Announcement

Collapse

Civics 101 Guidelines

Want to argue about politics? Healthcare reform? Taxes? Governments? You've come to the right place!

Try to keep it civil though. The rules still apply here.
See more
See less

Rape Culture: Why Yes can mean No

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #46
    Originally posted by Christianbookworm View Post
    They don't get that it isn't helpful to their case to make all women into helpless damsels in distress?
    Well it's pretty clear they don't care about consistency. What matters is playing the victim card to get white knights on their side.

    Comment


    • #47
      Originally posted by Teallaura View Post
      Yeah, except not.
      Great refutation.

      Comment


      • #48
        Originally posted by Paprika View Post
        You progressives can't be taken seriously as long as you still promote and excuse fake rape victims.
        Who's doing that?

        Given that drunken sex is one of the key scenarios during which campus raaaape occurs, your lack of comprehension should push you to a deeper analysis instead of spouting what is meaningless and trite.
        You act as if campus rape is a complete myth and has never ever occurred.



        Originally posted by Christianbookworm View Post
        They don't get that it isn't helpful to their case to make all women into helpless damsels in distress?
        Because obviously literally every single feminist in the world does and thinks the exact same things in every single scenario, just like the billions of Christians in the world believe the exact same thing on ever single point.
        Learn to do right; seek justice. Defend the oppressed. Take up the cause of the fatherless; plead the case of the widow.--Isaiah 1:17

        I don't think that all forms o[f] slavery are inherently immoral.--seer

        Comment


        • #49
          Originally posted by fm93 View Post
          Who's doing that?

          The Rolling Stone, for one, and the many feminist supporters who still try to avoid admitting it was a blatant lie and pleading people to focus on the narrative ' but but but think of actual victims', when crying wolf is one of the best ways to hurt actual victims.

          You act as if campus rape is a complete myth and has never ever occurred.
          Nah, I'm pointing out that if you don't understand why drunk sex happens you're hardly in a position to discuss 'raaaape' arising from it.
          Last edited by Paprika; 05-09-2015, 10:08 AM.

          Comment


          • #50
            Originally posted by fm93 View Post



            Because obviously literally every single feminist in the world does and thinks the exact same things in every single scenario, just like the billions of Christians in the world believe the exact same thing on ever single point.
            I was referring only to the ones that make those kind of claims. Not to all feminists. Just the wacky ones that make all feminists and females look like liviing stawmen.
            If it weren't for the Resurrection of Jesus, we'd all be in DEEP TROUBLE!

            Comment


            • #51
              Originally posted by Paprika View Post
              The Rolling Stone
              You mean the publication that explicitly and formally retracted its story and apologized for not having reviewed things more carefully?

              and the many feminist supporters who still try to avoid admitting it was a blatant lie
              I haven't seen anyone doing this.

              and pleading people to focus on the narrative ' but but but think of actual victims', when crying wolf is one of the best ways to hurt actual victims.
              So condemn that particular student for lying and subsequently making things tougher for the many actual victims of rape, and then doubly emphasize that campus rape victims do legitimately exist.

              Nah, I'm pointing out that if you don't understand why drunk sex happens you're hardly in a position to discuss 'raaaape' arising from it.
              I understand why it happens, and I'm pointing out that it's a silly, illogical thing to do. And you are, in fact, sending a strong impression of dismissiveness regarding rape by putting it on scare quotes and stretching it out like that.
              Learn to do right; seek justice. Defend the oppressed. Take up the cause of the fatherless; plead the case of the widow.--Isaiah 1:17

