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  • #31
    Originally posted by square_peg View Post
    Your attempt to spin my words around is amusing,
    It wasn't an attempt. I actually did it.

    but I'm not the one attempting to (apparently) seriously argue that he's a Muslim,
    Neither am I.

    or that it's a significant problem if he actually is a Muslim, or that he was born in Kenya, or that he specifically encouraged welcoming in illegal immigrants when he specifically did not.
    So, put down your broad brush, and pick up a pen.
    The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

    Comment


    • #32
      Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
      There's that slip (which is a very odd slip)
      But obviously a slip.

      but also the countless other things he has said in favor of Islam.
      Okay, lets take the pile of bad evidence, which will integrate into a bad case for his muslimhood.

      For instance, Obama telling the United Nations, "The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam."
      "The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam. But to be credible, those who condemn that slander must also condemn the hate we see in the images of Jesus Christ that are desecrated, or churches that are destroyed, or the Holocaust that is denied."

      This in a talk where he says essentially that 'people who do mean things to other people are bad' and 'Christians be nice to muslims and muslims be nice to Christians'. Muslim rhetoric? No.

      Read the speech here: http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-...neral-assembly

      In a July 2014 speech, he credited Islam with "building the very fabric of our nation and strengthening the core of our democracy."
      Following your quote I found "In the United States, Eid also reminds us of the many achievements and contributions of Muslim Americans to building the very fabric of our nation and strengthening the core of our democracy."

      Not Islam. Moving on...

      He has been quick to encourage and support Muslim uprisings around the world -- the Muslim Brotherhood and Arab Spring to name two
      Yawn.

      as well as his open support for Palestine
      Dude, all liberals are gay for Palestine. I'm not a liberal, and even I have sympathy for that country.

      and condemnation of Israel.
      One of the few things I'll say amen to with what president Obama did, that and axing the Shuttle program and starting COTS (resulting in SpaceX).

      He once described the Muslim call to prayer as "the sweetest sound I know".
      Out of this list, this is all that's left. So? Politicians have a habit of being fairly friendly to other countries. I won't even look this up to see if the context makes it even worse than what you're saying. If Ron Paul commented on the beauty of Notre Dame I would not suspect that he's a Catholic.

      As the saying goes, if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck then it's probably a duck.
      Yup, a liberal politically correct politician.

      Comment


      • #33
        Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
        I think, whatever the rationale, it's pretty clear that Obama can't seem to grasp the concept that Islamist extremists fully intend to expand by whatever means necessary, regardless of his assessment that they're just the junior varsity.
        Yup.

        Comment


        • #34
          Originally posted by Leonhard View Post
          Yup, a liberal politically correct politician.
          That's how I see it.
          I DENOUNCE DONALD J. TRUMP AND ALL HIS IMMORAL ACTS.

          Comment


          • #35
            Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
            I think, whatever the rationale, it's pretty clear that Obama can't seem to grasp the concept that Islamist extremists fully intend to expand by whatever means necessary, regardless of his assessment that they're just the junior varsity.
            He also can't seem to grasp the fact that there's no such thing as "Muslim extremists", there are only Muslims. It'd be akin to calling a Christian who doesn't drink, steal, or fornicate a "Christian extremist".
            Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
            But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
            Than a fool in the eyes of God


            From "Fools Gold" by Petra

            Comment


            • #36
              Originally posted by Leonhard View Post
              But obviously a slip.



              Okay, lets take the pile of bad evidence, which will integrate into a bad case for his muslimhood.



              "The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam. But to be credible, those who condemn that slander must also condemn the hate we see in the images of Jesus Christ that are desecrated, or churches that are destroyed, or the Holocaust that is denied."

              This in a talk where he says essentially that 'people who do mean things to other people are bad' and 'Christians be nice to muslims and muslims be nice to Christians'. Muslim rhetoric? No.

              Read the speech here: http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-...neral-assembly



              Following your quote I found "In the United States, Eid also reminds us of the many achievements and contributions of Muslim Americans to building the very fabric of our nation and strengthening the core of our democracy."

