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Income Inequality?

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  • Originally posted by Jedidiah View Post
    I believe I answered that in that very post. If you have a question, ask it.
    So what's the difference between appealing to Christian values and morality to avarice and to gay marriage? What makes one "apples" and the other "oranges"?
    Last edited by Paprika; 10-23-2014, 01:13 AM.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Zymologist View Post
      I'm interested. Could you describe a solution to this (as briefly as you like), economically?
      Originally posted by Spartacus View Post
      It starts by seeing the economy primarily as something that's supposed to serve human needs rather than something whose needs we must fill by our labor. Or, as I said before, businesses exist to participate in the common good. A business owner seeks profit only insofar as it helps to sustain the business, which also includes providing for the needs of employees. A business owner might ask those who benefit from the goods or services he provides to compensate him at a rate which will allow him to continue providing those goods or services. In other words, a business owner makes a product, charges consumers for it, and pays his employees. In a lot of ways, it doesn't look all that different from what we already have, but profits are made to serve people rather than the other way around.
      I'll add something: there needs to be a change in purchasing habits.

      Ceteris paribus, the business owner who is greedy is generally able to price goods at a lower price. So if purchasers go for the lower priced goods, who are they incentivising? Ergo the concept of fair trade.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Paprika View Post
        So what's the difference between appealing to Christian values and morality to avarice and to gay marriage? What makes one "apples" and the other "oranges"?
        Avarice is a personal moral failing while homosexual marriage is a social/legal issue.
        That's what
        - She

        Without a clear-cut definition of sin, morality becomes a mere argument over the best way to train animals
        - Manya the Holy Szin (The Quintara Marathon)

        I may not be as old as dirt, but me and dirt are starting to have an awful lot in common
        Stephen R. Donaldson

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Bill the Cat View Post
          Avarice is a personal moral failing while homosexual marriage is a social/legal issue.
          So individuals' avarice have no social impact at all?

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Paprika View Post
            So individuals' avarice have no social impact at all?
            Depends on how much they have to be greedy with. But that's far from the point.
            That's what
            - She

            Without a clear-cut definition of sin, morality becomes a mere argument over the best way to train animals
            - Manya the Holy Szin (The Quintara Marathon)

            I may not be as old as dirt, but me and dirt are starting to have an awful lot in common
            Stephen R. Donaldson

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Paprika View Post
              I'll add something: there needs to be a change in purchasing habits.

              Ceteris paribus, the business owner who is greedy is generally able to price goods at a lower price. So if purchasers go for the lower priced goods, who are they incentivising? Ergo the concept of fair trade.
              How do you propose getting consumers to pay MORE for things they can get for less?
              The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Bill the Cat View Post
                Depends on how much they have to be greedy with. But that's far from the point.
                Not at all. If individuals' avarice can and do have significant negative social impacts, avarice becomes a social issue.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                  How do you propose getting consumers to pay MORE for things they can get for less?
                  You might want to look up the implementation of fair trade which I mentioned earlier. That is one possible route.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Paprika View Post
                    You might want to look up the implementation of fair trade which I mentioned earlier. That is one possible route.
                    No, I really don't. Poor people really don't care about 'fair trade' - they care about the bottom dollar. When you have a limited amount of money, you're glad to be able to buy more for less.
                    The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                      No, I really don't. Poor people really don't care about 'fair trade' - they care about the bottom dollar. When you have a limited amount of money, you're glad to be able to buy more for less.
                      Indeed, but what about those who can afford to do so?

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Paprika View Post
                        Indeed, but what about those who can afford to do so?
                        Sure, but even those who can "afford" to do so have to be MOTIVATED to do so -- that's an uphill battle. And many of us see this as a gimmick.
                        The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                          Sure, but even those who can "afford" to do so have to be MOTIVATED to do so -- that's an uphill battle.
                          Indeed, and hasn't the free trade movement managed to motivate many of them to do so?

                          And many of us see this as a gimmick.
                          You asked how I propose to get consumers to pay more for things they can get for less. As is clear from the fair trade movement, it is certainly possible to do so. And you answer your own question: there needs to be an motivation that will outweigh the motivation to go for the cheaper product.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Paprika View Post
                            Indeed, and hasn't the free trade movement managed to motivate many of them to do so?
                            I really don't know -- I have largely ignored it.

                            You asked how I propose to get consumers to pay more for things they can get for less. As is clear from the fair trade movement, it is certainly possible to do so. And you answer your own question: there needs to be an motivation that will outweigh the motivation to go for the cheaper product.
                            I think most people see fair trade as a "foo foo" movement. It seems more like an effort to make things better "over there" (it's usually the GLOBAL aspect that's touted), than here at home.

                            It's an education challenge.
                            The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                            Comment


                            • It seems like "Fair Trade" is related to "everybody is equal, but some are more equal than others".

                              Surprise! Fairtrade Doesn't Benefit The Poor Peasants


                              Source: Forbes (citing School of Oriental Studies of London)



                              What did surprise us is how wages are typically lower, and on the whole conditions worse, for workers in areas with Fairtrade organisations than for those in other areas.

                              Careful statistical analysis allowed us to separate out the possible effects of other factors, such as the scale of production. Still, the differences were in most cases, and especially for wages, statistically significant. Explaining why it should be that workers in areas dominated by Fairtrade organisations are so often worse off than workers in other areas is a complex and challenging task. Our full report explores some possible reasons.

                              It was also surprising to learn that many people do not benefit from the “community” projects supported with funds generated by the “social premium” consumers pay for Fairtrade products. Researchers at London’s School of Oriental and African Studies (Soas) found that many of the poorest are unable to use these facilities. In one Fairtrade tea co-operative the modern toilets funded with the premium were exclusively for the use of senior co-op managers.

                              © Copyright Original Source



                              Also, see here.

                              ETA: I have often wondered about "Fair Trade", so I started a new thread so as not to derail this one further.
                              Last edited by Cow Poke; 10-23-2014, 10:07 AM.
                              The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Paprika View Post
                                You might want to look up the implementation of fair trade which I mentioned earlier. That is one possible route.
                                Not in the same way as homosexual marriage, which is a substantial drain on government resources by way of provision of extra benefits not previously offered. Lack of charity does not directly reduce the government coffers.
                                That's what
                                - She

                                Without a clear-cut definition of sin, morality becomes a mere argument over the best way to train animals
                                - Manya the Holy Szin (The Quintara Marathon)

                                I may not be as old as dirt, but me and dirt are starting to have an awful lot in common
                                Stephen R. Donaldson

                                Comment

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