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They Will Ruin Our Military!

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  • #46
    Originally posted by Psychic Missile View Post
    Men withdrawing from combat when they should not be is not behaving poorly?
    Only if you believe that it's "poor behavior" for a man to be a gentlemen. Apparently, you and I were raised differently.
    The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

    Comment


    • #47
      Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
      So, when we KNOW that the presence of one group, for whatever reason, degrades unit effectiveness, let's just totally ignore that factor for fear of "blaming" one group even though it may get ALL groups killed.

      I hope that sounded better in your head, PM.
      In this case the presence of men degrades the army's effectiveness. Their actions may get people killed. The women aren't the ones not following protocol.

      Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
      Only if you believe that it's "poor behavior" for a man to be a gentlemen. Apparently, you and I were raised differently.
      You and I have different ideas of what a gentleman is.

      Comment


      • #48
        Originally posted by Psychic Missile View Post
        In this case the presence of men degrades the army's effectiveness.
        No, the presence of men with women around. And, mind you, many times these are 17 and 18 year old "kids".

        Their actions may get people killed. The women aren't the ones not following protocol.
        When, exactly, did you serve in the IDF?

        You and I have different ideas of what a gentleman is.
        Absolutely no doubt.
        The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

        Comment


        • #49
          Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
          No, the presence of men with women around. And, mind you, many times these are 17 and 18 year old "kids".
          The men are the ones not following protocol, so the men need to change or leave.

          When, exactly, did you serve in the IDF?
          I am going off of nothing but what you said.

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          • #50
            Originally posted by Psychic Missile View Post
            The men are the ones not following protocol, so the men need to change or leave.
            Yeah, because gender politics is WAY more important to combat troops than warfighting.

            I am going off of nothing but what you said.
            Now THAT's not very smart!
            The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

            Comment


            • #51
              Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
              Yeah, because gender politics is WAY more important to combat troops than warfighting.
              It's not gender politics. It only makes sense that the group that does something wrong be retrained or penalized.

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              • #52
                Originally posted by Psychic Missile View Post
                It's not gender politics.
                What you're playing is.

                It only makes sense that the group that does something wrong be retrained or penalized.
                No, it doesn't. This isn't kindergarten. It was agreed that there were plenty of other places women could serve in the IDF, and they worked it out without your help.
                The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                Comment


                • #53
                  Originally posted by Psychic Missile View Post
                  Penalizing a group of people because of something a different group of people did requires misdirected blame.
                  Hardly. In this case excluding the vast majority of women is the most expedient solution, and many would consider not being assigned to combat a blessing.

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                  • #54
                    And in this enlightened age how come women do not have to sign up for the draft?
                    Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

                    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

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                    • #55
                      Originally posted by seer View Post
                      And in this enlightened age how come women do not have to sign up for the draft?
                      I'm from a country where the males are drafted and interestingly enough virtually all the feminists here aren't pushing for equality in that aspect

                      But in the US (and other Western nations) when military service is not compulsory the feminists are pushing for complete equality.

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                      • #56
                        Originally posted by Paprika View Post
                        I'm from a country where the males are drafted and interestingly enough virtually all the feminists here aren't pushing for equality in that aspect

                        But in the US (and other Western nations) when military service is not compulsory the feminists are pushing for complete equality.
                        I have often thought that IF women became subject to the draft in the US, it would be a case of "you may get what you want, but you may not what what you get".
                        The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                        Comment


                        • #57
                          Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                          I have often thought that IF women became subject to the draft in the US, it would be a case of "you may get what you want, but you may not what what you get".
                          Tom said to himself that it was not such a hollow world, after all. He had discovered a great law of human action, without knowing it—namely, that in order to make a man or a boy covet a thing, it is only necessary to make the thing difficult to attain.

                          Given how much of feminism is driven by envy, the same law applies.

                          Comment


                          • #58
                            Originally posted by Psychic Missile View Post
                            In this case the presence of men degrades the army's effectiveness. Their actions may get people killed. The women aren't the ones not following protocol.
                            Are you saying an all-women military would be just as effective?
                            "As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths." Isaiah 3:12

                            There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.

