Coronavirus Outbreak...

[oxmixmudd]

Yep... they're acting like the US will suddenly be unable to manage without a "task force" at the top of the political food chain. It's a stupid criticism.

When the virus resurges ... and it most likely will ... there will need to be an organization whose sole purpose - once again - is to coordinate resources and control distribution of those resources. It takes time to create such an organization. Disbanding it and then trying to reconstitute it will introduce yet another delayed response with yet more deaths as a consequence.

Further, we need to be mounting a coordinated effort that will prevent a recurrence of the disastrous first response, we need to be stockpiling PPE and testing reagents, we need to be creating software to track and manage distribution of supplies, we need contact tracing infra-structure and wide spread testing access - in short, we need to be ready when it returns (especially since it has not even yet left us)

Keep in mind that by June 1, at the current rate of decay (assuming we remain in decay), we will still be seeing over 1000 deaths per day and over 10,000 new cases per day.

[seer]

I'm sure the people who shot the security guard were some of those violent liberals we've been hearing about...

Left-wing violence in the Trump era

Leftwing violence has increased 250% since the final days of the Obama administration.

https://www.conservapedia.com/Left-w..._the_Trump_era

[Mountain Man]

To point out the obvious - shooting the guard was also a 'protest' against being required to wear a mask. Just a much more aggressive one.

It's an absurd stretch to try and draw a parallel between an isolated case of premeditated murder, and an unrelated group of citizens exercising their right to peaceably assemble in protest of their government.

[Mountain Man]

When the virus resurges ... and it most likely will ... there will need to be an organization whose sole purpose - once again - is to coordinate resources and control distribution of those resources. It takes time to create such an organization.

What do you think the task force has been doing all this time? You're acting like if they disbanded that all the agencies that they have been working with to create a coordinated response will suddenly cease to function. All you're doing is grasping at nonexistent straws in your desperate attempt to find fault with the Trump administration no matter what it does. I mean, look, you've been reduced to attacking Mike Pence who by all accounts is one of the most honorable people in all of Washington!

[oxmixmudd]

It's an absurd stretch to try and draw a parallel between an isolated case of premeditated murder, and an unrelated group of citizens exercising their right to peaceably assemble in protest of their government.

No - it isn't. The push back against wearing masks being escalated by people carrying guns onto a state capitol in protest sends the message this is a cause worthy of resisting with deadly force. And that is a message those two men heard loud and clear.

[oxmixmudd]

What do you think the task force has been doing all this time? You're acting like if they disbanded that all the agencies that they have been working with to create a coordinated response will suddenly cease to function. All you're doing is grasping at nonexistent straws in your desperate attempt to find fault with the Trump administration no matter what it does. I mean, look, you've been reduced to attacking Mike Pence who by all accounts is one of the most honorable people in all of Washington!

Trump has reversed course. I guess my argument wasn't as stupid as you thought after all ....

https://www.cnn.com/2020/05/06/polit...ine/index.html

[Mountain Man]

Trump has reversed course. I guess my argument wasn't as stupid as you thought after all ....

https://www.cnn.com/2020/05/06/polit...ine/index.html

This isn't a reversal at all because nobody ever said it was definitely being disbanded. Mike Pence merely stated a possibility and nothing more. Why is that so hard for you to admit?

I also notice that the original CNN story says:

"Members of the task force will continue providing input, though the group will not be meeting as regularly as the focus changes toward vaccines, therapeutics, testing, and ultimately reopening the economy," the second senior administration official said. "Keep in mind the task force was always a temporary arrangement. Health experts will continue providing input even while not meeting together every day."

https://www.cnn.com/2020/05/05/polit...own/index.html

So this implication that you and other liberals here have constructed that the plan was to leave a vacuum in the space occupied by the task force is false.

[seanD]

I'm sure the people who shot the security guard were some of those violent liberals we've been hearing about...

The suspects are black, and the incident happened in a bad area in Flint (ghetto). What do you think the odds are that they were Trump supporting Republicans? Or could it be that folks are just getting fed up with the authoritarianism in general, regardless of race, ideology, and political affiliation?

[Mountain Man]

No - it isn't. The push back against wearing masks being escalated by people carrying guns onto a state capitol in protest sends the message this is a cause worthy of resisting with deadly force. And that is a message those two men heard loud and clear.

