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  • Judge recalls

    I've generally been uncomfortable with the idea of judge recalls; I want judges to feel safe making decisions that are correct under the law without having to face the backlash of an emotional public. However, I can't say I'm uncomfortable with the recall effort against Judge Marc Kelly in California, who gave a man who raped a 3 year old a light sentence under the grounds that he "didn't mean to hurt her".

    Recall elections aren't really that common so maybe for now the status quo isn't so bad for cases like this. I would become concerned if judges started being recalled left and right for political reasons.

    I don't really feel like linking to any articles on this case because of the graphic details; the case is easy enough to find.
    "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

  • #2
    Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
    I've generally been uncomfortable with the idea of judge recalls; I want judges to feel safe making decisions that are correct under the law without having to face the backlash of an emotional public. However, I can't say I'm uncomfortable with the recall effort against Judge Marc Kelly in California, who gave a man who raped a 3 year old a light sentence under the grounds that he "didn't mean to hurt her".

    Recall elections aren't really that common so maybe for now the status quo isn't so bad for cases like this. I would become concerned if judges started being recalled left and right for political reasons.

    I don't really feel like linking to any articles on this case because of the graphic details; the case is easy enough to find.
    This judge is wicked - plain and simple. Perhaps the judge is a pedophile himself.

    http://www.cnn.com/2015/04/09/us/cal...recall-effort/
    Last edited by seer; 04-10-2015, 02:20 PM.
    Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

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    • #3
      I don't think I'd count it as a political reason for the recall. I'd call it an issue of poor judgement (pun intended). There was a minimum sentence for the crime of which the defendant was clearly guilty. Although no stalking occurred, there's nothing to suggest that the guy won't spontaneously do something like that again. Society will always react strongly when little kids are sodomized, or otherwise abused. If a judge is seen to make shockingly bad decisions, a recall is understandable.

      I would look closer at the judge's record, but if I had a vote in the recall, I'd probably vote to recall.
      Middle-of-the-road swing voter. Feel free to sway my opinion.

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Yttrium View Post
        I don't think I'd count it as a political reason for the recall.
        Yeah, I don't count this as a political reason. I mean cases where a reasonable decision is made but where people on one side don't like it... like if a judge rules on whether a company violated environmental law or something, and people want revenge.
        "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

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        • #5
          Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
          Yeah, I don't count this as a political reason. I mean cases where a reasonable decision is made but where people on one side don't like it... like if a judge rules on whether a company violated environmental law or something, and people want revenge.
          Understandable, but it's good to have a system that lets the public remove bad judges in a timely manner. If the recall method is done in a fair manner, it should counter the revenge problems in most cases.
          Middle-of-the-road swing voter. Feel free to sway my opinion.

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          • #6
            The judge had a legal obligation to follow the law, which he ignored. IMO it doesn't even matter what the details of the case are, it's not his job to spontaneously re-legislate.
            "As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths." Isaiah 3:12

            There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.

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            • #7
              I'm more uncomfortable with electing judges in the first place. But in either election or appointment, there must be a way to address egregious cases. Preferably sooner rather than later.

              "He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot


              "Forgiveness is the way of love." Gary Chapman

              My Personal Blog

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              • #8
                Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
                I've generally been uncomfortable with the idea of judge recalls; I want judges to feel safe making decisions that are correct under the law without having to face the backlash of an emotional public. However, I can't say I'm uncomfortable with the recall effort against Judge Marc Kelly in California, who gave a man who raped a 3 year old a light sentence under the grounds that he "didn't mean to hurt her".

                Recall elections aren't really that common so maybe for now the status quo isn't so bad for cases like this. I would become concerned if judges started being recalled left and right for political reasons.

                I don't really feel like linking to any articles on this case because of the graphic details; the case is easy enough to find.
                I am with DE on this one. The judge ignored the rule of law and chose to let the guy off for is own touchy-feely reasons.
                Micah 6:8 He has told you, O man, what is good; and what does the LORD require of you but to do justice, and to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God?

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Yttrium View Post
                  I don't think I'd count it as a political reason for the recall. I'd call it an issue of poor judgement (pun intended). There was a minimum sentence for the crime of which the defendant was clearly guilty. Although no stalking occurred, there's nothing to suggest that the guy won't spontaneously do something like that again. Society will always react strongly when little kids are sodomized, or otherwise abused. If a judge is seen to make shockingly bad decisions, a recall is understandable.

                  I would look closer at the judge's record, but if I had a vote in the recall, I'd probably vote to recall.
                  Give it 30 years. By then those who would want to recall a judge for this sort of action will likely be called "pedophobes"

                  I'm always still in trouble again

                  "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                  "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                    Give it 30 years. By then those who would want to recall a judge for this sort of action will likely be called "pedophobes"
                    You think it'll be that long?
                    I DENOUNCE DONALD J. TRUMP AND ALL HIS IMMORAL ACTS.

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                    • #11
                      Squinty eyes, perpetual nervous full-toothed smile, perfectly silver hair with a face that doesn't really indicate advanced age, Gray Davis appointee...let's just say the judge is hitting my gaydar pretty hard:

                      mmarckellly.jpg

                      I'd say it's less the judge being a complete pedophile himself (have his computer searched just in case) than having a bit too much inappropriate sympathy with the perp, due to the slow evolving of his homosexual/hedonistic tendencies over time.

                      In this case, all preliminary reports indicate that he was once a pretty promising guy, though the political environment and life experiences possible in liberalizing California between 1982 and 2015 have of course been massively tilted in a hedonistic direction.

                      Much of the general outrage in this case seems to be over the reasoning behind the fact that he took 15 years off of the sentence, simply because while perp technically raped the girl, he totally didn't physically assault her or anything, so due to the lack of hate, everything was automatically 3/5 better.

                      This case is actually a quite consistent application of what's known as liberal harm-based morality, and the perfect demonstration of why it just doesn't work. I can easily imagine a sociopathic young kid being so absorbed in his video games that he backhands a toddler who wanders into his line of sight, and then as easily imagine him getting yelled at/belted at length by the toddler's mother/father afterward. I would never in any circumstances call for any imprisonment for it unless there was grievous injury as a result. Much like reckless driving, it's distasteful, stupid, and dangerous, but something recognized as a universal enough weakness that you're not imprisoned for it unless the consequences are extremely severe.

                      But rape of a child and its developmental and psychological consequences? Let's just say the knee-jerk public emotional response to its seriousness is a far truer guide than the attempt of an ever-more-disconnected hedonistic ruling class to parse a logical argument that puts it on the same level with everyday bumps and bruises.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
                        I want judges to feel safe
                        feels

                        There needs to be much more accountability by public servants, and not less, and if that opens up innocents to damage well then that's the will of the people, isn't it?

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Paprika View Post
                          feels

                          There needs to be much more accountability by public servants, and not less, and if that opens up innocents to damage well then that's the will of the people, isn't it?
                          Your obsession with the word "feels" is odd, and not even particularly applicable here given that the connotation here is more along the lines of "consider oneself".
                          "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
                            Your obsession with the word "feels" is odd
                            No, it's the contemporary masses' obsessions with their internal emotional states that is highly abnormal.

                            and not even particularly applicable here given that the connotation here is more along the lines of "consider oneself".
                            Then don't use the emotive 'feel' and use a word that connotes rational consideration.

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Paprika View Post
                              No, it's the contemporary masses' obsessions with their internal emotional states that is highly abnormal.


                              Then don't use the emotive 'feel' and use a word that connotes rational consideration.
                              This is a common use of the word in modern English. I am trying to post on a message board, not write an academic paper. Sheesh.
                              "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

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