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Voter Suppression?

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  • #16
    Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
    Amen!



    Try getting on an airplane with a student ID in a DEMOCRAT state. It's not a "government issued ID".
    I agree. But I notice you carefully do not estimate how many students vote by pretending to be someone else. Why not?

    Comment


    • #17
      Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
      Yeah, I was being facetious -- treating your post with the gravity it deserved.
      I was pointing out that the voter ID laws had nothing to do with fraud and everything to do with voter suppression. If you aren't capable of noticing this, we understand.

      Comment


      • #18
        Originally posted by phank View Post
        I agree. But I notice you carefully do not estimate how many students vote by pretending to be someone else. Why not?
        So it is a hard and almost impossible thing, to go and get a government issue ID card?
        "The man from the yacht thought he was the first to find England; I thought I was the first to find Europe. I did try to found a heresy of my own; and when I had put the last touches to it, I discovered that it was orthodoxy."
        GK Chesterton; Orthodoxy

        Comment


        • #19
          Originally posted by phank View Post
          I was pointing out that the voter ID laws had nothing to do with fraud and everything to do with voter suppression.
          That's a liberal talking point. UNLESS, of course, you're talking about suppressing FRAUDULENT voters.

          If you aren't capable of noticing this, we understand.
          Yuh. You got a frog in your pocket?
          The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

          Comment


          • #20
            Originally posted by phank View Post
            I agree. But I notice you carefully do not estimate how many students vote by pretending to be someone else. Why not?
            I CAREFULLY did not estimate? Sheeeesh
            The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by lilpixieofterror View Post
              So it is a hard and almost impossible thing, to go and get a government issue ID card?
              I noticed Phank CAREFULLY did not estimate how many of these students ALSO have a driver's license or State ID card!
              The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                I noticed Phank CAREFULLY did not estimate how many of these students ALSO have a driver's license or State ID card!
                Most of the students I went to school with had a car and, I would hope, a driver's license to drive that car with.
                "The man from the yacht thought he was the first to find England; I thought I was the first to find Europe. I did try to found a heresy of my own; and when I had put the last touches to it, I discovered that it was orthodoxy."
                GK Chesterton; Orthodoxy

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by lilpixieoferror View Post
                  So it is a hard and almost impossible thing, to go and get a government issue ID card?
                  No, not at all. It's easy. But you might notice (with some effort, admittedly) that the documentation required to GET this ID card is no different from the documentation necessary to vote. In other words, the ID card issued based on the presented documentation simply duplicates that selfsame documentation! Let's say a birth certioficate is sufficient. Should it make a difference if that certification is presented at the polling place, or presented at the courthouse in order to get an ID accepted at the polling place?

                  In actual practice, if you have a drivers license, you're fine. Otherwise, in Republican states you need to jump through some hoops. Not hard, not expensive, just a pain. And who doesn't have a drivers licence today? Why, by PURE coincidence, THOSE people tend to vote for Democrats. Isn't that amazing
                  Last edited by phank; 04-15-2014, 09:24 PM.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Originally posted by lilpixieoferror View Post
                    Most of the students I went to school with had a car and, I would hope, a driver's license to drive that car with.
                    Same here. But of course, that's not the point. FAR more students (and those of the same age) lack drivers licences than the population as a whole. Remember, the Republicans are waging a statistical battle here. If 95% of voters have drivers licences, and only 75% of students have them, this is a statistical edge that MIGHT mean a couple hundred votes.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by phank View Post
                      No, not at all. It's easy. But you might notice (with some effort, admittedly) that the documentation required to GET this ID card is no different from the documentation necessary to vote.
                      You mean the documentation, that many states, have passed to make free for anybody needing an ID card for voting purposes? See phank, I went and looked up these laws back in 2012 when they were coming out and discovered stuff like that. I've had a birth certificate since I was a little girl and I got another one, without much complication, so I'd have two to have one in a lock box in case of a fire or some other event. My husband also had to get one too. We were both able to do this online because we both were born in a different state than where we lived. It didn't take that long or was even that expensive to get both either.

                      In other words, the ID card issued based on the presented documentation simply duplicates that selfsame documentation! Let's say a birth certioficate is sufficient. Should it make a difference if that certification is presented at the polling place, or presented at the courthouse in order to get an ID accepted at the polling place?
                      Ever seen a certified Birth Certificate phank? My guess is you haven't? Of course, you seem to be avoiding the issue. You also need an ID card for many other functions of life anyway. You need one if you ever plan on boarding a plane. You need one if you ever plan on cashing a check at a different bank than you hold an account on. You need one to even open a bank account. Most apartment complexes want a photo ID before you are even shown an apartment. You need an ID card to rent an apartment. It is also always good to have some sort of ID in case something happens to you so the police can quickly get a hold of your family so medical decisions can quickly be made and/or identification, as required. Beside, I've also read that it is estimated that most adults, in most states, have some sort of government Id card anyway. My point? Issues are being made out of nothing, so somebody can score some good political points.