Right, it's the fault of peaceful protestors that two unrelated nutjobs murdered a security guard in cold blood.

[carpedm9587]

The suspects are black, and the incident happened in a bad area in Flint (ghetto). What do you think the odds are that they were Trump supporting Republicans? Or could it be that folks are just getting fed up with the authoritarianism in general, regardless of race, ideology, and political affiliation?

I'm not sure why being black is something of importance here? Your second sentence makes it sound like you thought I was implying they were Republicans? I'm not sure where you got that, if that is your implication. My comment was an ironic reflection on the oft-repeated meme around here that liberals are violent, especially in light of the evidence that shows that it is not liberals committing the bulk of the violent acts..

And while some people are protesting the lock-down orders, the vast majority of Americans actually want them, and are frustrated that their health and safety is being threatened by a vocal minority that believes their "freedom" trumps everything.

Demanding rights with no consideration for responsibilities is not freedom - it is adolescence.

[seanD]

I'm not sure why being black is something of importance here? Your second sentence makes it sound like you thought I was implying they were Republicans? I'm not sure where you got that, if that is your implication. My comment was an ironic reflection on the oft-repeated meme around here that liberals are violent, especially in light of the evidence that shows that it is not liberals committing the bulk of the violent acts..

And while some people are protesting the lock-down orders, the vast majority of Americans actually want them, and are frustrated that their health and safety is being threatened by a vocal minority that believes their "freedom" trumps everything.

Demanding rights with no consideration for responsibilities is not freedom - it is adolescence.

No, both you and Ox clearly implied that the violent act was somehow related to those armed "white gun nuts" protesting at the capitol building. The two incidents had nothing whatsoever to do with each other, yet Ox referenced it in the same context . Then you underscored it with sarcasm -- I'm sure they "were some of those violent liberals we've been hearing about." And now that you've been called out on your bullcrap, you're backtracking. This just shows the kind of dishonest scumbags you and Ox are when it comes to these arguments.

[seer]

My comment was an ironic reflection on the oft-repeated meme around here that liberals are violent, especially in light of the evidence that shows that it is not liberals committing the bulk of the violent acts..

Where do you get that?

https://www.conservapedia.com/Left-w..._the_Trump_era

[oxmixmudd]

Right, it's the fault of peaceful protestors that two unrelated nutjobs murdered a security guard in cold blood.

I disagree. first, carrying guns in a protest that is not focused on the 2nd amendment itself is itself threatening - not peaceful. Your unwillingness to acknowledge that obvious reality is purely political. Second, doing that (carrying guns in a protest against masks) sends the message this is an issue worthy of resisting with deadly force.

What actually motivated them, if they'd have done that regardless of such protests, is impossible to know. So I'm going to leave it at we disagree.

[oxmixmudd]

No, both you and Ox clearly implied that the violent act was somehow related to those armed "white gun nuts" protesting at the capitol building. The two incidents had nothing whatsoever to do with each other, yet Ox referenced it in the same context . Then you underscored it with sarcasm -- I'm sure they "were some of those violent liberals we've been hearing about." And now that you've been called out on your bullcrap, you're backtracking. This just shows the kind of dishonest scumbags you and Ox are when it comes to these arguments.

Incitement to violence happens on all sides - and it is wrong regardless of where it happens. Carrying guns to a protest about shelter in place etc is sending a signal that violence is expected or needed. It doesn't matter which side of the political Isle is carrying the guns in the protest. Outside a 2nd amendment protest, it is a threatening move. Period.

[seanD]

Incitement to violence happens on all sides - and it is wrong regardless of where it happens. Carrying guns to a protest about shelter in place etc is sending a signal that violence is expected or needed. It doesn't matter which side of the political Isle is carrying the guns in the protest.

Conservatives exercising their 2A rights is not an "incitement to violence." You interpret it that way because you're obviously anti-2A. Guess what happened in Virginia when hundreds of gun toting 2A advocates descended on the capital building? Nothing. The group that shot the guard in a Flint ghetto not only were not conservatives, most likely, but reacted in an entirely different manner than pro-2A conservatives react. The two incidents have nothing whatsoever to do with each other, and you know it.