Second Amendment Sanctuary

[Mountain Man]

You know that isn't true.

Technically, Jimmy is correct that nobody is currently trying to ban guns, but Democrats have openly expressed their desire to, and there's no doubt that if they ever acquire enough power, they will do it.

[Charles]

I thought that was the point you were making? You said,


comparing how banning cars could cost more lives to how banning guns could cost more lives. If that isn't what you meant then you need to be clearer in your statements.

If nobody could legally own a gun, then only criminals would have guns and we would have no defense against them.

With regards to guns I only pointed to the fact that some people make the statement that "Like when some people claim that some of the mass shootings could have been prevented or stopped at an earlier point if more good people had guns." I do not know enought about that particular area to be able to argue for or against.

With regards to your statement: "If nobody could legally own a gun, then only criminals would have guns and we would have no defense against them." then that is a bit of a simplification, I think. First of all the police could be allowed to have guns and work as a defence (though it would take time for them to arrive). And it is also possible that the number of mass shootings would be lower if it was harder to get hold of a gun in the first place. Many unknowns.

[Teallaura]

One of the nice things about being a Christian is that we don't have to live in fear.

The biggest drawback being having to love annoying people.

[Teallaura]

You could arbitrarily choose any cause of death and say the exact same thing.

"How many innocent people dying from falling off ladders would it take before you cared enough to do something about ladders?"

They added warning labels...

[Sparko]

They added warning labels...

My handgun has about 6 pages of warnings..


State-By-State Warnings
Certain states require by law that their own specified warning
notices in larger-than-normal type be conspicuously included by
the manufacturer, distributor or retailer with firearms sold in that
state. Sturm, Ruger & Co., Inc. sells its products in compliance
with applicable laws and regulations. Because our products may
be sold in these states, we include the following:

California:
“Children are attracted to and
can operate firearms that can
cause severe injuries or death.
Prevent child access by always
keeping guns locked away and
unloaded when not in use. If you
keep a loaded firearm where a
child obtains and improperly uses
it, you may be fined or sent to
prison.”

Connecticut:
“UNLAWFUL STORAGE OF A LOADED FIREARM MAY
RESULT IN IMPRISONMENT OR FINE.”
Florida:
“IT IS UNLAWFUL, AND PUNISHABLE BY
IMPRISONMENT AND FINE, FOR ANY ADULT TO
STORE OR LEAVE A FIREARM IN ANY PLACE WITHIN
THE REACH OR EASY ACCESS OF A MINOR UNDER 18
YEARS OF AGE OR TO KNOWINGLY SELL OR
OTHERWISE TRANSFER OWNERSHIP OR POSSESSION
OF A FIREARM TO A MINOR OR A PERSON OF
UNSOUND MIND.”

Maine:
“ENDANGERING THE WELFARE OF A CHILD IS A
CRIME. IF YOU LEAVE A FIREARM AND AMMUNITION
WITHIN EASY ACCESS OF A CHILD, YOU MAY BE
SUBJECT TO FINE, IMPRISONMENT OR BOTH. KEEP
FIREARMS AND AMMUNITION SEPARATE. KEEP
FIREARMS AND AMMUNITION LOCKED UP. USE
TRIGGER LOCKS.”
Maryland:
“WARNING: Children can operate firearms which may cause
death or serious injury. It is a crime to store or leave a loaded
firearm in any location where an individual knew or should
have known that an unsupervised minor would gain access to
the firearm. Store your firearm responsibly!”
Massachusetts:
“WARNING FROM THE MASSACHUSETTS ATTORNEY
GENERAL: This handgun is not equipped with a device that
fully blocks use by unauthorized users. More than 200,000
firearms like this one are stolen from their owners every year
in the United States. In addition, there are more than a
thousand suicides each year by younger children and
teenagers who get access to firearms. Hundreds more die from
accidental discharge. It is likely that many more children
sustain serious wounds, or inflict such wounds accidentally on
others. In order to limit the chance of such misuse, it is
imperative that you keep this weapon locked in a secure place
and take other steps necessary to limit the possibility of theft
or accident. Failure to take reasonable preventive steps may
result in innocent lives being lost, and in some circumstances
may result in your liability for these deaths.”
“IT IS UNLAWFUL TO STORE OR KEEP A FIREARM,
RIFLE, SHOTGUN OR MACHINE GUN IN ANY PLACE
UNLESS THAT WEAPON IS EQUIPPED WITH A
TAMPER-RESISTANT SAFETY DEVICE OR IS STORED
OR KEPT IN A SECURELY LOCKED CONTAINER.”

