American Christianity’s White-Supremacy Problem

[Ronson]

My people didn't get here until the late 1800s, and only lived in the North.

Same here, on my paternal side. My mother's side was here earlier but they were relatively poor farmers in non slave states.

Very few Americans living today are descended from slave owners.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/the-dan...ry-11556837452

Tens of millions of today’s nonblack Americans are descended from people who arrived in the country after slavery ended and therefore cannot be held responsible for its crimes or its legacy.

More tens of millions are descended from people, in both North and South, who did not own slaves; or they are descended from white people who fought in the Civil War on the Union side, who thus paid “reparations” at the time—in blood.In fact, only a small percentage of the total American population were slave owners. Further, some blacks, and some Native Americans, owned slaves.

[Ronson]

https://www.prri.org/staff/robert-p-jones-ph-d/

Jones writes regularly on politics, culture, and religion for The Atlantic online, NBC Think, and other outlets. He is frequently featured in major national media, such as CNN, MSNBC, NPR, The New York Times, The Washington Post, and others.

That explains a lot.

[seanD]

If by "catholicism" you mean the Western Catholic church then I must disagree. Western anti-Judaism [later anti-Semitism] has its roots in various NT texts as well as the ante and post Nicene ECFs.

No it doesn't. At least the gospel of John and Matthew were written by Jews.

[Hypatia_Alexandria]

No it doesn't. At least the gospel of John and Matthew were written by Jews.

We do not know who the authors of any of the four canonical gospels were. All the texts were originally anonymous with the appellations of the Evangelists names being added much later. I recommend you read John's gospel it is rabidly anti-Judaic.

[Hypatia_Alexandria]

I was focused more on race. Though he didn't like Gypsies either.

The extermination of the Roma, Jews, and Slavs came later. The Nazis started out by eliminating their political opponents in camps like Dachau by beating, starving, torturing, working, or just shooting, and "euthanasia" was first used on the disabled.

My people didn't get here until the late 1800s, and only lived in the North.

So? That would not prevent them exploiting a few poor immigrants or black Americans who needed work.

So answer the question - how many party members in your family tree. Own up sister...

I am constantly amazed by ignorant Americans who think every German living in Germany through that period was an ardent supporter of Hitler and a member of the Nazi Party.

[Hypatia_Alexandria]

https://www.prri.org/staff/robert-p-jones-ph-d/

Jones writes regularly on politics, culture, and religion for The Atlantic online, NBC Think, and other outlets. He is frequently featured in major national media, such as CNN, MSNBC, NPR, The New York Times, The Washington Post, and others.

That explains a lot.

Is that a hint of prejudice I detect there Ronson?

[seanD]

We do not know who the authors of any of the four canonical gospels were. All the texts were originally anonymous with the appellations of the Evangelists names being added much later. I recommend you read John's gospel it is rabidly anti-Judaic.

I just know I'm probably going to regret this being how much of an ignorant novice you are on the subject.

We don't know explicitly who wrote the gospels (though that's a subject of much debate), but we know based on the content that the two authors were Jewish. The gospel of John and Matthew closely resemble Judaic prose of that day, especially the the content found in the Qumran scrolls. What makes you think John is "rabidly anti-Judaic?"

[siam]

I hereby denounce white supremacy without hesitancy and equivocation.

Next?

What of American exceptionalism?...and other articulations of supremacy such as anti-immigrant Nationalism, Christian supremacy, class/social privilege....etc?

Apparently Christianity as a concept called Imago Dei which is used to construct concepts of human equality---how would a Christian use this to create an ethical principle that can address all forms of supremacy?

“………Original sin (the whole of humanity---with the exception of Christians---were held responsible for Adams sin………”

No. This is incorrect.

it may be....
---the Catholic Church made a document called the Nostra Aetate around the 1960---the result was the affirmation of non-Christian worship of God....(including the special status of the Jews)
Catechism of the Catholic Church
841 The Church's relationship with the Muslims. "The plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator, in the first place amongst whom are the Muslims; these profess to hold the faith of Abraham, and together with us they adore the one, merciful God, mankind's judge on the last day."

842 The Church's bond with non-Christian religions is in the first place the common origin and end of the human race:
All nations form but one community. This is so because all stem from the one stock which God created to people the entire earth, and also because all share a common destiny, namely God. His providence, evident goodness, and saving designs extend to all against the day when the elect are gathered together in the holy city.


Nevertheless CCC 845 re-affirms that "there is no salvation outside the church"
though a caveat is added in ...ccc 847 This affirmation is not aimed at those who, through no fault of their own, do not know Christ and his Church:
https://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_c...m/p123a9p3.htm

Would Non-Catholic Christians agree with these sentiments?...and if so---how would such ideas help alleviate or temper general human inclinations towards supremacy?

