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My God! He Wants To Teach Morals!

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  • My God! He Wants To Teach Morals!

    How dare he! Can't this neanderthal be stopped before he corrupts the children!

    SAN FRANCISCO (AP) — Teachers and staff from four Catholic High Schools in the San Francisco Bay Area are urging their archbishop to remove morality clauses from the faculty handbook.

    Teacher Jim Jordan said Tuesday a petition with 355 signatures of teachers and staff collected in the past two days will be delivered to Archbishop Salvatore Cordileone by union representatives.

    The clauses recently proposed by Cordileone outline the church's teaching that sex outside of marriage, homosexual relations, abortion, masturbation and the viewing of pornography are "gravely evil."

    The language "undermines the mission of Catholic education and the inclusive, diverse and welcoming community we prize at our schools," said Jordan, who is an English teacher in San Francisco's Sacred Heart Cathedral Preparatory.

    State lawmakers have criticized the statement Cordileone proposed adding to the faculty handbook and asked for a probe of working conditions at the archdiocese's four San Francisco Bay Area Catholic high schools.

    Late Tuesday, the San Francisco Board of Supervisors joined the criticism and passed a resolution asking the conservative Catholic leader to respect the rights of teachers and administrators, the San Francisco Chronicle reported (http://bit.ly/1BS8Fdz).

    "These actions really conflict with the values of San Francisco," said Supervisor Mark Farrell, who introduced the resolution. "In San Francisco, we stand up for everyone. We stand up for our LGBT community and honor and embrace those who do the same."
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/0...n_6799864.html
    Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

  • #2
    You can tell the Catholic Church is in a bad place when its own teachers loudly object to teaching Catholic morality without fear of firing, let alone excommunication.
    "As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths." Isaiah 3:12

    There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.

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    • #3
      Originally posted by Darth Executor View Post
      You can tell the Catholic Church is in a bad place when its own teachers loudly object to teaching Catholic morality without fear of firing, let alone excommunication.
      It will be interesting to see if this Archbishop backs off or holds to his guns. After all this is only standard Catholic doctrine.
      Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

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      • #4
        How dare a Catholic want his Catholic school to be Catholic. This is an outrage.

        "Fire is catching. If we burn, you burn with us!"
        "I'm not going anywhere. I'm going to stay here and cause all kinds of trouble."
        Katniss Everdeen


        Christ our Passover has been sacrificed for us. Therefore let us keep the feast.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by seer View Post
          How dare he! Can't this neanderthal be stopped before he corrupts the children!

          http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/0...n_6799864.html
          I'll be the rare atheist that actually agrees, here. If you have accepted employment at a Roman Catholic institution, you show not be surprised that the institution upholds Catholic morality.
          "[Mathematics] is the revealer of every genuine truth, for it knows every hidden secret, and bears the key to every subtlety of letters; whoever, then, has the effrontery to pursue physics while neglecting mathematics should know from the start he will never make his entry through the portals of wisdom."
          --Thomas Bradwardine, De Continuo (c. 1325)

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          • #6
            Hmm. The article, as posted above, doesn't say that the kids are to be taught these things are "gravely evil." It only says that they are "gravely evil." If this is only a passive statement in the employment manual, it is not an unexpected view by the RCC. If it is an active requirement upon the teachers, I don't think this violates the rights of teachers. These teachers have chosen to work at a place which naturally would instill religious doctrines -- otherwise it would just be like a public school.

            I see the clever underlining of the view of the bishop over against the view of the city supervisor -- who seems to want to promote the wanton activity.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Boxing Pythagoras View Post
              I'll be the rare atheist that actually agrees, here. If you have accepted employment at a Roman Catholic institution, you show not be surprised that the institution upholds Catholic morality.
              Most American Roman Catholics don't actually agree with many Catholic beliefs. The culture and the general belief system are more important than the exact tenets. It's not that different from how many Jewish people treat Judaism.

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              • #8
                From research I've seen lately, the single fastest way for Christianity to lose adherents is to be anti-gay. This guy is promoting anti-gay beliefs in the single most strongly pro-gay city in the entire US. These kids will get to live their whole lives with the memory of just how anti-gay the Catholic Church of their childhood was.