New Jersey:
“IT IS A CRIMINAL OFFENSE TO LEAVE A LOADED
FIREARM WITHIN EASY ACCESS OF A MINOR.”
New York City:
“THE USE OF A LOCKING DEVICE OR SAFETY LOCK IS
ONLY ONE ASPECT OF RESPONSIBLE FIREARM
STORAGE. FOR INCREASED SAFETY, FIREARMS
SHOULD BE STORED UNLOADED AND LOCKED IN A
LOCATION THAT IS BOTH SEPARATE FROM THEIR
AMMUNITION AND INACCESSIBLE TO CHILDREN AND
OTHER UNAUTHORIZED PERSONS.”
North Carolina:
“IT IS UNLAWFUL TO STORE OR LEAVE A FIREARM
THAT CAN BE DISCHARGED IN A MANNER THAT A
REASONABLE PERSON SHOULD KNOW IS ACCESSIBLE
TO A MINOR.”
Texas:
“IT IS UNLAWFUL TO STORE, TRANSPORT, OR
ABANDON AN UNSECURED FIREARM IN A PLACE
WHERE CHILDREN ARE LIKELY TO BE AND CAN
OBTAIN ACCESS TO THE FIREARM.”
Wisconsin:
“IF YOU LEAVE A LOADED FIREARM WITHIN THE
REACH OR EASY ACCESS OF A CHILD YOU MAY BE
FINED OR IMPRISONED OR BOTH IF THE CHILD
IMPROPERLY DISCHARGES, POSSESSES, OR EXHIBITS
THE FIREARM.”
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Please check with your licensed retailer or state police for
additional warnings which may be required by local law or
regulation. Such regulations change constantly, and local
authorities are in the best position to advise you on such legal
matters.

FIREARMS SAFETY IS YOUR RESPONSIBILITY
SAFETY MUST BE THE FIRST AND CONSTANT
CONSIDERATION OF EVERY PERSON WHO HANDLES
FIREARMS AND AMMUNITION


https://ruger-docs.s3.amazonaws.com/...s/srSeries.pdf

[Teallaura]

My handgun has about 6 pages of warnings..


State-By-State Warnings
Certain states require by law that their own specified warning
notices in larger-than-normal type be conspicuously included by
the manufacturer, distributor or retailer with firearms sold in that
state. Sturm, Ruger & Co., Inc. sells its products in compliance
with applicable laws and regulations. Because our products may
be sold in these states, we include the following:

California:
“Children are attracted to and
can operate firearms that can
cause severe injuries or death.
Prevent child access by always
keeping guns locked away and
unloaded when not in use. If you
keep a loaded firearm where a
child obtains and improperly uses
it, you may be fined or sent to
prison.”

Connecticut:
“UNLAWFUL STORAGE OF A LOADED FIREARM MAY
RESULT IN IMPRISONMENT OR FINE.”
Florida:
“IT IS UNLAWFUL, AND PUNISHABLE BY
IMPRISONMENT AND FINE, FOR ANY ADULT TO
STORE OR LEAVE A FIREARM IN ANY PLACE WITHIN
THE REACH OR EASY ACCESS OF A MINOR UNDER 18
YEARS OF AGE OR TO KNOWINGLY SELL OR
OTHERWISE TRANSFER OWNERSHIP OR POSSESSION
OF A FIREARM TO A MINOR OR A PERSON OF
UNSOUND MIND.”

