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Hunter Biden is Baaack!

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  • #46
    Originally posted by Ronson View Post
    It's theater. He won't be convicted and it will generate a lot of media attention.
    The facts of the case aren't really in major dispute as far as I can see. Everyone accepts at this point that the Trump team did a dodgy hush money payment to Stormy Daniels before the election to keep her quiet. (The amusing thing, in hindsight, is that the public knowing Trump had had an affair with a pornstar didn't negatively affect his popularity so the hush money payment was pointless)

    Michael Cohen subsequently pleaded guilty, and did prison time, for doing this crime on behalf of Trump and to aid Trump.

    It seems a bit of an injustice if Michael Cohen (who didn't himself benefit from this crime, which was done for Trump) goes to prison for this crime, but Trump doesn't, given the crime was committed on behalf of, for the benefit of, and with the knowledge of, Trump.

    In Trump's defense the best arguments, IMO are:
    1. Michael Cohen pleaded guilty to 8 crimes at once and did prison time for the combined set of them, and this was only 1 of those crimes (although many of the other crimes were related, e.g. lying to investigators about this crime). So it might be justice for Cohen to go to prison for 8 crimes, but Trump should not necessarily therefore have to go to prison for just 1 crime. So, go for a guilty verdict but a slap on the wrist punishment... maybe sentence him to a spanking by Stormy with the Time Magazine with Trump's picture on it, like Trump likes?

    2. The law apparently isn't actually set up very well to hold Trump guilty for this crime that Cohen committed on his behalf, so the prosecutors are using an "untested" and "novel" legal framework to try and hold Trump accountable for ordering Cohen's crime. Trump might be able to escape legally as a result of this loophole, even if morally he's obviously guilty of ordering Cohen to commit the crime for him. Doubtless if the case is tossed due to this legal loophole, Trump will announce his vindication from the rooftops, even though every single person in the country absolutely knows that he did the crime.
    "I hate him passionately", he's "a demonic force" - Tucker Carlson, in private, on Donald Trump
    "Every line of serious work that I have written since 1936 has been written, directly or indirectly, against totalitarianism and for democratic socialism" - George Orwell
    "[Capitalism] as it exists today is, in my opinion, the real source of evils. I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy" - Albert Einstein

    Comment


    • #47
      Originally posted by Starlight View Post
      Huh? The voice mail is just Joe saying he saw a piece about Hunter in the NY Times and wants to talk. It's not Joe discussing details of Hunter's business dealings.

      Right, so it's a guy of unknown credibility saying that he has information that's bad about Hunter and he alleges that he's given to to some investigators. Obviously this random guy's evidence could be anywhere on the spectrum from he's making it up, to not relevant, to extremely bad for Hunter (or even for Joe).

      But that evidence isn't publicly available, and it isn't from the laptop. So it's a completely separate story.

      Personally I have totally no issue thinking that Hunter Biden might have done some dodgy deals. The guy was a drug addict and had serious life issues. He probably liked to name-drop his father during negotiations too. But unless there's actually concrete evidence that his father was actually involved, it's not very relevant.

      On the subject of fail-sons (and sons in-law) and their dodgy deals, I think the one that really really needs some serious further examination is Kushner and Qatar. Kushner had been looking for a bail-out from his foolish purchase of 666 5th Av in NY and was trying to pressure Qatar to bail him out, and in his role in Donald Trump's administration was majorly involved in middle east policy. The nation of Qatar just so happened to get subjected to a major blockade when they refused to bail Kushner out, and then after the blockade was ended, they bailed Kushner out. It strikes me that it might just be the worst misuse of government power in US history for personal financial gain. It nearly triggered a war in the middle east. I think the Dems dropped the ball badly by not giving that a full investigation. They were too busy focusing on Jan 6th. The Kushner stuff is more politically relevant than the Hunter Biden stuff because Trump actually appointed Kushner to a position in his administration, so he was a political figure.
      But of course, Joe Biden pressuring Ukraine is no big deal
      P1) If , then I win.

      P2)

      C) I win.

