Bowe Bergdahl charged with desertion

[rogue06]

What ever happened to "not negotiating with terrorists?"

That, unfortunately, has always been pretty much a bit of a myth

[Sparko]

That, unfortunately, has always been pretty much a bit of a myth

If we give them 5 taliban to get back one deserter, then if we gave them the whole country back they will not shoot any soldiers.

Imagine the peace we could have had if we just let Japan and Germany have their way in WW2!

[rogue06]

Granting they were all "terrorists" — the lack of evidence needed to charge them notwithstanding — those who support the exchange would also be exonerated of blame for recruitment based on these terrorists' continued captivity in Guantanamo. Orange jumpsuits are still the last word in fashion for decapitation videos, and decapitation videos are still the last word in recruitment ... though "martyr-mission" bombings might give them a run for their money.

We kill that many "terrorists," with and without the caution quotes, in any given week through drone strikes. Five more out in the wild isn't the issue. The real problem, just from the numbers side, is the pipeline that keeps providing more of them.

Because we all know that they were having such a hard time recruiting folks before GITMO.

[Paprika]

The Weekly Standard isn't credible in general, and in this article, is obviously engaging in a historical revisionism that doesn't pass the chortle test. Again and again, they refer negatively to actions taken prior to 9/11, when the Northern Alliance were Russian allies, when al Qaeda was a co-belligerent with the US against the Soviets, and the Mujahedin were our courageous friends.

Red herring. This in no way negates the fact that they were senior leaders, and releasing them carries a high cost in terms of propaganda value and can give much strength to the enemy.

Or maybe you just can't take other news sources and need a NYT article to be convinced that yes, the five exchanged were indeed senior in the Taliban?

[Cow Poke]

The "perfect" hair is my go-to joke when I sense a need to lighten the mood in class. I usually mix it in with something self-deprecating.

I did my usual "Rapunzel" quiz a few weeks ago ...

Q: "How long does Rapunzel need to grow her hair to escape from the building?"

A: Base line * tan(elevation angle)

The weaker students needed a pick-me-up, so I went on about how, after all that work, she'd have to cut it off once she was down!

...

But it always grows back, right?

*peering up as if to see the top of my head*

*laughter*

Perfectly!

*more laughter*

But in fact I haven't lost much coverage. It's just a widow's peak that's been moving back slowly, along with general thinning. I figure I'll end up with a fringe around my crown, like my maternal grandfather. That's the usual inheritance.

Yes, my wife wanted to be sure my Dad had a full head of hair before she married me, cause she didn't want to be married to a bald guy.

I told her that "hair" comes from the Mother, and she doesn't know it, buy my Mom was wearing a wig*.




*no, she wasn't.

[rogue06]

The Weekly Standard isn't credible in general, and in this article, is obviously engaging in a historical revisionism that doesn't pass the chortle test. Again and again, they refer negatively to actions taken prior to 9/11, when the Northern Alliance were Russian allies, when al Qaeda was a co-belligerent with the US against the Soviets, and the Mujahedin were our courageous friends.

Rambo III

John Rambo's former Vietnam superior, Colonel Samuel Trautman, has been assigned to lead a mission to help the Mujahedeen rebels who are fighting the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan, but the Buddhist Rambo turns down Trautman's request that Rambo help out. When the mission goes belly up and Trautman is kidnapped and tortured by Russian Colonel Zaysen, Rambo launches a rescue effort and allies himself with the Mujahedeen rebels and gets their help in trying to rescue Trautman from Zaysen.

Keep that in mind as you're reading this ...

Mullah Mohammad Fazl ... prior to 9/11 ...

Mullah Norullah Noori (senior Taliban military commander): ... “fought ... against the Northern alliance.”

Abdul Haq Wasiq (Taliban deputy minister of intelligence): ... prior to 9/11 ...

Khairullah Khairkhwa (Taliban governor of the Herat province and former interior minister): ... prior to 9/11 ...

"We are at war with Eastasia. We've always been at war with Eastasia."

Even while celebrating the release of Bergdahl the only news source that you proclaim is credible described the five that were swapped as "including two senior militant commanders said to be linked to operations that killed American and allied troops as well as implicated in murdering thousands of Shiites in Afghanistan." A couple of days later as the euphoria of the White House Rose Garden celebratory announcement started to dissipate the New York Times referred to them as "five senior Taliban figures" and "five of its most prominent figures."

Keep in mind that these five were the ones that the Taliban listed by name as who they wanted. Nobody else. They obviously weren't asking for five random guys who merely had the ill fortune to be picked up in some sweep while out picking up some Kabuli Pulao to feed their families. They wanted and received "five senior Taliban figures."