                So I have mixed feelings about this. On the one hand, what the Archbishop is doing here is pretty evil, and has the potential to hurt gay teachers and students alike at the school. On the other hand it serves the greater good of making the students face up to the realities of the evils their religion teaches, which in the long run will serve to make them think more critically and skeptically about it.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Psychic Missile View Post
                  Most American Roman Catholics don't actually agree with many Catholic beliefs. The culture and the general belief system are more important than the exact tenets. It's not that different from how many Jewish people treat Judaism.
                  That's not really relevant. The fact that many Catholics disagree with Catholic morality doesn't alter the fact that it is Catholic morality. Again, a person should not be surprised that a Catholic institution upholds Catholic morals.
                  "[Mathematics] is the revealer of every genuine truth, for it knows every hidden secret, and bears the key to every subtlety of letters; whoever, then, has the effrontery to pursue physics while neglecting mathematics should know from the start he will never make his entry through the portals of wisdom."
                  --Thomas Bradwardine, De Continuo (c. 1325)

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                  • #10
                    I don't see a problem with the petition or resolution. Nothing wrong with pushing for changes. However, it's a Catholic school, and one would expect Catholic teachings to be taught there. So I also see nothing wrong with the archbishop cracking down on the staff.

                    I think the probe by the state lawmakers is completely inappropriate.
                    Middle-of-the-road swing voter. Feel free to sway my opinion.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Boxing Pythagoras View Post
                      That's not really relevant. The fact that many Catholics disagree with Catholic morality doesn't alter the fact that it is Catholic morality. Again, a person should not be surprised that a Catholic institution upholds Catholic morals.
                      Actually, what the majority of adherents believe does alter what a religion's morality is.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Psychic Missile View Post
                        Actually, what the majority of adherents believe does alter what a religion's morality is.
                        No, it actually doesn't. The Roman Catholic Church is not a democracy.
                        "[Mathematics] is the revealer of every genuine truth, for it knows every hidden secret, and bears the key to every subtlety of letters; whoever, then, has the effrontery to pursue physics while neglecting mathematics should know from the start he will never make his entry through the portals of wisdom."
                        --Thomas Bradwardine, De Continuo (c. 1325)

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Starlight View Post
                          From research I've seen lately, the single fastest way for Christianity to lose adherents is to be anti-gay.
                          And why would "Christianity" worry about losing adherents who do not agree with their Biblical teaching?
                          Micah 6:8 He has told you, O man, what is good; and what does the LORD require of you but to do justice, and to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God?

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Jedidiah View Post
                            And why would "Christianity" worry about losing adherents who do not agree with their Biblical teaching?
                            I'm reminded of old sermon story of the local church who disagreed over something, so had a schism, then disagreed over something else, and so had a schism, and it repeated until there was only one person left. And that last man said to himself "what a great day this is, for finally this church is pure and correct in all its teachings!"

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Starlight View Post
                              I'm reminded of old sermon story of the local church who disagreed over something, so had a schism, then disagreed over something else, and so had a schism, and it repeated until there was only one person left. And that last man said to himself "what a great day this is, for finally this church is pure and correct in all its teachings!"
                              And in real life, blessedly antisocial hermits are far rarer than accursed double-talking heretics. Let's see if you have the attention span for a longer story that actually refers to real life events:

                              Originally posted by Jim
                              Once upon a time, there was a Caliphate, and the Caliphate was hereditary. The Caliph had a thousand sons. When his grip weakened, the sons would kill or imprison each other till only one remained, who became the new Caliph. The Caliph was the supreme leader of both Church and State, and any preacher boy who claimed to be substantially holier than the Caliph was apt to wind up a head shorter. This prevented spirals of holiness competition.

                              The Caliphate was overthrown, because the Turks became sick of the burdens of empire, an empire in which outsiders were continually favored over Turks, not to mention that the Caliph tended to be noticeably whiter than the Turks.

                              In the ensuing chaos, the House of Saud grabbed quite a lot of land, on the basis that they were holier than anyone else. Since then, we have seen one movement after another claiming to be holier than the house of Saud. A day or so ago, US troops fled Yemen, abandoning their heavy weapons to the extremely holy Islamic State or the extremely holy Al Qaeda, or, very likely, both. Yemen has not fallen yet, probably will not fall for a quite a while, but the writing is on the wall.

                              To the extent that these movements adhere to the plain wording of the Koran and the Hadiths, they are delightfully reactionary. I particularly like Boko Haramís position on marriage and western education. But, if you simply stick to the plain wording, that kind of limits how holy you can be. So, as each strives to be holier than the other, we are seeing increasing egalitarianism and socialism. All holiness spirals tend to wind up in much the same place regardless of religion of origin, just as all aneuploid malignant metastatic cancers look very much alike, regardless of tissue of origin. Pretty soon they will be holier than Mohammed, as Christians have long been holier than Jesus. If it were not for that, I would convert to Boko Haramís brand of Islam right away.

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