[seer]

The extermination of the Roma, Jews, and Slavs came later. The Nazis started out by eliminating their political opponents in camps like Dachau by beating, starving, torturing, working, or just shooting, and "euthanasia" was first used on the disabled.

Yes all done by your relatives.

So? That would not prevent them exploiting a few poor immigrants or black Americans who needed work.

My grandfathers were laborers, one a stone mason. They worked like dogs and exploited no one, they certainly did not hang anyone. Unlike your past relatives.

I am constantly amazed by ignorant Americans who think every German living in Germany through that period was an ardent supporter of Hitler and a member of the Nazi Party.

And how many Germans gave tacit approval. So why do you attack America when you have so many sins in your past?

[Hypatia_Alexandria]

Yes all done by your relatives.

Really? And what evidence do you have that permits you to make that allegation? I expect you also believe that all Jewish Germans who voted in 1932 and 1933 were ardent Nazis as well.

My grandfathers were laborers, one a stone mason. They worked like dogs and exploited no one, they certainly did not hang anyone.

How do you know what their past experiences might have been? You simply assume that your forebears were the "good guys" and my forebears were the "bad guys".

Unlike your past relatives.

By the way, have you asked Sparko what his family members did during the war? He is part German and relatives live here still. Have you formed the same opinion about his relatives [both alive and dead]?

And how many Germans gave tacit approval.

You would do well to read some of the documented accounts of German resistance individuals and groups.

So why do you attack America when you have so many sins in your past?

Oh is that what this is? An attack on America?

Citing an article [written by an American in an American magazine] that deals with a book [written by an American academic] that shines a light on to the murky history of white Christian America and the prevailing prejudices still often found among large sections of white Christian Americans, is perceived by you to be an attack?

[seer]

Really? And what evidence do you have that permits you to make that allegation? I expect you also believe that all Jewish Germans who voted in 1932 and 1933 were ardent Nazis as well.

So you are a Jewish German?

How do you know what their past experiences might have been? You simply assume that your forebears were the "good guys" and my forebears were the "bad guys".

Well you guys did burn the bodies of babies in ovens, so...

By the way, have you asked Sparko what his family members did during the war? He is part German and relatives live here still. Have you formed the same opinion about his antecedents?

Perhaps all this is going over your head?

You would do well to read some of the documented accounts of German resistance individuals and groups.

Which were few and far in between, I do remember a story about a particular brave young lady. And you do know how strong the Abolition movement was in the US, populated mostly by Christians. John Brown himself was Baptized in my Church.

Oh is that what this is? An attack on America?

Citing an article [written by an American in an American magazine] that deals with a book [written by an American academic] that shines a light on to the murky history of white Christian America and the prevailing prejudices still often found among large sections of white Christian Americans, is perceived by you to be an attack?

Of course it is an attack - why not tells us about all the sins of your country? We will be waiting. And that is what is going over your head - every nation on earth has skeletons in their closets. Including yours in, a big way. And I'm not responsible for what others did in the past, just as you are not responsible for what your ancestors did.

[Ronson]

Is that a hint of prejudice I detect there Ronson?

When it quacks like a duck ....

[shunyadragon]

When it quacks like a duck ....

You make a very fine duck!

[shunyadragon]

The link I posted mentions the two previous resolutions:

"In 1995, the Convention formally apologized for its support of slavery. In 2015, it passed a resolution calling for racial reconciliation. Last week's resolution denouncing white nationalism passed overwhelmingly."

Superficial, and very very late. Apologies today do not address the reality the extreme racist America throughout history and today

[oxmixmudd]

So you are a Jewish German?



Well you guys did burn the bodies of babies in ovens, so...




Perhaps all this is going over your head?




Which were few and far in between, I do remember a story about a particular brave young lady. And you do know how strong the Abolition movement was in the US, populated mostly by Christians. John Brown himself was Baptized in my Church.



Of course it is an attack - why not tells us about all the sins of your country? We will be waiting. And that is what is going over your head - every nation on earth has skeletons in their closets. Including yours in, a big way. And I'm not responsible for what others did in the past, just as you are not responsible for what your ancestors did.

We are responsible for the legacy of what was done, the impact of it. Would you, if you learned that your grandfather had stolen the entire savings of a family, throwing them into poverty that continues to today, just sit back and do nothing to help them? If you learned that half your inheritance from your own father was in fact the product of their family's money, would you keep it for yourself and tell them, "sorry, im not responsible for the fact my grandfather stole your wealth, and that my father kept it and gave a good bit of it to me. What my family did, your loss at their doing, doesn't obligate me in the slightest to make it right. I've done nothing to you."