MADE you do it. It's not other people's fault.

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            • #21
              Originally posted by Adrift View Post
              We're not losing our religion, it's just that the facade is finally falling away. My whole life has been filled with people who, when asked "are you a Christian?" will answer that they are, but when pushed for details don't know much beyond some sort of karmic "if I do good, I'll get into heaven to see my dead relatives". Most people vaguely believed that God lives in the clouds, and has a big white flowing beard, and he wears a toga and sandals, and he is surrounded by our dead relatives who have turned into winged angels playing harps, and that when we die, we will see a bright light, and our dead relatives pleading for us to come into the light so that we may join them. They don't know what salvation is. They don't know what the purpose of Jesus dieing on the cross is. They don't know what the trinity is or who the Holy Spirit is. They don't know that through Christ Jesus, Christians are filled with power and live more than abundant lives in the here and now. They just have no real clue what Christianity is about outside of some old Sunday school classes they took as a child.

              My mother was telling me the other day that she was getting her hair done or at a shop some place in town, and she was wearing a pendant that said "Born Again", and the person working there asked her what that 'Born Again" meant. My mother asked her if she knew what "salvation" was, and the girl shook her head no. So my mom asked her if she ever went to church, and the girl answered, "oh yes! I go to Shawnee Methodist (a church down the street) every week". My mom was confused, "You go to church regularly and you've never heard of salvation?", and the girl shook her head no again. So my mom witnessed to her and led her to Christ.

              That's common Christianity in the United States. It's absolutely no surprise to me to hear that, in this day and age, people are no longer pretending to be Christian anymore. Christianity is not a social club. It's not a cultural identity. It's a personal commitment and a conscious decision to make Jesus first in your life. It's a way of life that permeates everything that you say, think and do. In my opinion it's about time that the wheat was separated from the chaff. I can't think of a better thing for the health of Christianity or for evangelism.
              This is a nice speech, but a thought occurred to me while I was reading it--how do you know that the people who have accounted for the decline are, in fact, those nominal Christians? How do you know that the doubly-bad result isn't the case--that the nominal Christians who are a poor witness have continued to identify as Christian, and the people who did understand Christianity are the ones who have led to this drop?
              Learn to do right; seek justice. Defend the oppressed. Take up the cause of the fatherless; plead the case of the widow.--Isaiah 1:17

              I don't think that all forms o[f] slavery are inherently immoral.--seer

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              • #22
                Hmm, what I find intriguing is the 6.7% rise in the non-religious group in the last 7 years. That's about one percentage point per year. For the past couple of decades in the UK and here in NZ, the rate of non-religion has been increasing by one percentage point per year, but until now the US has had a much much slower rate of change. Australia also seemed to be changing at a slower rate. I've long wondered why the rates of change were so different between those various English-speaking culturally similar countries. So it's intriguing to see that the US rate of change has risen to match that of the UK and NZ.

                Originally posted by fm93 View Post
                This is a nice speech, but a thought occurred to me while I was reading it--how do you know that the people who have accounted for the decline are, in fact, those nominal Christians? How do you know that the doubly-bad result isn't the case--that the nominal Christians who are a poor witness have continued to identify as Christian, and the people who did understand Christianity are the ones who have led to this drop?
                I think it's probably a bit of both - hard to say how much of each. Of the couple of dozen of my friends who were once informed and sincere Christians, about a third of them have since outright rejected Christianity, with another third or so being now only nominal Christians.

                But I think also, society generally becoming more secular has led a lot of nominal Christians to simply not bother to call themselves Christian any more.
                "I hate him passionately", he's "a demonic force" - Tucker Carlson, in private, on Donald Trump
                "Every line of serious work that I have written since 1936 has been written, directly or indirectly, against totalitarianism and for democratic socialism" - George Orwell
                "[Capitalism] as it exists today is, in my opinion, the real source of evils. I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy" - Albert Einstein

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by fm93 View Post
                  This is a nice speech, but a thought occurred to me while I was reading it--how do you know that the people who have accounted for the decline are, in fact, those nominal Christians? How do you know that the doubly-bad result isn't the case--that the nominal Christians who are a poor witness have continued to identify as Christian, and the people who did understand Christianity are the ones who have led to this drop?
                  I wasn't writing a speech, I was speaking from experience. I read the results of this report earlier today in an overview found here.

                  It confirmed my expectations when it reported, "Pew researchers said Christian losses were driven by decreases among mainline, or liberal, Protestants and Roman Catholics", and that evangelicals have the highest growth among all faith groups.

                  People who are no longer on fire for God, who are stuck in old dead or dying churches, and those who are attempting to secularize the Gospel in order to stay culturally relevant are losing the most adherents. This has totally been my experience as well.
                  Last edited by Adrift; 05-12-2015, 08:49 PM.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Adrift View Post
                    It confirmed my expectations when it reported... that evangelicals have the highest growth among all faith groups.
                    Er, it reported that Evangelicals lost one percentage point (although in absolute numbers this still amounted to a slight gain due to population growth). The only faith group that actually grew in percentage size was the "Non-Christians faiths".
                    "I hate him passionately", he's "a demonic force" - Tucker Carlson, in private, on Donald Trump
                    "Every line of serious work that I have written since 1936 has been written, directly or indirectly, against totalitarianism and for democratic socialism" - George Orwell
                    "[Capitalism] as it exists today is, in my opinion, the real source of evils. I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy" - Albert Einstein

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by firstfloor View Post
                      Gods are not defeated by swords and bullets. They are defeated by indifference.
                      Your posts fill me with indiff....

                      ...meh, whatever.
                      ...>>> Witty remark or snarky quote of another poster goes here <<<...

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by pancreasman View Post
                        So ... if Americans are identifying less with organised religion it's bad news because the country is sliding into a moral abyss, but good news because nominal Christians aren't bothering to say they're Christians any more.
                        I'm not sure why you think both can't be true?
                        ...>>> Witty remark or snarky quote of another poster goes here <<<...

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by Starlight View Post
                          Er, it reported that Evangelicals lost one percentage point (although in absolute numbers this still amounted to a slight gain due to population growth). The only faith group that actually grew in percentage size was the "Non-Christians faiths".
                          I stand corrected. Instead of "faith group" I should have specified among Christian traditions. The unaffiliated do have the highest growth, but are "second in size only to evangelical Protestants among major religious groups in the U.S."

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by Darth Executor View Post
                            I'm not sure what you mean. Jews were instrumental in the rise of communism, it's part of how Hitler's antisemitism got him to power in the first place. They definitely weren't persecuting themselves when they were part of the Soviet Union's power structure. And nobody is persecuting them these days, Putin just opened a holocaust museum a while back and a lot of Russian jews are leaders of industry or high ranking government officials. Compared to Tsarist Russia it's like heaven and earth.
                            Don't go confusing Shunya with the facts.
                            Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom

                            Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
                            sigpic
                            I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by MaxVel View Post
                              I'm not sure why you think both can't be true?
                              I didn't say it couldn't be.

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                              • #30
                                Originally posted by pancreasman View Post
                                So ... if Americans are identifying less with organised religion it's bad news because the country is sliding into a moral abyss, but good news because nominal Christians aren't bothering to say they're Christians any more.
                                These terms and not mutual exclusive. Both can be true.
                                “I didn’t go to religion to make me happy. I always knew a bottle of Port would do that. If you want a religion to make you feel really comfortable, I certainly don’t recommend Christianity.” - C.S. Lewis

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