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Supreme Court & Unions

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  • #31
    Originally posted by guacamole View Post
    In the long term, sure. The union is there the moment you get fired or falsely accused with representation so that you don't have to do that stuff out of pocket.
    It is very likely that the union will ignore your case in a deal they made to get one of their personal friends their job back. That was so prevalent at Lockheed-Martin here in Georgia that union membership dropped to nearly half of what it was just a decade ago (note, this happened in the late 90s or thereabout so membership may have started to pick back up).

    I'm always still in trouble again

    "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
    "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
    "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

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    • #32
      Originally posted by guacamole View Post
      We've had union teachers fired for all sorts of stuff. The due process is protected by the union so that you can't lose your job over stuff like internal politics and false accusations.
      In New York City unions have made it virtually impossible to fire a teacher -- including some convicted of committing felonies. They literally have buildings set aside for these teachers to go to (since they were already removed from the classroom), sit down and play games on their phone, listen to music, play Sudoku or whatever -- and still collect their check.

      I'm always still in trouble again

      "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
      "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
      "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

      Comment


      • #33
        Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
        In New York City unions have made it virtually impossible to fire a teacher -- including some convicted of committing felonies. They literally have buildings set aside for these teachers to go to (since they were already removed from the classroom), sit down and play games on their phone, listen to music, play Sudoku or whatever -- and still collect their check.
        And we have to remember when a public sector union is negotiating a contract its adversary is us, the citizens. And like with your example in NY (which is a fact) these unions often run counter to the good of a society. Or like what is happening with the teacher strike in West Virginia which is going on right now.
        Last edited by seer; 02-27-2018, 02:11 PM.
        Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

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        • #34
          Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
          It is very likely that the union will ignore your case in a deal they made to get one of their personal friends their job back. That was so prevalent at Lockheed-Martin here in Georgia that union membership dropped to nearly half of what it was just a decade ago (note, this happened in the late 90s or thereabout so membership may have started to pick back up).
          I was UAW 425 for several years. If we didn't go on strike in a given year, they had a huge new year's party with open bar - I don't drink, so I didn't "benefit" from that "benefit", and I really don't care to be around a bunch of people during a "free booze" party.

          When we did go on strike, we received "strike pay" of $42 a week. As OtherCheek would say .. big whoop!
          The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

          Comment


          • #35
            Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
            In New York City unions have made it virtually impossible to fire a teacher -- including some convicted of committing felonies. They literally have buildings set aside for these teachers to go to (since they were already removed from the classroom), sit down and play games on their phone, listen to music, play Sudoku or whatever -- and still collect their check.
            Office Space.jpg
            I DENOUNCE DONALD J. TRUMP AND ALL HIS IMMORAL ACTS.

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            • #36
              Originally posted by seer View Post
              And we have to remember when a public sector union is negotiating a contract its adversary is us, the citizens. And like with your example in NY (which is a fact) these unions often run counter to the good of a society.
              Which is why I think unions served a purpose in time, but somehow have become just as bloated and self-interested as many bloated government agencies. When I was UAW, the emphasis seemed to be on minorities who were pretty much told they could do anything they wanted, and would not be fired, cause the union had their backs.
              The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                It is very likely that the union will ignore your case in a deal they made to get one of their personal friends their job back. That was so prevalent at Lockheed-Martin here in Georgia that union membership dropped to nearly half of what it was just a decade ago (note, this happened in the late 90s or thereabout so membership may have started to pick back up).
                That's about what happens with corrupt unions that don't do what they're supposed to do.
                "Down in the lowlands, where the water is deep,
                Hear my cry, hear my shout,
                Save me, save me"

                Comment


                • #38
                  Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                  In New York City unions have made it virtually impossible to fire a teacher -- including some convicted of committing felonies. They literally have buildings set aside for these teachers to go to (since they were already removed from the classroom), sit down and play games on their phone, listen to music, play Sudoku or whatever -- and still collect their check.
                  This is like legendary stuff--and I mean that in a bad way. There are ways to fire bad teachers. My district has turned out plenty, even with strong union protection.
                  "Down in the lowlands, where the water is deep,
                  Hear my cry, hear my shout,
                  Save me, save me"

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by seer View Post
                    And we have to remember when a public sector union is negotiating a contract its adversary is us, the citizens. And like with your example in NY (which is a fact) these unions often run counter to the good of a society. Or like what is happening with the teacher strike in West Virginia which is going on right now.
                    Those people--who are already on the low end of salary--are being asked to take a net loss in salary. They should be striking.
                    "Down in the lowlands, where the water is deep,
                    Hear my cry, hear my shout,
                    Save me, save me"

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by guacamole View Post
                      That's about what happens with corrupt unions that don't do what they're supposed to do.
                      You repeat yourself.

                      Seriously, back when I was a cop, there was an effort to unionize our police department - we would become part of the Teamsters Union, the most corrupt union at that time.
                      The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                        You repeat yourself.

                        Seriously, back when I was a cop, there was an effort to unionize our police department - we would become part of the Teamsters Union, the most corrupt union at that time.
                        More legendary stuff. The worst or the unions become representations of all unions.
                        "Down in the lowlands, where the water is deep,
                        Hear my cry, hear my shout,
                        Save me, save me"

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by guacamole View Post
                          This is like legendary stuff--and I mean that in a bad way. There are ways to fire bad teachers. My district has turned out plenty, even with strong union protection.
                          Teachers unions would have a lot more credibility if they held their own members to a more reasonable standard -- like, "we'll have your back as long as you don't...."
                          The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Originally posted by guacamole View Post
                            More legendary stuff. The worst or the unions become representations of all unions.
                            How do you know some of the less "notorious" unions aren't just better at hiding their corruption?
                            The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                              Teachers unions would have a lot more credibility if they held their own members to a more reasonable standard -- like, "we'll have your back as long as you don't...."
                              Like.... my union?
                              "Down in the lowlands, where the water is deep,
                              Hear my cry, hear my shout,
                              Save me, save me"

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by guacamole View Post
                                Like.... my union?
                                Kinda like "tax not me and tax not thee - tax that man behind that tree".
                                The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                                Comment

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