Announcement

Collapse

Civics 101 Guidelines

Want to argue about politics? Healthcare reform? Taxes? Governments? You've come to the right place!

Try to keep it civil though. The rules still apply here.
See more
See less

Discuss the JFK murder

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Discuss the JFK murder

    [This was written before the crash]
    Judge Andrew Napolitano endorses Roger Stone's book, which is basically in agreement with the thesis that LBJ's monster ambition and greed were major factors in the JFK killing (see my review some time ago of Nelson's The Mastermind of the JFK Assassination). Eta: Ron Paul also mentioned the Stone book favorably. http://twitter.com/Judgenap/status/397752747426320384


    I think Sparko and Rogue would find it hard to statisfactorily answer Stone's explict and implicit questions.
    The greater number of laws . . . , the more thieves . . . there will be. ---- Lao-Tzu

    [T]he truth I’m after and the truth never harmed anyone. What harms us is to persist in self-deceit and ignorance -— Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

  • #2
    President John F. Kennedy is still dead.






    With apologies to Chevy Chase

    I'm always still in trouble again

    "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
    "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

    Comment


    • #3
      Even smart people occasionally do dumb things.

      "He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot


      "Forgiveness is the way of love." Gary Chapman

      My Personal Blog

      My Novella blog (Current Novella Begins on 7/25/14)

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
        President John F. Kennedy is still dead.






        With apologies to Chevy Chase
        I don't understand. Care to explain?
        Originally posted by Teallaura View Post
        Even smart people occasionally do dumb things.
        Did you mean you think rogue is one of those smart people?
        The greater number of laws . . . , the more thieves . . . there will be. ---- Lao-Tzu

        [T]he truth I’m after and the truth never harmed anyone. What harms us is to persist in self-deceit and ignorance -— Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Truthseeker View Post
          I don't understand. Care to explain?
          I was born after President Kennedy died. I do not have this emotional attachement to the era so this is just a fact of history to me. At this point, even if you could unearth the conspiracy, it gets you where?

          Also: "Anyone who is among the living has hope—even a live dog is better off than a dead lion!" - Ecclesiasties 9:4. President Kennedy is dead - he can not do anything for us now.
          "For I desire mercy, not sacrifice, and acknowledgment of God rather than burnt offerings." Hosea 6:6

          "Theology can be an intellectual entertainment." Metropolitan Anthony Bloom

          Comment


          • #6
            President John F. Kennedy was killed by Lee Harvey Oswald, a known Communist sympathizer. Communist sympathizers, from Lee Harvey Oswald to Patty Hearst to Malcolm X to Jared Loughner, are, like most extreme-pro-government activists, generally prone to disaffection and acting out on their own. While they could be used as pawns of various powers that be, most canny politicians keep them at arm's length.

            While I agree that McCarthy and the John Birch society did, in retrospect, have very good points on the extent of Communist influence at the highest levels of US government, the only major difference between Kennedy and Johnson tactics-wise was that most of the underhanding dealing on the Kennedy side was handled by Joe Kennedy, whereas Johnson preferred to do those deeds himself. In other words, if you're interested in it because you or your parents think JFK himself was a last, best hope for America, well...no, not so much. Both eagerly jumped into political dirty-dealing, either would have followed much the same political course, absent a stronger Cold Warrior vibe from JFK.

            Neither were as risible as Ted Kennedy, and both were Democrats, among whom double-dealing, blind ambition, endless backroom maneuvering, and fountains of double-speak are as natural as breathing. There may be something here, but investigating and chronicling the political misdeeds of America's current corrupt governing party takes away valuable time you could be using to ensure that their rule is brought to a swift and final end.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Thoughtful Monk View Post
              I was born after President Kennedy died. I do not have this emotional attachement to the era so this is just a fact of history to me. At this point, even if you could unearth the conspiracy, it gets you where?
              A world that is better educated about what happened. The more education, the greater ability to make good decisions. At least, tend to make good decisions. Also, good practice in reasoning and in evaluating arguments. Did not the Founding Fathers rely on their knowledge of history, including Roman, to create the U.S. Constitution?
              Also: "Anyone who is among the living has hope—even a live dog is better off than a dead lion!" - Ecclesiasties 9:4. President Kennedy is dead - he can not do anything for us now.
              Are you saying that studying history is no better than mere fun?
              The greater number of laws . . . , the more thieves . . . there will be. ---- Lao-Tzu