                            Comment


                            • #59
                              Originally posted by Psychic Missile View Post
                              Your characterization of my argument is a straw man, and you are not qualified to determine what normal people think.
                              It's not true, my representation of your argument is pretty much perfect. You think women are entitled to being in the military and your entire idiocy is derived from that as anyone can see from subsequent posts, which is why you just give a flippant response instead of actually debating the points.
                              "As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths." Isaiah 3:12

                              There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.

                              Comment


                              • #60
                                The problem with saying that woman shouldn't be involved in combat is things like these ladies who served in the Russian Army in World War 2.

                                Between the 12 of them they have 775 confirmed kills.
                                775-confirmed-kills-630x980.jpg
                                http://www.whaleoil.co.nz/2015/04/photo-of-the-day-392/
                                Source: WhaleOil

                                775 Confirmed Kills In One Picture

                                When I first looked at this old photo, I thought it was a group of teenage Girl Guides on a fun field trip, they look pretty happy with smiling faces.

                                Female snipers of the 3rd Shock Army, 1st Belorussian Front.

                                1st row – Guard Staff Sergeant, VN Stepanov: 20 kills. Guard Sgt JP Belousov: 80 kills. Guard Sgt AE Vinogradov: 83 kills.
                                2nd row – Guard Lieutenant EK Zhibovskaya: 24 kills. Guard Sgt KF Marinkin: 79 kills. Guard Sgt OS Marenkina: 70 kills.
                                3rd row – Guard Lieutenant NP Belobrova: 70 kills. Lieutenant N. Lobkovsky: 89 kills. Guard Lieutenant VI Artamonov: 89 kills. Guard Staff Sergeant MG Zubchenko: 83 kills.
                                4th row – Guard Sergeant, NP Obukhov: 64 kills. Guard Sergeant, AR Belyakov 24 kills
                                Photo taken in Germany, May 4, 1945.

                                Because of chronic problems in finding the manpower to fulfill military and industrial tasks, the Soviet Government recruited some 7.75 million women, of whom 800,000 served in the military. Sniping was a precision role, which many women soldiers performed with expertise. It is estimated that in 1943 there were more than 2000 female snipers in the Soviet armed forces. Female snipers have been credited with more than 12,000 confirmed kills.

                                The Soviet Union used women for sniping duties extensively, and to great effect, including Nina Alexeyevna Lobkovskaya and Ukrainian Lyudmila Pavlichenko (who killed over 300 enemy soldiers). The Soviets found that sniper duties fit women well, since good snipers are patient, careful, deliberate, can avoid hand-to-hand combat, and need higher levels of aerobic conditioning than other troops.

                                Women were regarded as having the skills and nerves required for accurate marksmanship. Notwithstanding male skepticism, Major General Morozov, “the father of the sniper movement”, attributed superior female marksmanship to the fact that “a woman’s hand is more sensitive than is a man’s. Therefore when a woman is shooting, her index finger pulls the trigger more smoothly and purposefully”.

                                The most successful Soviet use of snipers during the second world war were during their defensive stages of the war (1941–1943), after which the advantage of defense shifted to the German side and German snipers became a real danger to the advancing Soviets.

                                Soviet military doctrine used snipers for providing long-distance suppressive fire and for eliminating targets of opportunity, especially leaders, because during World War II, Soviet military leaders and combat theorists (Vassili Zaitsev contributed greatly to Soviet sniper doctrine, although he was officially neither of these) found that military organizations have difficulty replacing experienced non-commissioned officers and field officers during times of war.

                                They also found that the more expensive and less rugged sniper rifles could match the cost-effectiveness of a cheaper assault rifle given good personnel selection, training, and adherence to doctrine.

                                © Copyright Original Source

                                Last edited by Raphael; 04-27-2015, 07:44 PM.
                                Be watchful, stand firm in the faith, act like men, be strong.
                                1 Corinthians 16:13

                                "...he [Doherty] is no historian and he is not even conversant with the historical discussions of the very matters he wants to pontificate on."
                                -Ben Witherington III

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