                      In actual practice, if you have a drivers license, you're fine. Otherwise, in Republican states you need to jump through some hoops. Not hard, not expensive, just a pain. And who doesn't have a drivers licence today? Why, by PURE coincidence, THOSE people tend to vote for Democrats. Isn't that amazing
                      Funny how I live in a 'republican state' and I didn't need to jump though any hoops to get myself a drivers license and I had the added complication of being born in a different state. Do you want to try this again or do you just want to keep saying silly things that make almost no sense?
                      Last edited by lilpixieofterror; 04-15-2014, 09:36 PM.
                      "The man from the yacht thought he was the first to find England; I thought I was the first to find Europe. I did try to found a heresy of my own; and when I had put the last touches to it, I discovered that it was orthodoxy."
                      GK Chesterton; Orthodoxy

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by phank View Post
                        Same here. But of course, that's not the point. FAR more students (and those of the same age) lack drivers licences than the population as a whole.
                        Funny, most of the ones at my college had a drivers license.

                        Remember, the Republicans are waging a statistical battle here.
                        That's right because we all know that Republicans are evil master minds plotting on conquering the world.

                        If 95% of voters have drivers licences, and only 75% of students have them, this is a statistical edge that MIGHT mean a couple hundred votes.
                        So 3 out of 4 already have ID cards and the other 1, can easily get one. I guess it is an impossible task to get a friend to take you down to a DMV so you can get an ID card. I'd also consider that the voter turn out sits well below 75% anyway, so that is just something else that was made up on the spot. If somebody is too lazy to go down and get themselves an ID card anyway, I somehow doubt they are going to go and vote.
                        "The man from the yacht thought he was the first to find England; I thought I was the first to find Europe. I did try to found a heresy of my own; and when I had put the last touches to it, I discovered that it was orthodoxy."
                        GK Chesterton; Orthodoxy

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by lilpixieofterror View Post
                          You mean the documentation, that many states, have passed to make free for anybody needing an ID card for voting purposes? See phank, I went and looked up these laws back in 2012 when they were coming out and discovered stuff like that. I've had a birth certificate since I was a little girl and I got another one, without much complication, so I'd have two to have one in a lock box in case of a fire or some other event. My husband also had to get one too. We were both able to do this online because we both were born in a different state than where we lived. It didn't take that long or was even that expensive to get both either.
                          Uh, so? I don't understand your point. You had the necessary documentation to vote. Great. You also, of course, had the necessary document to register to vote. Great. NOW you need an ADDITIONAL document, provided when you produce the first. Why is the additional documentation NOT superfluous, since you need the first to get it anyway, and the first was ALREADY good enough?


                          Ever seen a certified Birth Certificate phank? My guess is you haven't? Of course, you seem to be avoiding the issue. You also need an ID card for many other functions of life anyway. You need one if you ever plan on boarding a plane. You need one if you ever plan on cashing a check at a different bank than you hold an account on. It is also always good to have some sort of ID in case something happens to you so the police can quickly get a hold of your family so medical decisions can quickly be made and/or identification, as required. Beside, I've also read that it is estimated that as many as 97% of adults, in most states, have some sort of government Id card anyway. My point? Issues are being made out of nothing, so somebody can score some good political points.
                          Your very question implies that you are not that stupid.

                          Let's make it as simple as I can. You have documentation X. It's good enough, and you vote. But the law is changed so you need documentation Y to vote. What do you require to get documentation Y? Well, you need X, and that's it. So WHY, if X isn't good enough, is Y good enough? THey are the SAME DAMN THING! The ONLY difference is, you have to make a separate trip to get Y. Could the requirement to make such a trip be important?

                          Funny how I live in a 'republican state' and I didn't need to jump though any hoops to get myself a drivers license and I had the added complication of being born in a different state. Do you want to try this again or do you just want to keep saying silly things that make almost no sense?
                          A drivers licence has been good enough all along. All potential voters with drivers licences have sufficient documentation already. So who does NOT have a drivers license? There actually ARE such people, you know. And how do THOSE people tend to vote? Why, by golly, those lacking drivers licences tend to vote for Democrats! Who would have guessed?
                          Last edited by phank; 04-15-2014, 09:53 PM.

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by phank View Post
                            A drivers licence
                            If you're gonna play a legal expert on Tweb, could you PLEASE spell "license" correctly?
                            The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by lilpixieofterror View Post
                              Funny, most of the ones at my college had a drivers license.
                              To repeat, statistically fewer students have drivers licenses than the population at large. It might only be a couple hundred people. And a couple hundred votes MIGHT decide an election.

                              That's right because we all know that Republicans are evil master minds plotting on conquering the world.
                              Back to reality, Republicans by their own admission were seeking an edge. Edges matter in close elections.

                              So 3 out of 4 already have ID cards and the other 1, can easily get one. I guess it is an impossible task to get a friend to take you down to a DMV so you can get an ID card. I'd also consider that the voter turn out sits well below 75% anyway, so that is just something else that was made up on the spot. If somebody is too lazy to go down and get themselves an ID card anyway, I somehow doubt they are going to go and vote.
                              Good point, for a change. In practice, MOST of those affected by the voter ID laws never voted anyway, so making it harder for them to do something they never did normally didn't affect voting patterns, EXCEPT that a few of them were angry at the attempt to disenfranchise them, and they made extra effort.

                              And so, the post mortems showed that to the extent that Republican efforts to suppress Democratic votes changed anything, they backfired and boosted Democratic turnout. The INTENT to suppress didn't translate into actual suppression.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                                If you're gonna play a legal expert on Tweb, could you PLEASE spell "license" correctly?
                                My bad. I'll try to spell better in the future.

                                Comment

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