              [T]he truth I’m after and the truth never harmed anyone. What harms us is to persist in self-deceit and ignorance -— Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

              Comment


              • #8
                So truthseeker, I guess that means you were Augustine on the previous tweb?

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Truthseeker View Post
                  A world that is better educated about what happened. The more education, the greater ability to make good decisions. At least, tend to make good decisions. Also, good practice in reasoning and in evaluating arguments. Did not the Founding Fathers rely on their knowledge of history, including Roman, to create the U.S. Constitution?
                  Are you saying that studying history is no better than mere fun?
                  Of the history you should be studying, the history of political gamesmanship, intrigue, conspiracy, scandal, and double-dealing is the least helpful for putting together a general theory of the good, and like a great deal of university studies, sucks up endless reservoirs of mental energy you could be using for admiring and praising those few individuals who really deserve it, either in history or at the present time.

                  Democratic politics is a high-stakes game, and high-stakes games get real ugly, real fast. Anyone who successfully plays these games for an extended period of time usually isn't the one you want to follow.

                  If the political equivalent of the Game of Thrones is taking up more mental space in your head than worthier meditations such as the Lord of the Rings, you are not seeing things in their best or most charitable light, even if they are more realistic according to today's morality. Here's a link to get you started, with an appropriate Lord of the Rings metaphor to whet your appetite:

                  Organized scholarship in the United States died in 1933, when the Brains Trust was established and the academy put on the Ring, accepting a responsibility for the direction of government which it has never relinquished and never will. Power is a jealous master; like heroin, it demands a complete commitment.
                  If the Academy was already observably directing government by the era of McCarthy, Kennedy, and Johnson, than what, truly, were they fighting over but the rights to be figurehead to an increasingly sham democracy? You want to praise someone for getting us to the moon, praise the common scientists who are as far as possible from science fetishists, and consider following their example:

                  Originally posted by Tom Wolfe
                  The engineers who fulfilled one of man’s most ancient dreams, that of traveling to the moon, came from the same background, the small towns of the Midwest and the West. After the triumph of Apollo 11, when Neil Armstrong and Buzz Aldrin became the first mortals to walk on the moon, NASA’s administrator, Tom Paine, happened to remark in conversation: “This was the triumph of the squares. ” A reporter overheard him; and did the press ever have a time with that! But Paine had come up with a penetrating insight. As it says in the Book of Matthew, the last shall be first. It was engineers from the supposedly backward and narrow-minded boondocks who had provided not only the genius but also the passion and the daring that won the space race and carried out John F. Kennedy’s exhortation, back in 1961. to put a man on the moon “before this decade is out.” The passion and the daring of these engineers was as remarkable as their talent. Time after time they had to shake off the meddling hands of timid souls from back east. The contribution of MIT to Project Mercury was minus one. The minus one was Jerome Wiesner of the MIT electronic research lab who was brought in by Kennedy as a special adviser to straighten out the space program when it seemed to be faltering early in 1961. Wiesner kept flinching when he saw what NASA’s boondockers were preparing to do. He tried to persuade to forfeit the manned space race to the Soviets and concentrate instead on unmanned scientific missions. The boondockers of Project Mercury, starting with the project’s director, Bob Gilruth, an aeronautical engineer from Nashwauk, Minnesota, dodged Wiesner for months, like moonshiners evading a roadblock, until they got astronaut Alan Shepard launched on the first Mercury mission. Who had time to waste on players as behind the times as Jerome Wiesner and the Massachusetts Institute of Technology…out here on technology’s leading edge?