Maine:
“ENDANGERING THE WELFARE OF A CHILD IS A
CRIME. IF YOU LEAVE A FIREARM AND AMMUNITION
WITHIN EASY ACCESS OF A CHILD, YOU MAY BE
SUBJECT TO FINE, IMPRISONMENT OR BOTH. KEEP
FIREARMS AND AMMUNITION SEPARATE. KEEP
FIREARMS AND AMMUNITION LOCKED UP. USE
TRIGGER LOCKS.”
Maryland:
“WARNING: Children can operate firearms which may cause
death or serious injury. It is a crime to store or leave a loaded
firearm in any location where an individual knew or should
have known that an unsupervised minor would gain access to
the firearm. Store your firearm responsibly!”
Massachusetts:
“WARNING FROM THE MASSACHUSETTS ATTORNEY
GENERAL: This handgun is not equipped with a device that
fully blocks use by unauthorized users. More than 200,000
firearms like this one are stolen from their owners every year
in the United States. In addition, there are more than a
thousand suicides each year by younger children and
teenagers who get access to firearms. Hundreds more die from
accidental discharge. It is likely that many more children
sustain serious wounds, or inflict such wounds accidentally on
others. In order to limit the chance of such misuse, it is
imperative that you keep this weapon locked in a secure place
and take other steps necessary to limit the possibility of theft
or accident. Failure to take reasonable preventive steps may
result in innocent lives being lost, and in some circumstances
may result in your liability for these deaths.”
“IT IS UNLAWFUL TO STORE OR KEEP A FIREARM,
RIFLE, SHOTGUN OR MACHINE GUN IN ANY PLACE
UNLESS THAT WEAPON IS EQUIPPED WITH A
TAMPER-RESISTANT SAFETY DEVICE OR IS STORED
OR KEPT IN A SECURELY LOCKED CONTAINER.”

New Jersey:
“IT IS A CRIMINAL OFFENSE TO LEAVE A LOADED
FIREARM WITHIN EASY ACCESS OF A MINOR.”
New York City:
“THE USE OF A LOCKING DEVICE OR SAFETY LOCK IS
ONLY ONE ASPECT OF RESPONSIBLE FIREARM
STORAGE. FOR INCREASED SAFETY, FIREARMS
SHOULD BE STORED UNLOADED AND LOCKED IN A
LOCATION THAT IS BOTH SEPARATE FROM THEIR
AMMUNITION AND INACCESSIBLE TO CHILDREN AND
OTHER UNAUTHORIZED PERSONS.”
North Carolina:
“IT IS UNLAWFUL TO STORE OR LEAVE A FIREARM
THAT CAN BE DISCHARGED IN A MANNER THAT A
REASONABLE PERSON SHOULD KNOW IS ACCESSIBLE
TO A MINOR.”
Texas:
“IT IS UNLAWFUL TO STORE, TRANSPORT, OR
ABANDON AN UNSECURED FIREARM IN A PLACE
WHERE CHILDREN ARE LIKELY TO BE AND CAN
OBTAIN ACCESS TO THE FIREARM.”
Wisconsin:
“IF YOU LEAVE A LOADED FIREARM WITHIN THE
REACH OR EASY ACCESS OF A CHILD YOU MAY BE
FINED OR IMPRISONED OR BOTH IF THE CHILD
IMPROPERLY DISCHARGES, POSSESSES, OR EXHIBITS
THE FIREARM.”
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Please check with your licensed retailer or state police for
additional warnings which may be required by local law or
regulation. Such regulations change constantly, and local
authorities are in the best position to advise you on such legal
matters.