      Comment


      • #48
        Originally posted by Diogenes View Post
        But of course, Joe Biden pressuring Ukraine is no big deal
        Given so many things have happened with Ukraine in recent history, you kind of need to be more specific.

        I'm going to take a stab and guess you might be referring to the many years old issue where the Obama administration asked Ukraine to fire a corrupt prosecutor? There didn't seem to be any "there" there. I might be forgetting, but I don't recall Republicans even bothering to investigate it in Trump's 4 years in office, because there was clearly no wrongdoing. Btw, firing one person is clearly orders of magnitude less of a big deal that blockading an entire country and almost starting a war in the middle east.
        "I hate him passionately", he's "a demonic force" - Tucker Carlson, in private, on Donald Trump
        "Every line of serious work that I have written since 1936 has been written, directly or indirectly, against totalitarianism and for democratic socialism" - George Orwell
        "[Capitalism] as it exists today is, in my opinion, the real source of evils. I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy" - Albert Einstein

        Comment


        • #49
          Originally posted by Starlight View Post
          Given so many things have happened with Ukraine in recent history, you kind of need to be more specific.

          I'm going to take a stab and guess you might be referring to the many years old issue where the Obama administration asked Ukraine to fire a corrupt prosecutor? There didn't seem to be any "there" there. I might be forgetting, but I don't recall Republicans even bothering to investigate it in Trump's 4 years in office, because there was clearly no wrongdoing. Btw, firing one person is clearly orders of magnitude less of a big deal that blockading an entire country and almost starting a war in the middle east.
          The threat was to withhold aid if the individual want fired, there's a rather infamous clip of Biden admiring to it.
          P1) If , then I win.

          P2)

          C) I win.

          Comment


          • #50
            Originally posted by Starlight View Post
            Huh? The voice mail is just Joe saying he saw a piece about Hunter in the NY Times and wants to talk. It's not Joe discussing details of Hunter's business dealings.
            The article was about Hunter's business dealings and Joe wanted to discuss it with him. Remember, Joe said afterward that he didn't know anything about his dealings and never spoke to him about them. And again, this is just one instance - it begs the question of how many more were there.

            Right, so it's a guy of unknown credibility saying that he has information that's bad about Hunter and he alleges that he's given to to some investigators. Obviously this random guy's evidence could be anywhere on the spectrum from he's making it up, to not relevant, to extremely bad for Hunter (or even for Joe).
            He said he turned over his evidence to the FBI (the agency hasn't denied it) and that the evidence corroborates the laptop emails from the other end (again, not denied). It is wholly unlikely he's "making that up" and I can't believe he would have bothered corroborating irrelevant communications.

            But that evidence isn't publicly available, and it isn't from the laptop. So it's a completely separate story.
            It is from the laptop. Hunter sent him emails from the laptop and Bobulinski answered them to the laptop. And text messages as well.

            Personally I have totally no issue thinking that Hunter Biden might have done some dodgy deals. The guy was a drug addict and had serious life issues. He probably liked to name-drop his father during negotiations too. But unless there's actually concrete evidence that his father was actually involved, it's not very relevant.

            On the subject of fail-sons (and sons in-law) and their dodgy deals, I think the one that really really needs some serious further examination is Kushner and Qatar. Kushner had been looking for a bail-out from his foolish purchase of 666 5th Av in NY and was trying to pressure Qatar to bail him out, and in his role in Donald Trump's administration was majorly involved in middle east policy. The nation of Qatar just so happened to get subjected to a major blockade when they refused to bail Kushner out, and then after the blockade was ended, they bailed Kushner out. It strikes me that it might just be the worst misuse of government power in US history for personal financial gain. It nearly triggered a war in the middle east. I think the Dems dropped the ball badly by not giving that a full investigation. They were too busy focusing on Jan 6th. The Kushner stuff is more politically relevant than the Hunter Biden stuff because Trump actually appointed Kushner to a position in his administration, so he was a political figure.
            Some major whataboutism there, but I agree it should be investigated.

