Income Inequality?

[Paprika]

Not in the same way as homosexual marriage, which is a substantial drain on government resources by way of provision of extra benefits not previously offered.

How much?

Lack of charity does not directly reduce the government coffers.

Avarice is not the same as lack of charity.

[Bill the Cat]

How much?

No one has really done any direct research on it, so I don't really know. But any additional benefit by default reduces the Government's cash.

Avarice is not the same as lack of charity.

Then I must not be responding to the right argument. Last I read, we were talking about why businesses should or should not be forced to be charitable.

[Paprika]

No one has really done any direct research on it, so I don't really know. But any additional benefit by default reduces the Government's cash.

You claimed that it would be a "substantial" drain.

Then I must not be responding to the right argument. Last I read, we were talking about why businesses should or should not be forced to be charitable.

No. You yourself said that "avarice is a personal moral failing while homosexual marriage is a social/legal issue'; we were discussing the place of Christian norms and values with regards to these two issues in secular society.

[Spartacus]

Charity is important for a Christian because the Lord Himself commanded it of us. It is wholly unnecessary for non-Christian business owners, they have absolutely ZERO obligation to obey any request for non-self initiated charity, and we have no command from the Lord to force charity on others. It has nothing at all to do with feeling good or survival. While those are possible outcomes, our command to be charitable is out of obedience to Christ, not out of arrogance or pity.

Charity has nothing to do with survival. Charity has nothing to do with actually helping the poor. Is that what you're telling me?

[Cow Poke]

Charity has nothing to do with survival. Charity has nothing to do with actually helping the poor. Is that what you're telling me?

[Spartacus]

reread it. you're right, but he's still wrong.

[Bill the Cat]

You claimed that it would be a "substantial" drain.

United States v. Windsor was one single incident that ended up costing the Government $363,053 in estate taxes. The math logically supports my claim

No. You yourself said that "avarice is a personal moral failing while homosexual marriage is a social/legal issue'; we were discussing the place of Christian norms and values with regards to these two issues in secular society.

Avarice is a personal issue where a single person fails in a moral decision which results in potential harm to a segment of society (with no government intervention or responsibility) while homosexual marriage is a social issue that government has a particular role in intervening. That's the difference. We do not need to legislate things that have no bearing on government responsibility, such as personal avarice. We DO need to legislate things that the government is directly responsible for (like providing government benefits).

[Bill the Cat]

Charity has nothing to do with survival.

Correlation is not causation. If I refuse to be charitable, nothing stops YOU from doing so. It's a personal decision that should NEVER be mandated.

Charity has nothing to do with actually helping the poor. Is that what you're telling me?

Are you being intentionally obtuse? While those are possible outcomes Can you see it better now? Christian charity is mandated by Christ. We do not do so for any personal gain. Period.

[Cow Poke]

Can you see it better now? Christian charity is mandated by Christ. We do not do so for any personal gain. Period.

This is quite an interesting phenomomenmonomoemomom, though... God blesses us when we are charitable (I believe) but we don't want that to be our motivator. It's just neat that, so many times, when we are obedient to His commands, it has that "benefit".

[Spartacus]

Correlation is not causation. If I refuse to be charitable, nothing stops YOU from doing so. It's a personal decision that should NEVER be mandated.



Are you being intentionally obtuse? While those are possible outcomes Can you see it better now? Christian charity is mandated by Christ. We do not do so for any personal gain. Period.

post #276 dude

[Spartacus]

This is quite an interesting phenomomenmonomoemomom, though... God blesses us when we are charitable (I believe) but we don't want that to be our motivator. It's just neat that, so many times, when we are obedient to His commands, it has that "benefit".

I've been slowly working my way through a book that, so far, has been almost entirely about that-- Charity by Gary Anderson

[Cow Poke]

I've been slowly working my way through a book that, so far, has been almost entirely about that-- Charity by Gary Anderson

And a brief synopsis in regular guy terms?

[Spartacus]

And a brief synopsis in regular guy terms?

So far, Anderson's focus has been on Second-Temple Judaism and especially the Book of Tobit. Back then, the Jews apparently thought of almsgiving as a deposit in a divine treasury. By thus giving a loan to God through the poor, they became in a weak sense God's creditor (Anderson started by playing around with the connection between faith and credit).

Honestly, I started the book a few months ago and have only picked it up periodically since then, so I don't remember the early foundational chapters as well as I understand the more recent ones on Tobit-- I'm far too easily distracted

[Cow Poke]

So far, Anderson's focus has been on Second-Temple Judaism and especially the Book of Tobit. Back then, the Jews apparently thought of almsgiving as a deposit in a divine treasury. By thus giving a loan to God through the poor, they became in a weak sense God's creditor (Anderson started by playing around with the connection between faith and credit).

Honestly, I started the book a few months ago and have only picked it up periodically since then, so I don't remember the early foundational chapters as well as I understand the more recent ones on Tobit-- I'm far too easily distracted

Thanks for sharing that.

[Spartacus]

Thanks for sharing that.

Have you ever read the book of Tobit? I'd not be surprised or offended if not, since it's a deuterocanonical, but it's kinda hard to talk about deuterocanonicals when I'm told to bring in "regular guy terms"