                  Just why was it that small-town boys from the Middle West dominated the engineering frontiers? Noyce concluded it was because in a small town you became a technician, a tinker, an engineer, and an and inventor, by necessity.
                  History is difficult, but it isn't unrewarding if you know where to look and who to talk to.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Truthseeker View Post
                    Did you mean you think rogue is one of those smart people?
                    He ain't smart -- he's my brother.
                    "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Sparko View Post
                      So truthseeker, I guess that means you were Augustine on the previous tweb?
                      Amen.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Didn't Sparko or Rogue or both embarrass Augustine2004 for "derailing" a thread? Ol' A got into an argument, if I recall correctly, and the S-R Team leaped into action! It started a new thread and moved the argument posts there.

                        And now we find S, R, and others threatening to derail this thread. Alas, what is available to start a new thread and move the offending (off-topic for one thing) posts there? :Sparko in superman outfit: :Rogue in superman outfit aligned to appear to be on a collision course with Sparko:
                        The greater number of laws . . . , the more thieves . . . there will be. ---- Lao-Tzu

                        [T]he truth I’m after and the truth never harmed anyone. What harms us is to persist in self-deceit and ignorance -— Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Well, auggie, I just made one short comment - hardly derailing a thread. It must really bother you that people know you were auggie since you keep going on about it.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            "Regarding possible conspiracies, to this day I have serious doubts that Lee Harvey Oswald acted alone. I certainly have doubts that he was motivated to do that by himself. I’m not sure if anybody else was involved. I don’t go down that road, with respect to the grassy knoll theory and all of that, but I have serious questions about whether they got to the bottom of Lee Harvey Oswald. I think he was inspired somewhere by something, but I can’t pin anything down on that. I’ve never spent a lot of time on it. But I think, after a certain period of time, and that period of time may well have passed, it is totally appropriate for a country like the United States to open up the files on whatever history can be shed light on. I think that is appropriate. It has to be done in the right way, by the right entities or people, but certainly by a valid historian or for some valid analysis; I think that everybody would benefit"
                            -- Our Secretary of State John Kerry.
                            "I was the CIA director. We lied, we cheated, we stole, it was like... we had entire training courses. It reminds you of the glory of the American experiment." - Mike Pompeo, Secretary of State (source).

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Epoetker View Post
                              President John F. Kennedy was killed by Lee Harvey Oswald, a known Communist sympathizer.
                              I saw a documentary over Xmas which laid out the theory that JFK was actually killed by one of his own bodyguards, who accidentally shot JFK in the back of his head during the panic caused by LHO's attack. They covered a lot of evidence - circumstantial, eye-witness and forensic, explained a lot of factors which were problematic for other theories, and didn't leave any gaping logical or evidential holes.

                              Roy
                              Jorge: Functional Complex Information is INFORMATION that is complex and functional.

                              mikewhitney: What if the speed of light changed when light is passing through water? ... I have 3 semesters of college Physics.

                              Mountain Man: First of all, the Bible is a fixed document.
                              Mountain Man: … this is how liberals argue these days, with labels instead of ideas.

                              Comment

                              Related Threads

                              Collapse

                              Topics Statistics Last Post
                              Started by Esther, Yesterday, 12:09 PM
                              30 responses
                              170 views
                              2 likes
                              Last Post rogue06
                              by rogue06
                               
                              Started by Gondwanaland, 11-25-2020, 01:42 PM
                              50 responses
                              264 views
                              0 likes
                              Last Post Andius
                              by Andius
                               
                              Started by Ronson, 11-25-2020, 11:16 AM
                              11 responses
                              92 views
                              0 likes
                              Last Post rogue06
                              by rogue06
                               
                              Started by Juvenal, 11-25-2020, 04:13 AM
                              14 responses
                              70 views
                              0 likes
                              Last Post Terraceth  
                              Started by shunyadragon, 11-24-2020, 06:20 PM
                              22 responses
                              140 views
                              0 likes
                              Last Post rogue06
                              by rogue06
                               
                              Working...
                              X