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Trump: The economy does better under democrats

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  • Trump: The economy does better under democrats

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fn3cTT6O1I4

    Interesting to have his own words on record, and he even backs it up with his performance.

    Do we take him literally but not seriously or seriously but not literally?

  • #2
    And how old is that sound bite? And what's the context?
    Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
    But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
    Than a fool in the eyes of God


    From "Fools Gold" by Petra

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
      And how old is that sound bite? And what's the context?
      What difference does it make how old it is? The ad contains the job grown numbers under multiple Democratic and Republican administrations (including his own) and bears out Trump's words.

      For the record Trump's words aren't being taken out of context if you watch a more extended clip from that interview. It's not hard to find.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by LiconaFan97 View Post
        What difference does it make how old it is?
        Quite a lot. Context is important, too.
        Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
        But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
        Than a fool in the eyes of God


        From "Fools Gold" by Petra

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
          Quite a lot. Context is important, too.
          Feel free to provide the missing context. If all Republican presidents since this clip aired have done worse on jobs than both their democratic successors and predecessors then how is his statement less true today than when he said it? If anything it's more true today than when he said it.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by LiconaFan97 View Post
            If all Republican presidents since this clip aired have done worse on jobs than both their democratic successors...
            What does "jobs created" even mean? Another way to ask the question is: What is better for the economy, 1000 low-paying part-time jobs, or 500 high-paying full-time jobs? Simply counting "jobs created" is a meaningless measure of economic success.
            Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
            But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
            Than a fool in the eyes of God


            From "Fools Gold" by Petra

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by LiconaFan97 View Post
              Feel free to provide the missing context. If all Republican presidents since this clip aired have done worse on jobs than both their democratic successors and predecessors then how is his statement less true today than when he said it? If anything it's more true today than when he said it.
              What? You started the topic. I would think you would provide the context if you wanted to be taken seriously....
              Watch your links! http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/fa...corumetiquette

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by DesertBerean View Post
                What? You started the topic. I would think you would provide the context if you wanted to be taken seriously....
                Context is relevant only when and if it changes what the quote (or excerpt) appears to say. If I quote someone as saying "The Yankees will win the World Series this year" then I only need to show the context if just showing the quote is misleading. So if the quote was an excerpt from a press conference by the GM saying what a great job the Yankees will do, I don't need to provide the context - the quote stands on its own. But if the quote is actually an excerpt from some journalist trashing the Yankees and the full statement was "That the Yankees will win the World Series this year is about as likely as me being elected President", then I do need to show the context. And if I just supplied the quote (without showing the context) and claimed it shows that that journo thinks the Yankees will go well, then I was being dishonest.

                So if the context of Trump's comment doesn't show that what the quote appears to say is not what Trump actually intended, then he doesn't need to show the context. Anybody who claims that Trump did not mean what the quote appears to say needs to show the context and how it indicates that Trump didn't mean what it appears he said.
                America - too good to let the conservatives drag it back to 1950.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
                  What does "jobs created" even mean? Another way to ask the question is: What is better for the economy, 1000 low-paying part-time jobs, or 500 high-paying full-time jobs? Simply counting "jobs created" is a meaningless measure of economic success.
                  Perhaps. But it doesn't seem like we need to go there when the metric is "jobs created" vs "jobs lost."

                  If you have data which supports the idea that Republicans create fewer but higher quality jobs than Democrats feel free to present it.
                  Last edited by LiconaFan97; 09-13-2020, 06:55 PM.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by DesertBerean View Post
                    What? You started the topic. I would think you would provide the context if you wanted to be taken seriously....
                    Feel free to search out the interview for yourself. It's not hard to find. It's clear from the interview that Wolf Blitzer took Trump's response in exactly the way the quote literally reads.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Electric Skeptic View Post
                      Context is relevant only when and if it changes what the quote (or excerpt) appears to say. If I quote someone as saying "The Yankees will win the World Series this year" then I only need to show the context if just showing the quote is misleading. So if the quote was an excerpt from a press conference by the GM saying what a great job the Yankees will do, I don't need to provide the context - the quote stands on its own. But if the quote is actually an excerpt from some journalist trashing the Yankees and the full statement was "That the Yankees will win the World Series this year is about as likely as me being elected President", then I do need to show the context. And if I just supplied the quote (without showing the context) and claimed it shows that that journo thinks the Yankees will go well, then I was being dishonest.

                      So if the context of Trump's comment doesn't show that what the quote appears to say is not what Trump actually intended, then he doesn't need to show the context. Anybody who claims that Trump did not mean what the quote appears to say needs to show the context and how it indicates that Trump didn't mean what it appears he said.
                      Originally posted by LiconaFan97 View Post
                      Feel free to search out the interview for yourself. It's not hard to find. It's clear from the interview that Wolf Blitzer took Trump's response in exactly the way the quote literally reads.
                      In other words, you want us to dig it all out. Sorry. I've a very low opinion on sound bites. So I'll pass.
                      Watch your links! http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/fa...corumetiquette

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by DesertBerean View Post
                        In other words, you want us to dig it all out. Sorry. I've a very low opinion on sound bites. So I'll pass.
                        You and Mountain Man are the ones insisting that Trump's words don't speak for themselves. The burden of proof is on you. And the truth of his claim is supported by the data in the very video I linked. But since I'm curious to see how far down the rabbit hole goes here is a longer clip from the interview where you can see Trump's words are not being misrepresented.

                        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rRndMiVIB-w

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by LiconaFan97 View Post
                          You and Mountain Man are the ones insisting that Trump's words don't speak for themselves. The burden of proof is on you. And the truth of his claim is supported by the data in the very video I linked. But since I'm curious to see how far down the rabbit hole goes here is a longer clip from the interview where you can see Trump's words are not being misrepresented.

                          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rRndMiVIB-w
                          I think it's more of a condemnation of the Dems than you think it is. Most leftists would agree that Trump is your typical wealthy elitist (wallstreet/real estate/celebrity mogul), so naturally if that's the group the Dems cater to when it comes to economics, then he'd naturally assume this. It's not like Trump was a blue collar grinder all his life.
                          "I was the CIA director. We lied, we cheated, we stole, it was like... we had entire training courses. It reminds you of the glory of the American experiment." - Mike Pompeo, Secretary of State (source).

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by seanD View Post
                            I think it's more of a condemnation of the Dems than you think it is. Most leftists would agree that Trump is your typical wealthy elitist (wallstreet/real estate/celebrity mogul), so naturally if that's the group the Dems cater to when it comes to economics, then he'd naturally assume this. It's not like Trump was a blue collar grinder all his life.
                            How is it a condemnation of Democrats to point out that they do a better job on the economy than Republicans do? I'm totally lost.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by LiconaFan97 View Post
                              How is it a condemnation of Democrats to point out that they do a better job on the economy than Republicans do? I'm totally lost.
                              Trump wasn't any sort of economic analyst, he got his economic info from like-minded groups he hung around. Like I said, he was a wealthy celebrity mogul that flew around on private jets and attended private parties with other wealthy moguls, so naturally he's going to hear about how great things are doing from this class, as opposed to hearing about how the economy is doing from the under classes (in case you didn't notice there is a wealth gap that has been ongoing for at least two decades). So if he perceived that this class (the white collar wallstreet class) was doing great, then he would have assumed that represented the economy at large. So you could infer from that that the upper classes do great under Dems because that's who they cater to when it comes to economic policy.
                              "I was the CIA director. We lied, we cheated, we stole, it was like... we had entire training courses. It reminds you of the glory of the American experiment." - Mike Pompeo, Secretary of State (source).

                              Comment

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