              Not Islam. Moving on...



              Yawn.



              Dude, all liberals are gay for Palestine. I'm not a liberal, and even I have sympathy for that country.



              One of the few things I'll say amen to with what president Obama did, that and axing the Shuttle program and starting COTS (resulting in SpaceX).



              Out of this list, this is all that's left. So? Politicians have a habit of being fairly friendly to other countries. I won't even look this up to see if the context makes it even worse than what you're saying. If Ron Paul commented on the beauty of Notre Dame I would not suspect that he's a Catholic.



              Yup, a liberal politically correct politician.
              "Out of this list, this is all that's left."

              Yes, you deftly handwaved away everything else.
              Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
              But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
              Than a fool in the eyes of God


              From "Fools Gold" by Petra

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
                He also can't seem to grasp the fact that there's no such thing as "Muslim extremists", there are only Muslims. It'd be akin to calling a Christian who doesn't drink, steal, or fornicate a "Christian extremist".
                I remember when there was discussion about taking "Onward Christian Soldiers" out of our hymnal because it was too "militant".
                The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                Comment


                • #38
                  Originally posted by square_peg View Post
                  It seems to me that there is a substantial difference between people who once trespassed a long time ago and have never tried to harm anyone and legitimately want to contribute positively to the country, compared to people who snuck in as gang members engaging in drug cartels and murders.

                  He said that they would be allowed to stay temporarily, not indefinitely. This is what I meant by "misrepresenting his position."
                  Those who want to contribute positively to the country should have entered the country legally, or at least applied for citizenship through the proper channels.

                  And you say that the stay is temporary? Really? What date is Obama planning to lift the ban on deportation and start actively removing from the country those who are here illegally?
                  Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
                  But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
                  Than a fool in the eyes of God


                  From "Fools Gold" by Petra

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
                    "Out of this list, this is all that's left."

                    Yes, you deftly handwaved away everything else.
                    More like you handwaving at evidence, and me doing a minimum of research into it.

                    In the places where you didn't simple attribute things that weren't at all in what Obama said, you offered me things that could have come out of the mouth of any smarmy liberal politician. Simplest hypothesis: He's a smarmy liberal politician.

                    Complex raised-secretly-as-a-muslim-or-had-conversion-experience and kept-it-hidden-working-behind-scenes, etc... doesn't have much going for it. Not an impossible conspiracy theory, but hasn't got any support.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      It seems to me that there is a substantial difference between people who once trespassed a long time ago and have never tried to harm anyone and legitimately want to contribute positively to the country, compared to people who snuck in as gang members engaging in drug cartels and murders.
                      The larger community of lesser criminals is the sea in which the greater criminals hide. Much more so if the lesser criminals speak the same language, have the same attitudes, get their fake IDs from the same supplier, are supported by the same government, look the same and have the same ancestry and all that that implies, etc.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by square_peg View Post
                        It seems to me that there is a substantial difference between people who once trespassed a long time ago and have never tried to harm anyone and legitimately want to contribute positively to the country, compared to people who snuck in as gang members engaging in drug cartels and murders.
                        Having once entered the nation illegally they remain illegal every day they do not leave. Just because some time has passed does not erase the crime they are continually guilty of.
                        Micah 6:8 He has told you, O man, what is good; and what does the LORD require of you but to do justice, and to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God?

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          So let's look at an example. A couple of young people illegally enter the US. They marry and have a child who goes to school in the US. They are apprehended. Who gets deported?

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Originally posted by pancreasman View Post
                            So let's look at an example. A couple of young people illegally enter the US. They marry and have a child who goes to school in the US. They are apprehended. Who gets deported?
                            Everyone. Children are the natural slaves of their parents, and breaking up a family is far more psychologically traumatizing and socially damaging to all parties then relocating them.

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Originally posted by Epoetker View Post
                              Children are the natural slaves of their parents....
                              Wow. I believe you have just out epo'd yourself.
                              The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                                Wow. I believe you have just out epo'd yourself.
                                New and fun quotes daily!
                                Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

                                https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

                                Comment

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