American Theocracy and Decline

[John Reece]

Wishful thinking based on half-remembered and probably fabricated quotes. Rush Limbaugh invokes "Talent On Loan From God" more than the Founding Fathers invoked Divine Providence.

I have listened to Rush Limbaugh during lunch ― as well as before and after lunch ― nearly every day throughout the past two decades during which I have been retired; so, I was curious to learn from Norm how he ascertained something so significant about Rush that I had totally missed all these years.

[Cow Poke]

Hi FirstFloor...

I think you are misinformed about the state of religion in America.

"Misinformed"? He's a raging lunatic! But maybe he'll listen to a fellow antagonist. And you appear to be a bit misinformed, yourself, Norm.

[lilpixieofterror]

Hi FirstFloor,

I actually recall when this speech was broadcast. At the time, I was working for a Christian radio station. It was seen at that time as an "alarm" - a call to action against the rising tide of atheism.

Flash forward to the 1980s. The Moral Majority, founded by televangelist, Jerry Falwell managed to capture the minds and hearts of millions of evangelical Christians and make them politically active. They consider themselves responsible for the election of Ronald Reagan (who was probably in secret an agnostic at best) who ushered in the "Golden Age" of the Christian moment. It was the era of the PTL (Praise The Lord) Club with Jim and Tammy Baker, the birth of the mega-church and non-denominational, "seeker-friendly" congregations.

By the end of the decade, Jim Baker was in jail and Tammy-Fae was weeping on network television with Baker's whore yakking it up on the Howard Stern show.

Rush Limbaugh supplanted the Moral Majority with a decidedly secularized version of evangelicalism, despite being an admitted agnostic (probably really an atheist). Now, Christianity has taken on a veneer of Americana, and if one attends a Tea Party rally, it is virtually impossible to tell where the Christianity ends and the worship of patriotism begins.

Reality check: none of these movements comes anywhere close to being "popular" movements in America. At most, the Moral Majority captured the imagination of a mere 1% or less in the general population. The election of Reagan, who openly courted the "religious right" was more of an aberration than a real impetus toward a "growing Christian nation - let alone a theocracy.

Fox News may be the overwhelming choice of cable viewers in America (currently Fox News is in decline for the first time this year), but cable viewership still is measured in the single millions (1.9 - 2.0), while Network television is double digits (21 million viewers on average). It is still a true statement to say that the vast majority of Americans get their news from Network television rather than Fox News.

If popular media is any indication of the philosophical bent of America, it should be noted that one of the most popular shows on television (Network, btw) is one that openly mocks Christianity and religion in general (Big Bang Theory). NOVA, a rejuvenated program from the 70s - 80s is enjoying a resurgence despite (because of?) it's decidedly non-theistic orientation.

Gay marriage, despite extremely vigilant efforts to thwart it by every Christian organization in America is gaining acceptance exponentially with every election season. Not even Seer and his minions will stop each state in America from allowing homosexuals the same rights as every other US citizen. Hardly the theocratic apocalypse you are imagining.

I think you are misinformed about the state of religion in America.

Have faith, FF - we are well on our way to joining you in freedom from theistic religion!!!!

NORM

Yep because Norm will not rest until Christ is ripped right out of Christianity and Christianity is no longer the historical faith it once was.

[Cow Poke]

Yep because Norm will not rest until Christ is ripped right out of Christianity and Christianity is no longer the historical faith it once was.

He better not go to Cuba, then... I just visited with one of our Missionaries to Cuba, and Christianity is growing like CRAZY there.

[rogue06]

He better not go to Cuba, then... I just visited with one of our Missionaries to Cuba, and Christianity is growing like CRAZY there.

Sort of like China. And South Korea. And in much of Africa.

[KingsGambit]

A brief Google search reveals no evidence of Limbaugh claiming to be atheist/agnostic (and I have no doubt that if he ever did make such a claim publicly, it would be prominently trumpeted). I have no idea what he actually does personally believe, but

[lilpixieofterror]

He better not go to Cuba, then... I just visited with one of our Missionaries to Cuba, and Christianity is growing like CRAZY there.

That's because God actually works, unlike the wishy washy one Norm wants. Which just is about making people feel good without that icky sin stuff.

[KingsGambit]

I just realized; Norm may be thinking of Bill O'Reilly, who does have a history of being wishy-washy on religion.

[NormATive]

I am only curious, Norm: can you document Limbaugh admitting to be an agnostic ― with the object of said agnosticism being the existence of God?

And on what do you base your assessment that he is "probably really an atheist"?

As I said, 'just curious...

When he was first on the radio, I listened to his program every day while traveling in my car. He said he was an agnostic in one of his programs. He said he appreciates people of faith, but it just didn't "stick" with him - or some such.

I never hear him speak of God or faith on his program. At all. Ever. Not from a religious person's point of view. Only as a conservative vs liberal point of view.

If you can find word one of him professing any kind of personal faith, then I'm wrong. I don't think you will find any.

NORM

[NormATive]

I have listened to Rush Limbaugh during lunch ― as well as before and after lunch ― nearly every day throughout the past two decades during which I have been retired; so, I was curious to learn from Norm how he ascertained something so significant about Rush that I had totally missed all these years.

Have you ever heard him even once profess ANY kind of faith? Ever? "Talent on loan from God" doesn't count, as it is just a slogan Snerdly came up with in the early days - that's even kind of mocking God.

NORM

[KingsGambit]

Either way, Limbaugh's personal behavior/attitude does not suggest the fruits of what the Christian life should look like. Yes, I know, people are at different levels of sanctification.

[Cow Poke]

When he was first on the radio, I listened to his program every day while traveling in my car. He said he was an agnostic in one of his programs.
NORM

Are you sure he wasn't using "agnostic" as in "not really having an opinion one way or another" on certain issues? I've heard him refer to himself as being agnostic in that manner, but I've never heard him say it regarding God.

On the other hand, other than being a Methodist, I really can't find a citation where he claims to be a believer.

I used to listen to him all the time, but not in the last 6 or 7 years. It just got old.

[NormATive]

Either way, Limbaugh's personal behavior/attitude does not suggest the fruits of what the Christian life should look like. Yes, I know, people are at different levels of sanctification.

Why, then, do Christians hang on his every word? I never quite understood this - even when I listened daily to his show. I knew the difference between the politics and my faith. Actually, Limbaugh kind of supplanted my faith for a time after I quit Christianity - until I converted to Judaism, in a way. I was a volunteer for the Alan Keyes campaign, as I am strongly opposed to abortion.

NORM

[KingsGambit]

Why, then, do Christians hang on his every word? I never quite understood this - even when I listened daily to his show. I knew the difference between the politics and my faith. Actually, Limbaugh kind of supplanted my faith for a time after I quit Christianity - until I converted to Judaism, in a way. I was a volunteer for the Alan Keyes campaign, as I am strongly opposed to abortion.

NORM

I don't personally know anybody who listens to him

[Darth Executor]

Why, then, do Christians hang on his every word? I never quite understood this - even when I listened daily to his show. I knew the difference between the politics and my faith. Actually, Limbaugh kind of supplanted my faith for a time after I quit Christianity - until I converted to Judaism, in a way. I was a volunteer for the Alan Keyes campaign, as I am strongly opposed to abortion.

NORM

Conservative agnostics > liberal Christians.