              I don't think that all forms o[f] slavery are inherently immoral.--seer

              Comment


              • #52
                Originally posted by fm93 View Post
                These issues go way beyond mere "liberals vs conservatives," but anyhow, I'd say rape culture involves, for instance, fraternity members gathering near female dorms and chanting disgusting things like "No means yes, yes means anal!" and "My name is Jack, I'm a necrophiliac, I [censored] dead women and fill them with my semen." Or hearing accounts from rape victims and dismissing them with responses like "You were dressed a certain way, therefore you were asking for it" or "But you're so ugly, you should feel lucky that someone would want to rape you."
                I'm pretty sure these are (extreme) exceptions that prove the rule. If it were normal, it wouldn't make the news.
                Or on a more generic level, acting as if rape is something casual to be tossed around, such as describing large margins of victory as "We friggin' RAPED the other team!"
                As an avid sports fan, I've never heard that expression used.
                With all that being said, I believe that real men don't put themselves or anyone else in situations of uncertainty at all. It's not easy to figure out whether a drunken "Yes" indicated genuine consent or not, but why would anyone have drunken sex in the first place? I thought sex was supposed to be something mutually enjoyed by both people; why would anyone ruin their own experience by drinking and thereby not fully remembering it the next morning?
                This level of naivete tells me that your prior examples do not come from personal experience, but from news/op eds which are invariably skewed towards the extreme (and therefore news-worthy). People like to drink socially because alcohol lowers inhibitions so they're less nervous about speaking and interacting with others. Not infrequently, inhibitions are lowered sufficiently that people will consent to do things they would never do while sober. This is not rocket science; it has been going on since people figured out how to make alcohol.
                Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom

                Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
                sigpic
                I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

                Comment


                • #53
                  Originally posted by fm93 View Post
                  You act as if campus rape is a complete myth and has never ever occurred.
                  Not a myth, no but considering the high profile rape cases that have been proven false i.e. Duke Lacrosse and the Jackie Rolling Stone case. Then certainly they are making the situation worse.

                  The Rolling Stone incident was quite an interesting one, where Jackie alleged that she was raped at a fraternity party. The Rolling Stone magazine obviously came out with an article over it proclaiming RAAAAAPPPPE!!!!! at the highest voice. After investigation though they found that the claim was completely fabricated. Jackie said she had been raped on glass and yet showed no signs of injury. The man she claimed raped her was an invention, the guy didn't even exist and that the fraternity did NOT host any party on the night in question when she claimed she was raped.

                  Then you have the Guardian's Jessica Valenti who then writes an article putting the blame on Rolling Stone for not checking their facts, while avoiding putting any blame on the false accuser. Not to mention that is hypocritical considering that Valenti has argued in the past that people should just believe rapes claims made by women without looking at any evidence for the claims.
                  “I didn’t go to religion to make me happy. I always knew a bottle of Port would do that. If you want a religion to make you feel really comfortable, I certainly don’t recommend Christianity.” - C.S. Lewis

                  Comment


                  • #54
                    Originally posted by fm93 View Post
                    You mean the publication that explicitly and formally retracted its story and apologized for not having reviewed things more carefully?
                    Yes, the one that irresponsibly published the article without adequate fact-checking, only budging after massive public pressure, and still ended up bending over backwards to avoid explicitly blaming anyone, or calling out 'Jackie' as a liar:

                    Source: NYT

                    In an interview discussing Columbia’s findings, Jann S. Wenner, the publisher of Rolling Stone, acknowledged the piece’s flaws but said that it represented an isolated and unusual episode and that Ms. Erdely would continue to write for the magazine. The problems with the article started with its source, Mr. Wenner said. He described her as “a really expert fabulist storyteller” who managed to manipulate the magazine’s journalism process. When asked to clarify, he said that he was not trying to blame Jackie, “but obviously there is something here that is untruthful, and something sits at her doorstep.”

                    © Copyright Original Source



                    I haven't seen anyone doing this.
                    Jessica Valenti: It wasn’t Jackie’s job to get the details of her rape correct. It was Rolling Stone’s

                    So condemn that particular student for lying
                    As well as all the feminists that jumped on board the 'campus raaaaape' narrative and demonising of fraternities when the original article was not only suspicious but unverified.

                    I understand why it happens, and I'm pointing out that it's a silly, illogical thing to do. And you are, in fact, sending a strong impression of dismissiveness regarding rape by putting it on scare quotes and stretching it out like that.
                    I'm dismissive of crying wolf. When lies that have serious consequences go unpunished even when exposed, it becomes crystal clear that truth is not at all a priority, rather the narrative that has to be pushed at all expense.

