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Edward Snowden: Hero or Traitor?

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  • Edward Snowden: Hero or Traitor?

    Just wandering what you people think about this guy.

  • #2
    The American people had a right to know the extent to which the government had intruded on their privacy, and if there were a better way for Snowden to have revealed it (given that no one else was apparently about to do so), I can't say what it would have been. Even if he betrayed the government, he was serving the people. I lean "hero".
    Don't call it a comeback. It's a riposte.

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    • #3
      Hero.

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      • #4
        He's irrelevant, because the message is more important than the messenger. We can't let ourselves get distracted by the messenger and the controversy that surrounds him. Some day in the future we can regard him as a hero, but right now we've got bigger fish to fry.
        Last edited by seanD; 02-02-2014, 01:47 PM.
        "I was the CIA director. We lied, we cheated, we stole, it was like... we had entire training courses. It reminds you of the glory of the American experiment." - Mike Pompeo, Secretary of State (source).

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        • #5
          Originally posted by seanD View Post
          He's irrelevant, because the message is more important than the messenger. We can't let ourselves get distracted by the messenger and the controversy that surrounds him. Some day in the future we can regard him as a hero, but right now we've got bigger fish to fry.
          It's not as though the man has disappeared from history: if he's a hero, he should probably not be in exile.
          Don't call it a comeback. It's a riposte.

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          • #6
            Whether hero or traitor, definitely more intelligent and competent than those he pulled his information from.

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            • #7
              It's good that he revealed spying on US citizens. It's bad that he revealed spying on foreign governments seeing how I expect any government to do that. I don't think the former earns him the title of hero but he most certainly qualifies as a traitor.
              "As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths." Isaiah 3:12

              There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Darth Executor View Post
                It's good that he revealed spying on US citizens. It's bad that he revealed spying on foreign governments seeing how I expect any government to do that. I don't think the former earns him the title of hero but he most certainly qualifies as a traitor.
                If it's reasonable to expect any government to spy on other governments, what makes it so traitorous for him to reveal that the US government was doing precisely that?
                Don't call it a comeback. It's a riposte.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Spartacus View Post
                  If it's reasonable to expect any government to spy on other governments, what makes it so traitorous for him to reveal that the US government was doing precisely that?
                  Revealing the details helps other governments counter said espionage, putting the US at a disadvantage. It's also not the sort of thing you openly admit since it can cause diplomatic difficulties for everyone involved.
                  "As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths." Isaiah 3:12

                  There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.

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                  • #10
                    On the list of people who deserve to be executed for traitorous action against the Constitution and the American Nation, Snowden ranks way below people like Chuck Schumer or John Boehner. They justify a surveillance state through the importation of Third World cultures and their various terrorists, and through the encouragement of various ways of avoiding and flouting the immigration laws currently on the books.

                    Selling US technology to China is certainly bad, but thus far China hasn't really proven itself adept enough to do much more than make inferior copies. Giving details of US surveillance to Russia is also bad, but Russia isn't exactly going to be invading anyone anytime soon. Destroying the US from within through the importation of savages like the Tsarnaevs (and thus justifying the massive surveillance state apparatus at all future public events) is far worse, and deserves far harsher and more summary penalties. Snowden isn't taking his downtime to organize coalitions for 'immigration reform.'

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                    • #11
                      A little bit of column A and a little bit of column B. I'm more or less in agreement with DE.

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                      • #12
                        I deem him a hero, primarily because he put a considerable amount of hurt to the United States government organization.

                        From a strictly non-USA perspective, and as Darth Executor adequately put, his info compromised the USA on the diplomatic front, which many nations opted to capitalize, and anything that sets back the USA on the global arena is a plus for me.
                        Ladino, Guatemalan, Hispanic, and Latin, but foremostly, Christian.

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                        • #13
                          Although I acknowledge that he was right to say knowledge of the methods makes counteracting it easier, I find the second part of DE's objection absurd: everyone knows the emperor has no clothes, but Snowden is a traitor for pointing it out?
                          Don't call it a comeback. It's a riposte.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Spartacus View Post
                            Although I acknowledge that he was right to say knowledge of the methods makes counteracting it easier, I find the second part of DE's objection absurd: everyone knows the emperor has no clothes, but Snowden is a traitor for pointing it out?
                            I'm not even sure what you mean by "the emperor has no clothes", find a better witticism.

                            trea·son [tree-zuhn] Show IPA
                            noun
                            1.
                            the offense of acting to overthrow one's government or to harm or kill its sovereign.
                            2.
                            a violation of allegiance to one's sovereign or to one's state.
                            3.
                            the betrayal of a trust or confidence; breach of faith; treachery.
                            Snowden clearly fits 2 and 3. While no doubt everybody assumes everybody else is spying on them, they don't know the details or the magnitude, which Snowden provided.
                            "As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths." Isaiah 3:12

                            There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Darth Executor View Post
                              I'm not even sure what you mean by "the emperor has no clothes", find a better witticism.
                              It's not a witticism, it's a literary reference. In the fairy tale, everyone can see that the emperor is naked, just as, apparently, everyone knows that the U.S. is spying on them. You would have states pretend, in their direct interactions with each other, as if this is not the case. Snowden provides evidence of what you suggest is obvious among states, and this is supposed to be a startling and scandalous revelation?
                              Don't call it a comeback. It's a riposte.

                              Comment

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