Originally posted by Sparko
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Want to argue about politics? Healthcare reform? Taxes? Governments? You've come to the right place!
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Try to keep it civil though. The rules still apply here.
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House Repeals Obamacare
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The system used to work just fine when you could get treatment from your local doctor in exchange for a dozen eggs.
Or have I been watching too much Little House on the Prairie?Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
Than a fool in the eyes of God
From "Fools Gold" by Petra
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Originally posted by Mountain Man View PostThe system used to work just fine when you could get treatment from your local doctor in exchange for a dozen eggs.
Or have I been watching too much Little House on the Prairie?
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Originally posted by Sparko View Postsomewhere along the line the drug companies, hospitals and doctors decided they could hold our lives hostage and charge us whatever they wanted because people will pay anything for their health and well being.
Now even in the case of a monopoly, prices are determined by supply and demand. (A monopoly increases price by reducing supply.)
And if demand is as inelastic as you suggest, then even a small increase in supply would result in greatly lower prices. And thus we could conclude that the government-backed restrictions of supply and competition are causing current prices to be much higher than otherwise.
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Originally posted by Joel View PostWhat we've had for many decades is drug and medical-device patents that provide monopolies enforced by law. And slow and expensive FDA approval requirements (another government enforced monopoly). And a cartel of doctors and hospitals who intentionally reduce supply, enforced by law.
Now even in the case of a monopoly, prices are determined by supply and demand. (A monopoly increases price by reducing supply.)
And if demand is as inelastic as you suggest, then even a small increase in supply would result in greatly lower prices. And thus we could conclude that the government-backed restrictions of supply and competition are causing current prices to be much higher than otherwise.
Like Martin Shkreli, as an extreme case.
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Originally posted by Sparko View Postsomewhere along the line the drug companies, hospitals and doctors decided they could hold our lives hostage and charge us whatever they wanted because people will pay anything for their health and well being.Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom
Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
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I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist
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Originally posted by One Bad Pig View PostA lot of it is because the payments come more from insurance companies or the government than the people obtaining care. Malpractice lawsuits have done their fair share to jack up the price, too - malpractice insurance is expensive, and doctors err on the side of over-testing. And because insurance will pay for it, people don't object too much. If medical costs came straight out of peoples' pockets, they'd be more motivated to a) limit what they're going to pay for and b) shop around to look for the better deal.
and since people are not paying for it and it is their lives they are talking about, and people usually perceive more expensive as "better" they have no incentive to shop around for cheaper. Especially if cheaper means "dying"
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Originally posted by Sparko View Postand since people are not paying for it and it is their lives they are talking about, and people usually perceive more expensive as "better" they have no incentive to shop around for cheaper. Especially if cheaper means "dying"Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom
Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
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I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist
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This article has a graph indicating that the health care cost crisis began around 1965. It shows that prior to 1965, health care prices tracked with inflation, and began rising faster than inflation after 1965.
https://mises.org/blog/how-governmen...e-so-expensive
The article suggests a relation to Medicare/Medicaid, which were passed at that time, which has driven the increase in demand. And then goes into a more detailed history of the health-care industry.
"Nobel Prize-winning economist Milton Friedman wrote that medical price inflation since 1965 has been caused by the rising demand for health-care coupled with restricted supply (Friedman 1992)."
"But the U.S. failed to allow physician supply to respond to meet consumer demand. From 1965 through 1972 the number of newly-licensed U.S. physicians graduated each year from medical schools in the United States and Canada increased from 7455 to 7815 or by only 360 physicians! From 1972 through 1980, this amount gradually doubled but the medical schools became even more restrictive"
A graph is included, showing the increase in medical students accepted ended around 1980. Number of medical students accepted (not applicants) remained flat after 1980. In other graphs I note that the steepest growth in demand and prices has been since about 1980.
So sure, hold supply flat while demand continues to grow (even driven higher by government's direct spending and other intervention), and you have the recipe for a price crisis.
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Originally posted by Joel View PostThis article has a graph indicating that the health care cost crisis began around 1965. It shows that prior to 1965, health care prices tracked with inflation, and began rising faster than inflation after 1965.
https://mises.org/blog/how-governmen...e-so-expensive
The article suggests a relation to Medicare/Medicaid, which were passed at that time, which has driven the increase in demand. And then goes into a more detailed history of the health-care industry.
"Nobel Prize-winning economist Milton Friedman wrote that medical price inflation since 1965 has been caused by the rising demand for health-care coupled with restricted supply (Friedman 1992)."
"But the U.S. failed to allow physician supply to respond to meet consumer demand. From 1965 through 1972 the number of newly-licensed U.S. physicians graduated each year from medical schools in the United States and Canada increased from 7455 to 7815 or by only 360 physicians! From 1972 through 1980, this amount gradually doubled but the medical schools became even more restrictive"
A graph is included, showing the increase in medical students accepted ended around 1980. Number of medical students accepted (not applicants) remained flat after 1980. In other graphs I note that the steepest growth in demand and prices has been since about 1980.
So sure, hold supply flat while demand continues to grow (even driven higher by government's direct spending and other intervention), and you have the recipe for a price crisis.
If a monopoly is allowed to exist no amount of money (or government subsidy) will fix it.Actually YOU put Trump in the White House. He wouldn't have gotten 1% of the vote if it wasn't for the widespread spiritual and cultural devastation caused by progressive policies. There's no "this country" left with your immigration policies, your "allies" are worthless and even more suicidal than you are and democracy is a sick joke that I hope nobody ever thinks about repeating when the current order collapses. - Darth_Executor striking a conciliatory note in Civics 101
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