                    Comment


                    • #55
                      Originally posted by Christianbookworm View Post
                      I was referring only to the ones that make those kind of claims. Not to all feminists. Just the wacky ones that make all feminists and females look like liviing stawmen.
                      Well if you want an example of a good feminist then you need to go and look at Christina Hoff Summers who calls herself The Factual Feminist. The fact that she is very unpopular by other feminists speaks volumes.
                      “I didn’t go to religion to make me happy. I always knew a bottle of Port would do that. If you want a religion to make you feel really comfortable, I certainly don’t recommend Christianity.” - C.S. Lewis

                      Comment


                      • #56
                        Ninja'd
                        “I didn’t go to religion to make me happy. I always knew a bottle of Port would do that. If you want a religion to make you feel really comfortable, I certainly don’t recommend Christianity.” - C.S. Lewis

                        Comment


                        • #57
                          Trigger Warning - Doubleplusungoodthink

                          Originally posted by Darth Ovious View Post
                          Well if you want an example of a good feminist then you need to go and look at Christina Hoff Summers
                          Or Camille Paglia:

                          If civilization had been left in female hands we would still be living in grass huts.

                          Comment


                          • #58
                            Originally posted by One Bad Pig View Post
                            This level of naivete tells me that your prior examples do not come from personal experience, but from news/op eds which are invariably skewed towards the extreme (and therefore news-worthy). People like to drink socially because alcohol lowers inhibitions so they're less nervous about speaking and interacting with others. Not infrequently, inhibitions are lowered sufficiently that people will consent to do things they would never do while sober. This is not rocket science; it has been going on since people figured out how to make alcohol.
                            What does this have to do with what I said?


                            Originally posted by Paprika View Post
                            Trigger Warning - Doubleplusungoodthink


                            Or Camille Paglia:
                            That's not any type of thinking. That's just empty, meaningless phrasing with no evidence behind it.
                            Learn to do right; seek justice. Defend the oppressed. Take up the cause of the fatherless; plead the case of the widow.--Isaiah 1:17

                            I don't think that all forms o[f] slavery are inherently immoral.--seer

                            Comment


                            • #59
                              When I was student, there was an estimate of there being atleast one rape per weekend at the on Campus residence. And we're not talking about a situation where there is any doubt about consent.
                              Some of my brother's Civil Engineering students put a stop to one that was going happen in an empty classroom (the girl was screaming loud enough to be heard)

                              The on campus residence also had an estimated 2 AK47's per bed, so there was no way campus security was going to try stop things.
                              Be watchful, stand firm in the faith, act like men, be strong.
                              1 Corinthians 16:13

                              "...he [Doherty] is no historian and he is not even conversant with the historical discussions of the very matters he wants to pontificate on."
                              -Ben Witherington III

                              Comment


                              • #60
                                Originally posted by Darth Ovious View Post
                                The point is they use this excuse when it is isn't true. Even if cases where the pre-nup was signed knowing full well what the situation would be you see cases afterwards where the pre-nup gets thrown out.
                                Fraud is then the issue - not duress. Caveat emptor. If you were expecting a contract to be valid then you make danged sure the signing is witnessed. The problem is that both things occur - women and men blackmailed into signing a contract they don't wish to and men and women lying to get out of a valid contract they signed.
                                "He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot

                                "Forgiveness is the way of love." Gary Chapman

                                My Personal Blog

                                My Novella blog (Current Novella Begins on 7/25/14)

                                Quill Sword

                                Comment

                                Related Threads

                                Collapse

                                Topics Statistics Last Post
                                Started by little_monkey, Yesterday, 04:19 PM
                                16 responses
                                124 views
                                0 likes
                                Last Post One Bad Pig  
                                Started by whag, 03-26-2024, 04:38 PM
                                53 responses
                                325 views
                                0 likes
                                Last Post Mountain Man  
                                Started by rogue06, 03-26-2024, 11:45 AM
                                25 responses
                                111 views
                                0 likes
                                Last Post rogue06
                                by rogue06
                                 
                                Started by Hypatia_Alexandria, 03-26-2024, 09:21 AM
                                33 responses
                                196 views
                                0 likes
                                Last Post Roy
                                by Roy
                                 
                                Started by Hypatia_Alexandria, 03-26-2024, 08:34 AM
                                84 responses
                                360 views
                                0 likes
                                Last Post JimL
                                by JimL
                                 
                                Working...
                                X