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Mayor Pete Attacks Trump's Faith...

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  • Originally posted by Adrift View Post
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Total_depravity

    Like KingsGambit, I've mostly only ever heard it in connection with Calvinists.
    Ah - yes, certainly familiar with the "total depravity of man" -- just never heard it put the way it was put.

    here is our statement on that...

    III. Man

    Man is the special creation of God, made in His own image. He created them male and female as the crowning work of His creation. The gift of gender is thus part of the goodness of God's creation. In the beginning man was innocent of sin and was endowed by his Creator with freedom of choice. By his free choice man sinned against God and brought sin into the human race. Through the temptation of Satan man transgressed the command of God, and fell from his original innocence whereby his posterity inherit a nature and an environment inclined toward sin. Therefore, as soon as they are capable of moral action, they become transgressors and are under condemnation. Only the grace of God can bring man into His holy fellowship and enable man to fulfill the creative purpose of God. The sacredness of human personality is evident in that God created man in His own image, and in that Christ died for man; therefore, every person of every race possesses full dignity and is worthy of respect and Christian love.

    Genesis 1:26-30; 2:5,7,18-22; 3; 9:6; Psalms 1; 8:3-6; 32:1-5; 51:5; Isaiah 6:5; Jeremiah 17:5; Matthew 16:26; Acts 17:26-31; Romans 1:19-32; 3:10-18,23; 5:6,12,19; 6:6; 7:14-25; 8:14-18,29; 1 Corinthians 1:21-31; 15:19,21-22; Ephesians 2:1-22; Colossians 1:21-22; 3:9-11.
    The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
      It's probably based on the verse in Isaiah that says that our righteous acts are like filthy rags. But that is, of course, talking about someone who is unrepentant (in the context of Isaiah, it's explicitly about Israel who had rebelled against God). I don't think it applies to the Christian who is trying to do God's will.
      In the context of the discussion regarding Buttigieg, I believe he could repent of his sin of living a homosexual life, but I think it's more likely that I'll get bitten by a shark while being struck by lightening while playing baseball on a golf course. If he were to repent, he would be forgiven, ref 1 John 1:9.
      The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by oxmixmudd View Post
        Me too, though the book is not written on either of them yet. Nothing says Trump cant repent, find God, change his ways sometime between now and when he dies. Buttigieg confesses Christ, though it is interesting how the strongest advocates for 'by grace alone' are the most vehement to deny any possibility he's actually a Christian because he acts on his gay attraction, although within a monogamous setting.



        Jim
        Matthew 7:21 “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven.

        I have my doubts about both Buttigieg and Trump. I think both are most likely paying lip service to their faith for political reasons.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Adrift View Post
          I think if you entertain the thought of sexual sin then you're drifting into sinful behavior in exactly the same sense that the heteronormative person can drift into sinful behavior if they entertain the thought of sex with their neighbor's wife. Was it Billy Graham who said something to the effect of "it's not the first glance that gets you, it's the second one." I don't know where the exact crossing point is, but I definitely think wondering about that crossing point misses the point, which is that we should aim for putting on the mind of Christ. We shouldn't be as concerned about what we can get away with as we ought to constantly yearn to reflect Christ's thinking and behavior.

          Ultimately I believe that it's God's desire for his children to be healed and whole, and I don't think that Christians who struggle with homosexual thoughts/desires should stop desiring wholeness, and completeness, anymore than the Christian who struggles with anger, or heterosexual lust.
          I think the line would be between feeling a general attraction for the same sex and indulging in fantasies about having sex with someone you are attracted to. That would spill over into lust.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Sparko View Post
            Matthew 7:21 “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven.

            I have my doubts about both Buttigieg and Trump. I think both are most likely paying lip service to their faith for political reasons.
            And I would go so far to say I think this is more true of Trump than Buttigieg -- we see no evidence at all of Trump attending Church or being involved in a Church community. We DO, however, see Trump addressing issues regarding abortion and religious freedom! And we DO see Buttigieg advocating for both homosexuality and abortion.
            The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
              And I would go so far to say I think this is more true of Trump than Buttigieg -- we see no evidence at all of Trump attending Church or being involved in a Church community. We DO, however, see Trump addressing issues regarding abortion and religious freedom! And we DO see Buttigieg advocating for both homosexuality and abortion.
              President Trump affirmed unborn children as image bearers of God and urged Congress to ban late-term abortions in his second State of the Union speech.

              President Trump, in his State of the Union address, asked asks Democrats and Republicans for unity "to build a culture that cherishes innocent life."

              Trump called for both parties to work together for the good of the country in his address Tuesday night (Feb. 5) to a joint session of Congress and a national television audience. He repeated his requirement, however, of a policy that had helped produce a partial 35-day government shutdown and had delayed the date of his State of the Union speech -- a physical barrier along the Mexican border to prevent illegal immigration.

              Though Democrats and Republicans are deeply divided over abortion, the president asked for unity of effort "to build a culture that cherishes innocent life."