FIREARMS SAFETY IS YOUR RESPONSIBILITY
SAFETY MUST BE THE FIRST AND CONSTANT
CONSIDERATION OF EVERY PERSON WHO HANDLES
FIREARMS AND AMMUNITION


https://ruger-docs.s3.amazonaws.com/...s/srSeries.pdf

The ones about the law at least make sense. But it's sad when people can't figure out on their own that ladders and guns are dangerous.

[JimL]

Technically, Jimmy is correct that nobody is currently trying to ban guns, but Democrats have openly expressed their desire to, and there's no doubt that if they ever acquire enough power, they will do it.

False. That just the propaganda being picked up through your tin foil hat.

[JimL]

One of the nice things about being a Christian is that we don't have to live in fear.

Of course, why do you think we invented god in the first place?

[simplicio]

Do localities have the right to defy state and federal laws?

Many argued that localities were overstepping their bounds when the topic was enforcement of immigration laws.

Is the second amendment the hill to stand on for Christians?

[rogue06]

Do localities have the right to defy state and federal laws?

Many argued that localities were overstepping their bounds when the topic was enforcement of immigration laws.

Is the second amendment the hill to stand on for Christians?

I'd answer no to both questions but I can see the left going to the courts to stop it and any decisions they get could then be applied to immigration sanctuary jurisdictions.

[simplicio]

I'd answer no to both questions but I can see the left going to the courts to stop it and any decisions they get could then be applied to immigration sanctuary jurisdictions.

Some Christian conservatives see the second amendment as the ultimate guarantee of the preservation of our liberties, and an example of a Divinely ordained right.

[rogue06]

Some Christian conservatives see the second amendment as the ultimate guarantee of the preservation of our liberties, and an example of a Divinely ordained right.

Those that framed the Bill of Rights definitely saw it, as well as the others enumerated, as being natural or God-given rights so in that way I guess the 2A could be described as "an example of a Divinely ordained right." But then, as I said, so would all of the others.

[Sparko]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, we know, you love your guns. But we love our kids and our grand kids even more. Relax, no one is trying to take your prescious guns away, we're trying to save peoples, particularly kids, lives.

Right no one is trying to take our guns away.

Dems Warn Virginia Sheriffs Refusing To Enforce Gun-Control Laws: We’ll Send In The National Guard


Democratic congressmen from Virginia are threatening sheriffs in their state who have warned they will not enforce harsh state-level gun laws that violate Second Amendment rights, suggesting they could be prosecuted if they are unwilling to resign, that their sheriff’s office could lose funding, or most stridently, that the National Guard be called in to enforce the gun-control measures.

https://www.dailywire.com/news/dems-...ign=benshapiro

[JimL]

Right no one is trying to take our guns away.

Dems Warn Virginia Sheriffs Refusing To Enforce Gun-Control Laws: We’ll Send In The National Guard


Democratic congressmen from Virginia are threatening sheriffs in their state who have warned they will not enforce harsh state-level gun laws that violate Second Amendment rights, suggesting they could be prosecuted if they are unwilling to resign, that their sheriff’s office could lose funding, or most stridently, that the National Guard be called in to enforce the gun-control measures.

https://www.dailywire.com/news/dems-...ign=benshapiro

Really, do you mean to tell me that they are threatening to enforce gun laws, OH MY!

[simplicio]

Those that framed the Bill of Rights definitely saw it, as well as the others enumerated, as being natural or God-given rights so in that way I guess the 2A could be described as "an example of a Divinely ordained right." But then, as I said, so would all of the others.

But just what part is divinely ordained? We have made ownership of automatic weapons near impossible, restrictions on machine guns have been around for nearly a century.

I certainly have not seen any convincing argument that owning an m60 machine gun, 20mm Cannon, or dragon (or Tow) antitank missile is a divinely ordained right, rooted in natural law. Though having my own m2 would be cool.

We have certainly infringed on, and restricted, the right to bear arms, reducing the second amendment to person weapons. Is the right an irreduceable right, as is the rights to guarantee human dignity?