            Comment


            • #51
              Originally posted by Ronson View Post

              There have been various emails that would take me a while to dig up. This is a voicemail where Joe wants to speak to Hunter about a China business deal. Joe certainly knew about it (evidenced here) although whether or not they spoke later about it is unclear.

              https://nypost.com/2022/06/27/voicem...alings-report/


              https://www.nationalreview.com/news/...e-equity-deal/

              Biden business partner Tony Bobulinski, who was brought in to structure the deal, publicly identified “the Big Guy” as Joe Biden when the emails came to light in the run up to the 2020 election.

              Biden had told Bobulinksi that CEFC was “coming to be MY partner to be partners with the Bidens.” Bobulinksi told the press that Hunter had made millions off of China deals.
              IIRC, there are several emails referencing old Joe meeting Hunter and/or his brother James and some of their business partners for lunch and maybe a golf outing.

              I'm always still in trouble again

              "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
              "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
              "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

              Comment


              • #52
                Originally posted by Starlight View Post
                Huh? The voice mail is just Joe saying he saw a piece about Hunter in the NY Times and wants to talk. It's not Joe discussing details of Hunter's business dealings.
                An interesting way to describe the voicemail

                Source: Voicemail indicates Joe Biden knew of Hunter deals with ‘spy chief of China’


                Joe Biden called his son Hunter in late 2018 to discuss a New York Times article detailing the younger Biden’s dealings with a Chinese oil tycoon accused of economic crimes — telling him, “I think you’re clear,” according to a report Monday.

                The voicemail, discovered on a cellphone backup contained on Hunter Biden’s infamous discarded laptop, would appear to contradict President Biden’s continued denial that he ever talked with his disgraced 52-year-old son about his overseas business transactions — and was aware they could be improper.

                “Hey pal, it’s Dad,” Joe Biden said, the Daily Mail reported. “It’s 8:15 on Wednesday night. If you get a chance, just give me a call. Nothing urgent. I just wanted to talk to you.”

                Biden then made his intentions clear.

                “I thought the article released online, it’s going to be printed tomorrow in the Times, was good,” Biden continued. “I think you’re clear. And anyway if you get a chance, give me a call, I love you.”

                During a campaign appearance in Iowa in September 2019, Joe Biden said, “I have never spoken to my son about his overseas business dealings.” His former press secretary, Jen Psaki, and his chief of staff, Ron Klain, have both repeatedly echoed that sentiment.

                The unearthed voice message renewed calls for a probe of the now-president’s handling and knowledge of his son’s overseas dealings.

                “Joe Biden said he ‘never spoke’ with Hunter about his business dealings. That is simply not true. We need to know what Joe Biden knew and when he knew it,” Rep. Elise Stefanik (R-NY), the No. 3 Republican in the House of Representatives, told The Post Monday.

                “This voicemail is just the tip of the iceberg when it comes to the evidence mounting against the Biden Crime Family. When Republicans take back Congress, we will use our congressional power of oversight to uncover the truth for every American as a matter of national security.”

                The Biden voicemail followed a Times report on Dec. 12, 2018, detailing Hunter’s dealings with Ye Jianming, a “fast-rising” Chinese oil tycoon who headed CEFC China Energy Company in 2016 before being arrested two years later amid allegations of economic crimes.

                [...]


                Source

                © Copyright Original Source











                I'm always still in trouble again

                "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
                "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

                Comment


                • #53
                  Originally posted by Ronson View Post
                  The article was about Hunter's business dealings and Joe wanted to discuss it with him.
                  What Joe says he wants to discuss is the fact that there had been an article that had made Hunter look good. It doesn't imply anything more nefarious than "Hey man, I saw you in the news! Awesome!"

                  Remember, Joe said afterward that he didn't know anything about his dealings and never spoke to him about them.
                  Yep, and this call in no way proves that that wasn't true.

                  He said he turned over his evidence to the FBI (the agency hasn't denied it)
                  As far as I can tell, many people give many things to the FBI on all sorts of issues, and we subsequently never hear anything about the subject again. The FBI seems to mostly be a black hole.