              "And let us reaffirm a fundamental truth: All children -- born and unborn -- are made in the holy image of God," he said
              http://www.bpnews.net/52371/unborn-m...p-tells-nation


              Comment


              • Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                And I would go so far to say I think this is more true of Trump than Buttigieg -- we see no evidence at all of Trump attending Church or being involved in a Church community. We DO, however, see Trump addressing issues regarding abortion and religious freedom!
                In short, pandering to the likes of you. And successfully it seems given that an immoral, lying shyster like Trump gets the Evangelical vote.

                And we DO see Buttigieg advocating for both homosexuality and abortion.
                And quite rightly so, as is agreed by the majority of Christians in the US.
                “He felt that his whole life was a kind of dream and he sometimes wondered whose it was and whether they were enjoying it.” - Douglas Adams.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Leonhard View Post
                  We can all agree on that.
                  Somehow I seriously doubt that Tassman and little jimmy agree.

                  I'm always still in trouble again

                  "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                  "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
                  "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Adrift View Post
                    I wonder if the internet has had that effect on Christianity. More and more it seems that people are leaving their denominational divides, and embracing their commonalities.
                    It seems more a matter of discarding the old denominational divides in favour of new, though significantly fewer, denominational divides.
                    1Cor 15:34 Come to your senses as you ought and stop sinning; for I say to your shame, there are some who know not God.
                    .
                    ⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛
                    Scripture before Tradition:
                    but that won't prevent others from
                    taking it upon themselves to deprive you
                    of the right to call yourself Christian.

                    ⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                      Ah - yes, certainly familiar with the "total depravity of man" -- just never heard it put the way it was put.

                      here is our statement on that...

                      III. Man

                      Man is the special creation of God, made in His own image. He created them male and female as the crowning work of His creation. The gift of gender is thus part of the goodness of God's creation. In the beginning man was innocent of sin and was endowed by his Creator with freedom of choice. By his free choice man sinned against God and brought sin into the human race. Through the temptation of Satan man transgressed the command of God, and fell from his original innocence whereby his posterity inherit a nature and an environment inclined toward sin. Therefore, as soon as they are capable of moral action, they become transgressors and are under condemnation. Only the grace of God can bring man into His holy fellowship and enable man to fulfill the creative purpose of God. The sacredness of human personality is evident in that God created man in His own image, and in that Christ died for man; therefore, every person of every race possesses full dignity and is worthy of respect and Christian love.

                      Genesis 1:26-30; 2:5,7,18-22; 3; 9:6; Psalms 1; 8:3-6; 32:1-5; 51:5; Isaiah 6:5; Jeremiah 17:5; Matthew 16:26; Acts 17:26-31; Romans 1:19-32; 3:10-18,23; 5:6,12,19; 6:6; 7:14-25; 8:14-18,29; 1 Corinthians 1:21-31; 15:19,21-22; Ephesians 2:1-22; Colossians 1:21-22; 3:9-11.
                      We don't sin against god, we do, what we call sinning, against each other, and against our own best interests as a human society. We use the idea of god, satan and religion as a psychological club in order to enforce obedience in those who would otherwise, in their ignorance, disregard their neighbor and their society. What is right and good, what we call morality, isn't simply so because god says so, or because it has some arbitrary objective existence of its own, it is right and good because we have found it to be either in our individual, or in our collective best interests. It is man who created god in his image, not god who created man in his!

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by JimL View Post
                        We don't sin against god, we do, what we call sinning, against each other, and against our own best interests as a human society.
                        Please pick up a dictionary and look up the word "sin" facepalm3.gif

                        I'm always still in trouble again

                        "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                        "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
                        "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Tassman View Post
                          In short, pandering to the likes of you. And successfully it seems given that an immoral, lying shyster like Trump gets the Evangelical vote.
                          As opposed to the lying conniving shyster like Hillary, who, in addition to her wretchedness, would be pro-abortion, yes.

                          And quite rightly so, as is agreed by the majority of Christians in the US.
                          Well, first of all, I want to thank Adrift for doing your homework, as you were so incredibly inept and lazy that you couldn't do it yourself.

                          Secondly, there is a biblical principle that the majority is not always right. Perhaps you remember Joshua and Caleb? How many of the other 10 can you name?

                          In fact, Jesus speaks of the broad way, and the straight and narrow way. Guess which one He favors.

                          “Enter by the narrow gate; for wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to destruction, and there are many who go in by it. Because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it.” Matthew 7:13-14.
                          The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by JimL View Post
                            We don't sin against god....
                            Jimmy, honey, you're the dumbest guy I've ever seen on Tweb - we don't need a theology lesson from the likes of you.
                            The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                              Jimmy, honey, you're the dumbest guy I've ever seen on Tweb - we don't need a theology lesson from the likes of you.
                              Talk about dumb, you took that to be a theology lesson.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by JimL View Post
                                Talk about dumb, you took that to be a theology lesson.
                                Well, it was probably the best you could do, so I was being generous.
                                The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                                Comment

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