[Cow Poke]

There's no need for a crystal ball when we've got video evidence of their predilection for manual decapitation.

Too bad you weren't around to show these videos to Bergdahl before he decided to go play pattycakes with the enemy.

[rogue06]

Please, tell me more about how Rambo III didn't represent American attitudes at the time.

Box Office

$53,715,611 (USA) (18 September 1988)
$53,693,407 (USA) (11 September 1988)
$53,668,183 (USA) (5 September 1988)
$53,630,055 (USA) (28 August 1988)
$53,593,129 (USA) (21 August 1988)
$53,496,856 (USA) (14 August 1988)
$53,377,574 (USA) (7 August 1988)
$53,177,694 (USA) (31 July 1988)
$52,825,988 (USA) (24 July 1988)
$52,291,449 (USA) (17 July 1988)
$50,557,449 (USA) (10 July 1988)
$49,293,739 (USA) (4 July 1988)
$47,116,095 (USA) (26 June 1988)
$44,043,695 (USA) (19 June 1988)
$39,491,869 (USA) (12 June 1988)
$32,328,865 (USA) (5 June 1988)
$21,207,353 (USA) (30 May 1988)

Y'all make this way too easy.

By this logic the success of American Sniper must indicate overwhelming support by the public for us to return in full force to Iraq.

"Too easy" indeed

[Cow Poke]

It could be done after the election just as he prepares to leave office.

And that wouldn't surprise me -- leave the mess for the next batch of liberals to deal with.

I could see a miffed Obama doing it if the Republicans win the presidency as a way of thumbing his nose at the American public for letting him down.

He does seem to have a pretty thin skin that way.

[myth]

You're a LEO. That's a fact. Previously, you've made statements against trying police officers in the press. Absent the above, it wouldn't be hard to argue you were merely standing on principle.

The above suggests the need for a different calculus.



You're claiming, at the same time, mind you, that ...

My military friends and co-workers all have pretty harsh things to say about what they wish would happen to him (usually entailing his untimely and painful demise).

And that that ...

entails going against the will of your superior officers

If you need more rope, please don't hesitate to ask.

I am totally loving this.

So, are you saying that the administration should ignore known facts whilst pursuing the release of a citizen likely to be imprisoned by our own government? Let's be real. What, exactly, do you think the administration couldn't have done (investigation-wise) before getting Bergdahl back? I think they could have learned enough (i.e. every fact possible except Bergdahl's side of the story) to reach some conclusions about whether it's worth trading 5 terrorist leaders for him. I'm not saying we should "convict him in the press" or treat him as if he were convicted without a trial.

I'm drawing a distinction here that you don't seem to notice. I'm saying we could probably justify not trying to get him back while at the same time not being able to imprison him ourselves (because yes, he hasn't been to trial). If you disagree, that's fine. But I haven't seen you explain why.

And yes, I am a LEO. So maybe that does make me biased. But I'm biased from the perspective of someone who's intimately acquainted with our justice system. I know that guilty people walk free every day because justice system sometimes excludes perfectly legitimate (in my opinion) evidence. And while that bothers me, I'm ok with it. Because I'd rather let two guilty people go free than imprison one innocent. On the same hand, though, I don't think our justice system is the be-all, end-all for determining truth. Guilty men go free and innocent men are declared guilty too often for me to have blind faith in the system. I can evaluate facts for myself. I just recognize that I don't have the authority to impose a sentence based on my conclusions.

Also, I'm not sure how my veteran friends' opinions enter into this part of the conversation. I didn't say that was my opinion. I merely pointed it out because you said, "The folks currently screaming for this guy's blood are no better than his Taliban captors, in my humble opinion." It sounded a lot like you were besmirching the honor of American soldiers whom I know by comparing them to the Taliban, and I felt that was uncalled for. Also, the "going against the will of superior officers" bit was about pissing off the administration, not killing Bergdahl.

[rogue06]

The person that Obama's National Security Advisor, Susan Rice, proclaimed had "served the United States with honor and distinction" before trading five top level terrorist leaders for him was detained for several hours earlier this week during a pot raid on a rural property in Mendocino County, California that was being used to cultivate marijuana for commercial benefit (181 fully grown plants were found). IOW, he was on a pot farm.

When asked if Bergdahl knew that there was marijuana on the property, and if he was near the plants, Captain Greg Van Patten of the Mendocino County Sheriff’s Office responded, "Anybody would have been aware there was marijuana on the property" and that "The activity that was going on there, it would have been obvious to him."

Still, he was released without being charged after military officials requested that he be returned to his duty station at Joint Base San Antonio-Fort Sam Houston. According to Van Patten the sheriff’s office drove Bergdahl 40 or 50 miles, to a meeting point where he was then met by Army personnel from the Bay Area.