                  It is from the laptop. Hunter sent him emails from the laptop and Bobulinski answered them to the laptop. And text messages as well.
                  No, if it had been from the laptop, the NY Post would have had them and written a story about them. The Bobulinski article talks about how he gave other information to the FBI that wasn't on the laptop with the implication being that the incriminating stuff wasn't on the laptop.
                  "I hate him passionately", he's "a demonic force" - Tucker Carlson, in private, on Donald Trump
                  "Every line of serious work that I have written since 1936 has been written, directly or indirectly, against totalitarianism and for democratic socialism" - George Orwell
                  "[Capitalism] as it exists today is, in my opinion, the real source of evils. I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy" - Albert Einstein

                  Comment


                  • #54
                    Originally posted by Dimbulb View Post

                    TYT is by far the most anti-corruption outlet in US media, and they viciously critique liberal corruption weekly if not daily, just as they do conservative corruption. If the Hunter Biden laptop took down Joe, they would like that, because they're not fans of Joe. But there's just not any serious corruption story in the laptop, so they stick to things that are actually real.
                    Maybe if you pulled your head out of the rotten Young Turks trough and got some fresh once in a while, you would have a more well informed perspective.
                    Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
                    But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
                    Than a fool in the eyes of God


                    From "Fools Gold" by Petra

                    Comment


                    • #55
                      Originally posted by Dimbulb View Post
                      According to one of those 5 people who spoke to the media about it: The company allegedly subsequently made no money as the deal it was to be involved in never eventuated, and Joe Biden never knew about it.

                      Research by the media in general on Hunter's business dealings shows that the vast majority of attempted deals he tried to make never panned out. He didn't seem to be very good at his consulting business.
                      By all accounts, the Biden Crime Family made millions by bartering Joe's political capital for financial gain, and Joe was well aware of and profited from these arrangements.

                      But let's suppose what you say is true, that every one of Joe and Hunter's schemes fell through. The fact that they even tried is a crime in and of itself.
                      Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
                      But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
                      Than a fool in the eyes of God


                      From "Fools Gold" by Petra

                      Comment


                      • #56
                        Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                        IIRC, there are several emails referencing old Joe meeting Hunter and/or his brother James and some of their business partners for lunch and maybe a golf outing.
                        There are, I just forget the details now. This is old news (2 years) for most people unconnected from the MSM. Some of the Bobulinski stuff I caught in YouTube videos, others were in written form.

                        Comment


                        • #57
                          Originally posted by Starlight View Post
                          What Joe says he wants to discuss is the fact that there had been an article that had made Hunter look good. It doesn't imply anything more nefarious than "Hey man, I saw you in the news! Awesome!"
                          That's a spin.

                          Yep, and this call in no way proves that that wasn't true.

                          As far as I can tell, many people give many things to the FBI on all sorts of issues, and we subsequently never hear anything about the subject again. The FBI seems to mostly be a black hole.
                          Well, I can't argue with that. They supposedly confiscated the laptop 2 years ago and would start an investigation. In political-ese, an "investigation" means several years of nothing that results in nothing.

                          No, if it had been from the laptop, the NY Post would have had them and written a story about them. The Bobulinski article talks about how he gave other information to the FBI that wasn't on the laptop with the implication being that the incriminating stuff wasn't on the laptop.
                          That's just the one article. If you're patient I'll try hunting for more links when I get the time, or you can look for yourself. The Bobulinski connection has more meat to it than this.

                          Comment


                          • #58
                            Originally posted by Ronson View Post
                            Well, I can't argue with that. They supposedly confiscated the laptop 2 years ago and would start an investigation. In political-ese, an "investigation" means several years of nothing that results in nothing.
                            Didn't the FBI claim they "lost" the laptop shortly after taking possession of it?
                            Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
                            But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
                            Than a fool in the eyes of God


                            From "Fools Gold" by Petra

                            Comment


                            • #59
                              Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post

                              Didn't the FBI claim they "lost" the laptop shortly after taking possession of it?
                              That's my memory of it. When asked where the laptop is, Christopher Wray said he didn't know.

                              Comment


                              • #60
                                Oh, here's the laptop ...



                                That actually looks a little like the warehouse at Bass Pro. It's huge.

                                Comment

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