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Two More Wins For Freedom...

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  • Two More Wins For Freedom...

    Thankfully, a little more sanity....

    Companies are not required to pay for employees' contraceptives for women if they have religious objections, the Supreme Court ruled today. The justices' decision came in a 5-4 ruling in the much anticipated case. Supreme Court Justice Samuel Alito wrote the majority opinion and Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg wrote the main dissent.
    http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/hobby...ry?id=24364311


    WASHINGTON (AP) -- The Supreme Court dealt a blow to public sector unions Monday, ruling that thousands of home health care workers in Illinois cannot be required to pay fees that help cover the union's costs of collective bargaining.
    http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories...06-30-10-08-45
    Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

  • #2

    "He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot


    "Forgiveness is the way of love." Gary Chapman

    My Personal Blog

    My Novella blog (Current Novella Begins on 7/25/14)

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    • #3
      3 For I delivered to you as of first importance what I also received: that Christ died for our sins in accordance with the Scriptures, 4 that he was buried, that he was raised on the third day in accordance with the Scriptures --1 Corinthians 15:3-4 (borrowed with gratitude from 37818's sig)

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Teallaura View Post
        Teallaura, since you seem to know the law, can't this ruling be applied, at least in principle, to this case that we have been discussing?

        The owner of a Colorado bakery has vowed to stop making wedding cakes entirely after a court ruled he discriminated against a pair of gay grooms-to-be when he refused to sell them a cake.

        On May 30, Colorado's Civil Rights Commission upheld a December 2013 ruling which found that Masterpiece Cakeshop owner Jack Phillips had discriminated against Dave Mullins and Charlie Craig when he denied their request for a wedding cake in 2012. Phillips, a devout Christian, had argued that the decision violated his First Amendment rights to free speech and free exercise of his religion.
        http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/0...n_5438726.html
        Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

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        • #5
          I applaud the decision though I personally think that such companies should at least seek to make exceptions for non-sexually active/post-menopausal women who need the pills for alternative medical purposes.
          "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

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          • #6
            That's what
            - She

            Without a clear-cut definition of sin, morality becomes a mere argument over the best way to train animals
            - Manya the Holy Szin (The Quintara Marathon)

            I may not be as old as dirt, but me and dirt are starting to have an awful lot in common
            Stephen R. Donaldson

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            • #7
              BTW, how do I respond to a lawyer's argument that this would allow Christian Science owners to prohibit all medical care? "the Supreme Court has essentially held that the Establishment Clause forbids the law from making distinctions based on a religious belief's content, which would essentially discriminate against minority faiths. If we have to respect a Catholic's religious opposition to abortion, we have to respect a Christian Scientist's opposition to all medical treatment."
              "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by seer View Post
                Teallaura, since you seem to know the law, can't this ruling be applied, at least in principle, to this case that we have been discussing?



                http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/0...n_5438726.html
                I haven't seen the decision itself yet but from what I've read it's fairly narrow. Offhand, I don't think so - but I can't say for certain yet.

                "He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot


                "Forgiveness is the way of love." Gary Chapman

                My Personal Blog

                My Novella blog (Current Novella Begins on 7/25/14)

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
                  BTW, how do I respond to a lawyer's argument that this would allow Christian Science owners to prohibit all medical care? "the Supreme Court has essentially held that the Establishment Clause forbids the law from making distinctions based on a religious belief's content, which would essentially discriminate against minority faiths. If we have to respect a Catholic's religious opposition to abortion, we have to respect a Christian Scientist's opposition to all medical treatment."
                  1) It would only allow some - the Court's decision was fairly narrow so private holders that aren't closely affiliated probably wouldn't be included - certainly no widely held corporations would be.

                  2) So what? There are already dozens of exceptions to this thing and Obama hands out waivers like candy - at least this has a legitimate 1st Amendment grounding unlike the waiver for Mickey D's....

                  3) Probably wouldn't apply to the 'life or limb' rights already observed (the reason ER's have to treat almost all comers) even if you did find a closely held corporation that would otherwise fit the decision.

                  "He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot


                  "Forgiveness is the way of love." Gary Chapman

                  My Personal Blog

                  My Novella blog (Current Novella Begins on 7/25/14)

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Practically speaking I doubt this will have much of an effect one way or the other since the Court's decision left the door open for the HHS to bypass individual companies' policies in this case as they already allow for religious nonprofits.
                    "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
                      Practically speaking I doubt this will have much of an effect one way or the other since the Court's decision left the door open for the HHS to bypass individual companies' policies in this case as they already allow for religious nonprofits.
                      ? I don't follow.

                      "He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot


                      "Forgiveness is the way of love." Gary Chapman

                      My Personal Blog

                      My Novella blog (Current Novella Begins on 7/25/14)

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Teallaura View Post
                        ? I don't follow.
                        Page 9 on the court PDF here: http://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions...3-354_olp1.pdf It basically says that an exception was already in place for religious nonprofits so their employees could go through the government if they really wanted contraceptive coverage, and the Court said there's no reason this couldn't be extended for companies like Hobby Lobby as well.
                        "I am not angered that the Moral Majority boys campaign against abortion. I am angry when the same men who say, "Save OUR children" bellow "Build more and bigger bombers." That's right! Blast the children in other nations into eternity, or limbless misery as they lay crippled from "OUR" bombers! This does not jell." - Leonard Ravenhill

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by KingsGambit View Post
                          BTW, how do I respond to a lawyer's argument that this would allow Christian Science owners to prohibit all medical care? "the Supreme Court has essentially held that the Establishment Clause forbids the law from making distinctions based on a religious belief's content, which would essentially discriminate against minority faiths. If we have to respect a Catholic's religious opposition to abortion, we have to respect a Christian Scientist's opposition to all medical treatment."
                          Would that be a bad thing? Why should employers be forced to pay for their employees' insurance at all?

                          That most health insurance is paid for by third parties is part of the problem to begin with.

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                          • #14
                            To those who favor the first of the rulings, do you think that an employer should not have to pay for any portion of a person's healthcare if it conflicts with religious beliefs? Is your opinion based within the legality of the healthcare payment mandate or as a part of the idea that they shouldn't be made to pay at all, and any blow against it is good?

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Psychic Missile View Post
                              To those who favor the first of the rulings, do you think that an employer should not have to pay for any portion of a person's healthcare if it conflicts with religious beliefs? Is your opinion based within the legality of the healthcare payment mandate or as a part of the idea that they shouldn't be made to pay at all, and any blow against it is good?
                              No PM, I don't think any employer should be forced by law to pay for health insurance, and if they do can provide or not provide whatever specifics they choose. Since when does the government get to tell a private business what benefits they have to offer?
                              Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

                              https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

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